britannia is led astray

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[img][800:498]http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d139/subzero2006/monsters_zps70a84584.jpg[/img]

Maybe Britain should become the 51st State (and Canada the 52 nd)

ruveyn

If the U.K. became our 51st state, then that would mean we'd have to take both Ulster and Scotland, right?

Congress sets the rules to admit states. I'm pretty sure some provences in Canada would'nt be happy to be admitted as one state.

Er... can I answer that?

a) Why would we be in "outer darkness" if we left the EU? This is just propaganda put about by Europhiles. Countries outside the EU aren't in "outer darkness" and neither would we be if we left. We'd still have a very close relationship with the EU member states, but we would be able to govern our own affairs rather than being run by a foreign institution in Brussels. I can't see anything negative about this.

b) Why do we need to be a part of the EU or grovel to the U.S.? We can trade with anyone we feel like once we leave the EU (and we're not joining the EEA either, like the situation Norway is in, which was meant as a temporary arrangement that was brought in during the early 1990s). All most EU withdrawalists want is to be a free, sovereign nation basically minding its own business. We're happy to trade with the EU too, but we just don't want to be a member of an expensive centralised club. Essentially, wanting EU withdrawal is about the right for self government. Britons are being taxed to be a part of a club they don't want to be a part of.

c) I don't see anything wrong with repealing the Human Rights Act if it runs contrary to British law. There is no reason why we should listen to their corrosive judgements. The HRA was originally a great idea, but it's now used and abused for purposes it was never intended for - i.e. protecting foreign terrorists and other criminal scum.

d) I don't want the UK to have a Norway-type relationship with the EU. Also, the "Nazi gold" thing is a slur on the Swiss. It is a very rich, well-developed country in its own right, with strong banking, agricultural and manufacturing sectors of its own. In fact, it is the richest country in Europe and more than 80% of the Swiss in the last opinion poll I saw do not want to be in the EU. In fact, of the eleven parties in the Swiss Federal Assembly, only a single one (the Social Democrats) call for EU membership because it's extremely unpopular in the country. I wouldn't mind being Switzerland, but I think we could negotiate a better deal with the EU than the Swiss have.

e) Diplomatic irrelevance? We are subordinate to the EU. We aren't "Europhobes", we just dislike the EU and want to leave the club with a nice free trade deal whilst retaining close relationships with EU members (though I suspect the whole thing will fall apart if the UK leaves, as other countries will want what the UK has done - look at Finland, or Denmark, or the Netherlands, or even Austria). It's like calling all Irish nationalists "anti-British" - it's just an insult and isn't true.

f) None of the populations of any country outside the EU want to join. And they don't want to join by a large margin. Iceland doesn't want to join because they know they will lose their fishing rights, the Norwegians don't want to join because they know that it's an anti-democratic mess and will cost them dearly and the Swiss don't want to join because it will lead to the end of Swiss independence.

Here's a lengthy discussion on a Danish radio programme called Europe i Flammer (Europe in Flames). It's a radio series, hosted by Dan Jørgensen of the centre-left Social Democrats and Morten Messerschmidt of the national conservative anti-EU Danish People's Party. In this segment of a recent show, they have a debate with two UK MEPs from their respective European Parliament groups (the Socialists & Democrats and the Europe of Freedom and Democracy Group respectively) - Arlene McCarthy, who is a Belfast-born Labour Party MEP for the North West of England and Roger Helmer, a UKIP (former Conservative) MEP for the South East of England:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pC9ivu7Wuds[/youtube]

Last edited by Tequila on 13 Jan 2013, 12:27 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Actually, I think it'd be kinda nice to have the U.K. join the U.S. - it would certainly class things up around here!

Except for all of those spotted dicks and toads-in-the-hole, of course.

We have nice fa***ts over here. Perhaps we can introduce you to them?

I'd as soon crimp a biggie in me mum's garden than get dicky over some fa***ts.

I like fa***ts. Not Mr. Brains though. They're disgusting and don't taste like the real thing.

I'd love clapshot as well. Or champ.

American Indians are popular over here.

What diplomatic relevance does the UK gain being in the EU? I would think it would be the opposite. Your giving your away diplomatic relevancy so some weirdo from Belgium has relevancy.

I also don't see how the UK would be groveling to the US, do you grovel to the EU? As an American if the roles were reversed, I would certainly rather have a closer relationship with the UK or Canada than I would Mexico or Brazil since we share a common heritage.

Cameron and Clegg are awful. Britain is better off with the pound than with the euro. Had Britain the euro Cameron would have probably shrunk the economy by 20% by now.

Commonwealth Economic Union? Then the UK can trade off the strengths of the Canadian and Australian economies...

I don't see what is wrong with not having the European Human Rights Act. America doesn't. Canada doesn't. South Africa doesn't. Most countries don't, but that doesn't mean they're wretched hives of scum and villainy...

The UK is still very powerful diplomatically without the EU; not on par with America, yes, but then again who is? We have a seat on the security council, we're the country which is at the centre of the Commonwealth (don't deny it, it wouldn't be the Commonwealth without the UK), our daughter nations are numerous (America, S. Africa, New Zealand, Canada...)...

The UK doesn't need Europe, except as a trading partner.

Or India's. Or Singapore's.

Where is the evidence that any other Commonwealth nations are interested in such an agreement?

Where is the evidence that the UK could negotiate access to other member nations markets on favorable terms?

I never said they would be. Free trade with the Commonwealth is a good start, though. They generally get on with us and we all speak the same language.

The idea is that Britain should become a global country again, as it was historically, and not just a European one.

We have to look at other markets anyway - the EU market is declining every single year (and much of that which is counted as being "sold to EU countries" in fact isn't, but is just sent to EU ports for transshipment to non-EU countries).