God doesn't seem to exist!

Post Reply New Topic

Nothing unseen exists unless you believe in it.

Well.. like 'i' said;
'you' cannot fathom
the responsibility 'i' have..


Obviously.

And true, without the ability to believe;

Not much really
exists...

That's sad;
beyond emotions
and senses....

Please try again, but with coherent thought this time.



Love is detectable in the brain activity and brain chemistry of the affected person. It may not be the romantic ephemeral magic that you imagine it to be, but it has the benefit of both being true, and being perfectly explicable by natural means.

Sorry Catty, no sale. You don't get to point to the natural world and say "this is beautiful, therefore my personal genie did it"

To say nothing of the idea of personal proofs. Either admit that the question isn't important to you, or at least refrain from insulting those to whom it is by pretending that you've already settled the question. <-(not intended to be as harsh as it sounds)

Ha! Same response to you as pucuser my 'little man'..;$

EXCUSE me?? I most certainly DO get to point to the natural world, and say whatever I want!! I was making a statement about MYSELF, and addressing the OP----NO WHERE did I say this is what YOU should believe!!

As for "pretending I've already settled the question"----AGAIN, I don't recall your saying "PROVE it to me", and my saying: "HERE'S the proof!" Get-down off your high-horse----until I say: "Wolfram87, blah, blah, blah"----or, quote you, as I have done here----don't assume I'm addressing you, PERSONALLY!!

Also, don't call me "Catty"----how DARE you take such liberties----I don't "know" you!! You haven't been here long enough, IMO, to be talking to aghogday, like that, EITHER----or anybody else, for that matter!!

Facebook Like 1

For top ten common sense posts..

No, madam, you were making a statement about the natural world. You said "For ME, the existence of trees, stars, insects, etc., etc., etc., is proof-enough, that God exists!". Do note the word "proof", not "makes me believe", hence my complaint about personal proofs. A thing cannot be proven to you, and then not be true for the next person.
As for the trees, stars and insects, I'm certain dendrologists, astronomers and entomologists (among whom I count myself, on a hobby basis) are going to be somewhat miffed when you dismiss their life's work studying the development of their respective subject with "Nope, magic!".





You brought up proof yourself, ma'am, I didn't have to. As for adressing me personally, this is an open forum and this is a thread on a topic I'm passionate about, so when you offer up your rather dismissive "trees therefore God, argument settled" line, I find myself inclined to rebut.




I was going for friendly, not patronizing, because you seemed like a nice person in some other threads. I didn't mean to insult you. As for how I dare, I suspect you will find me quite brave if that's an indication of your threshold. Though, I find it curious to be told to "get off my high horse" by someone who uses phrases such as "how DARE you take such liberties" and "EXCUSE me??". And my reply shall simply be this: no madam. On this subject, I am quite well versed, I enjoy the arguments and I enjoy the opportunity for research it normally brings about, as well as exercising my logic and reasoning skills. So when Mr. Aghogday jumps in and explains that God exists because he can leg press half a tonne and misquotes Einstein in a long rant of slogans that sounds like he's someones over-enthusiastic personal trainer, I do feel justified in saying that his writings lack cohesion, because they objectively do.
As for having been here long enough, I have been here for years before, I'm just under a new name because my other account was bound to a hotmail adress now lost in the sands of time. But just out of curiosity; how long does one have to be here before speaking plainly is acceptable?

Dude if you have common sense you will realize there is science and art. One must have both to come close to understanding God.

I'm not sorry that your half a pie is not enough.

To see deeper is to 'know' deeper.

Sticking to just what you learn in school is not NEARLY enough.

If I were to credit god for a beautiful girl's existence, would I not have to credit god for someone born with severe facial deformities?

If we happen to find an old painting, and we don't know who the artist is.. We don't simply make one up. We keep searching until we find the real artist, or until we give up, and decide it will be labeled as "unknown". Christianity assuming to have all of the answers, is an insult to scientists who dedicate their lives to working on finding those answers.

As for my background... Preacher's kid, went to church three times a week, christian school, church camp... Maybe I disbelieve because I have been taught too well?

I fail to see the beauty in a religion that brainwashes it's children into believing that those who are not christian are bad people. If someone had told this beautiful girl that she was ugly and stupid, throughout her childhood, most would consider that to be a form of abuse. But then you would encourage that she be taken to church as a small child, to be taught that she's evil and sinful and needs to repent.

I'm sorry, but these aren't good messages. They don't have a positive impact on the world. If the christian god is real, I will not be sorry that I didn't follow him. I would rather take my place in hell than follow something that cruel. In any other book or movie, the character of satan would be the good guy. But because it's drilled in to everyone's minds from birth, that god is good, and god is love, then people don't seem to question who the real villain is.

The things that satan did in the bible were not bad. He is guilty of teaching people to think and not blindly follow. In the entire book, there isn't a single record of him of him killing anyone. Yet there is scripture after scripture that states that god killed people. The flood, the killing of the first born children in Egypt, Soddom and Gammorah, Onan for refusing to impregnate his dead brother's wife..

I am not into devil worship. I don't believe in god or satan. But I do know who I see as being the fictional villain... and it isn't satan.

Thanks, aghogday!

Many people appreciate both science and art, and still do not believe in god. Art is created by people, not god. I fail to see the connection.

Unless you are trying to say that god is a fictional character, created by man. Then I would agree with you.

I would also say that sticking to what you learn in both church and school, is not enough, either. There are many different religions, all believing that they are the only ones who are correct.

Art and God are human abstract constructs.

Both are three letter words
used to describe whatever humans
define as essence of truth.

Nature is GOD; that's not a new idea; that's the oldest
religious idea that exists, my friend. The first Egyptian
God MIN is representative of the fertility aspect of the
Nature of GOD, as manifest in human being.
Fertility is a big deal, when humans must
reproduce to make enough folks to make
a village big enough to make subsistence
a working solution to live, per the sweat of the brow;
and the work of the night; otherwise known as having sex.

Stuff gets more complicated after that; and generally speaking
that starts with a prehensile thumb; some sticks and sand;
copying connections of nature including imaginary connections
between stars of skies; and to be clear not dreams; just imaging
connections in lines between actual stars to make 'sacred' geometrical
shapes that will one day become buildings as well; and stuff like that.

And yes; that stuff eventually becomes a sanskrit alphabet, written
language, collective intelligence, and religion/culture in attempts
to share stuff to help make folks lives better in making subsistence
a reality for overall survival. Then eventually folks get 'fat' and happy;
and then there are folks who wanna sit on their butt and let stronger
folks do all the work; and yeah wives still love the 'construction, firemen,
and garden workers', then; so ya gotta put a stop to that; by keeping the
wives all in order by suggesting that lust is a bad thing; instead of A
now scientifically understood originator of human creativity
and productivity,
in general..

So yeah, fire and brimstone is a cure for 'girls gone wild'...

And boys gone 'fat', like chubby domesticated worms
with no more guns (biceps), and general virility
to get the 'work of the night, done.

Anyway; that part hasn't changed much, as some
research still suggests that even with birth control;
around 25% of birth certificate fathers ain't the
biological sperm thing.

God and or Nature wins tHe game of life most
often with illusory religious fears or not;
GOD IS KING; yes, nature is king and queen;
Same stuff of truth; always
now.

Art starts as human dance and human dance
is manifest from Nature aka God manifest
in human; therefore GOD is art, as ART
manifest as human being in dance.

First there is dark; then light;
then movement aka
Dance; then there is
sound aka music
to fuel the dance
of movement in
infinity loop
of now;

So to make little abstract words
to attempt to metaphor reality;
is a nice hobby; but to dance
free in the innate instinctual
intuitive way of movement,
as ART, is to tRuly reflect
God of Nature and
can be described as
the metaphor
of
DIVINE.

Truly, to reflect nature
like the planets revolving
around respective suns;
is to live in mind and body
balance in the same golden
spiral phi flow of movement in dance
that planets, suns, and galaxies do as
the movement of now. And on top of that;
our ancestors move this way to stay invisible;
escaping predator and capturing prey to stay
alive in mind and body balance through much
greater physical intelligence in regulating emotions,
integrating senses, and increasing cognitive executive
functioning, by way of enhancing focus and short term
working memory.

All the secrets of bliss/nirvana in the animal homeostasis of the
heaven of now, are not secrets at all for folks who remember
their innate instinctual and intuitive 'eyes' of GOD aka Nature,
once
again,
Manifest as human being, cats, dogs, and even the electrons
spiraling nucleuses of stones and a grain of sand.

I tried to explain to a fundamentalist Christian tonight
in Super-Walmart that Jesus is no greater than a grain
of sand; after he told me if I didn't believe he is the
king of the Universe; I ain't gonna make the grade.

And Oh yeah; I give him the run down on how
Roman Emperor Constantine and his
Catholic Cohort friends, in 325 AD,
promote the Yogi/Naturist
leaning gnostic Jesus; 'who'
is 'uncovered' in Egypt
in 1959;
as verses 38 to
114, in the Gnostic
Gospel of Thomas;
to the King of the frigging
Universe that is much smaller
then, without the eyes of science, now.

I tell him Jesus turns the promotion
down from the 'grave of words', in
the Gnostic Gospel of Thomas,
by Jesus
or NOT.

Trust me or NOT;
IF the real dude
Jesus is here today;
'he' will tell that dude,
give me a break;
GOD is a grain of
sand and I am no
greater than
a grain of
sand;
similar electrons
similar nucleuses;
tHere is NO separation,
in either God or
NATURE, AS SANE
AND
SAME..

There are many definitions for both words, but neither seem to be your definitions.

Art: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/art

God: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/god




An idea being old, has never meant that it's a good idea. Times have also changed, drastically. Reproduction isn't needed anymore. People have kids either because they want them, or by accident, now. In some places, reproduction is now even limited by law, because of overpopulation. Physical labor is also not as needed as it once was. Yes, it is still needed, and these jobs are very important. But you aren't required to sweat all day for your job, if you don't want to. There are other options.. Options that very much benefit society. I'm sorry, I had to laugh when you mentioned sex, as if anyone's sex life is anyone else's business. Some people may never get laid. They might not like that they never do, but morally speaking, that's really okay.

What I'm getting at here... Is that having a family and working hard to support them.. and making love to your wife every night.. is really a good, honorable thing. But choosing another path, can also be a good, honorable thing. There's no righteousness involved in choosing to live that way. It is, very simply, a personal choice.



This is simply the creative mind, coming up with new ideas. All artists and designers have that, religious or not. I do 3d art for a living. My creativity has never failed me. And I will not give a fictitious god credit for my work.



You do know that you can be both fat and productive, right?

I understand taking pride in a physically strong body. You work hard for it, you should be proud of it. But it makes you no better than those who use their brains and/or artistic skills. We're all different, and again, that's okay. If it weren't for all different types of people with different capabilities, then the world would look very different now.

I think that your idea of what a woman is, is somewhat distorted. First off, a woman is a human.. Capable of her own thoughts, desires, accomplishments. She doesn't need a man. Some don't even want a man. And yes, some women are attracted to firemen and all that... Some aren't. Some are attracted to fatter men, or skinnier men, or geekier men.. Some are attracted to other women.. And some even have no desire to be with anyone at all. And it's just crazy how the bible has been in existence for over 2000 years, and yet women still cheat on their husbands. I'm not an expert, but I don't think that religion is doing much to keep women in line... Or anyone, for that matter.

As always, people will do exactly what they want. And if they are religious, they will find a way to justify their actions and if all else fails, they'll get by on the fact that god forgives everyone, and you can still get into heaven, no matter what you've done, as long as you repent.

So fire and brimstone is a cure for nothing. All I've ever seen it do is infiltrate young, impressionable minds, who actually believe it to the fullest, and grow up to have very real issues because of it.. such as Shirley Phelps.

And boys gone 'fat', like chubby domesticated worms
with no more guns (biceps), and general virility
to get the 'work of the night, done.

You still make me laugh with this. Another's sex life isn't your business. You can't possibly know what they are doing. It sounds like you have a lot of insecurity issues, so you try to bring others down, in order to cover up your own. I do get that. I've been there myself. Not one of the greater things I've done in my life.

I'm not sure what kind of sex you are having, but most of us can handle it without huge biceps. Also, I don't know if you've noticed or not, but often, fat women end up marrying fat men. It isn't always that way. But it does happen a lot. Or couples tend to get fat together. Either way.. it's still not our business. If one partner has a problem with the way the other is changing, it's between them to discuss. It might also result in cheating and/or divorce. Religious beliefs don't stop that from happening anymore.



Thank you for proving my point that religion doesn't "keep women in line".



If this were true, the world would have far less problems. And if god were never wrong, he wouldn't need to go back and correct his mistakes by killing people in the bible.



Dancing is a form of art. So you have that part backwards. I would, however, agree that god is art, but not that art is god. God was created by man.. he's been written about, painted, sculptured, there are songs about him.. Yes, I do think that he could be considered to be many different pieces of art. Pieces of art, in which people use their own perception, to paint him to be what they would like for him to be, which oddly enough, always turns out to be something just a little different from the others. Which would make it less likely that anyone really sees him or hears him. If everyone who claimed to have heard or seen him, actually did, then I'd say that god has a great sense of humor and really likes to mess with people.



Like when Miley does the twerk.



How far back are we going? Because my ancestors slaughtered my other ancestors because of the forced christian conversions done to the Native Americans.



I'm really confused with this last part. Nature is vastly huge. It actually is all around us and does many things that are out of our control. It helps to provide us not only with food, but with air and medicines, our homes and even provide us with jobs.. It tends to mess with our allergies and make us sick sometimes.. Sometimes it's a cruel b***h and sends a tornado or a hurricane to wipe out certain areas... I would say that nature is a lot of things that religion claims that god is, tho not enough to claim that nature and god are the same.

If you believe that nature and god are the same, then how can you say that god is like a grain of sand, when nature, very clearly, is much larger than that? Nature is much larger than all of us.

The thing that I find comforting in nature being in control.. Is that nature never promised to love us and take care of us. Never told us that we were like children to it.. Never told us that we could pray to it, and receive what we ask for, if we just believe.. It allows us to have this life, and only this life, while indiscriminately killing us off. It offers no promises that it can't pay up. It doesn't threaten us with eternal torture if we don't do what it tells us... It just lets us live here, and gives most of us the chance to at least try to be happy.

It's never seemed to care what our religion, age, gender, sexuality, race, or class is. It somehow still manages to show us all what our place in the world really is, and just how meaningless and powerless we all are. It doesn't build itself on the fact that humans are gullible, conceited, selfish, and mean... If we all stepped back, away from the rigid rules, of a brainwashed society, and simply learned to live and let be.. Then we'd all be that much more capable of finding ways to be happy.. Or at least more relaxed. Instead, we're here in 2015, still arguing about separation of church and state.. Watching as gay marriage laws just now start to get passed, while the right to discriminate laws come up right behind it. At what point do we put down the old scriptures, and decide that if what our neighbor is doing isn't hurting us, then it's okay?

Nobody is evil or less moral because of lack of religion. They never have been. I find it sad that so many religions teach children, from birth, to discriminate so harshly.

HA! I think you missed the meaning of the wink icon at the end of all that; friend.

This is a little metaphor, a little poetic expression, and just a quick run down on the history of reality as it comes to now; and yes this too.

It's not a science project. It is ART. To understand God is to have a creative mind; and not just in 3d techno stuff.

Not that that's not art; it just doesn't include flesh and blood connecting life (not online stuff); and is restricted to mechanical cognition.

Life inherently is feeling and sensing 'stuff'; and truly thinking in abstract terms is a 'new age brain thing' for neocortical control limited to a few animals here and there, on earth, including homo-sapiens.

Never the less, the only innate intellect humans are born with, as far as communication, is verbal and non-verbal language; none of this written down collective intelligence stuff that makes most everyone all uptight and anxious about life.

Nature as God is still widely practiced in all forms of pantheism, and in pantheism the Universe is GOD; in other forms, God is the seen and unseen; but never the less, God is the 'WHOLE ENCHILDA', including a grain of sand manifest as the same GOD of all that is.

And yes; the Gnostic Gospel of Jesus definitely indicates he is a pantheist; not really different than Spinoza and Einstein, in broad and narrower terms, per just one example of foreskin is provided by God and humans take it away falsely as a product of religious out-of-whack beliefs, and such as that.

If the real Gnostic Jesus Dude really lives back then, he has amazing street (Nature) smarts for a 'semi-rabbi' dude, with just a little satire added in there, with all due respect to my 'many' Jewish friends..

And trust me; I am the most open minded liberal person you will ever come across; and hell yeah, I can prove that in flesh and blood easily on my blogs, in irrefutable evidence.

Just 'cause I'm writing about the history of narrow minded patriarchy in puns and metaphors, and a little satire to make fun of it the way it deserves to be made fun of; certainly does not mean I condone ANY PART OF IT.

BUT AGAIN, that is what the wink is for, at the bottom of the post.

I used to put in parentheses (metaphor alert) and started to think that might be a little condescending; but perhaps
a wink is not enough to clearly indicate PLEASE DON'T TAKE what I am saying literally.

Some Autistic folks are very much black and white thinkers, in literal style of expressing themselves as well,
with little emotional affect in written words or flesh and blood life.

And some are literally and metaphorically the human archetype of empath; and that's what I am friend; don't judge a book by a cover. if you see a big man who looks like an 'FBI agent' who can leg press 930LBS, 14 times slowly with their hands raised over their head as a 'narrow minded jock'. The women love me; but it's cause I'm a nice dancer; not one to take them home... hmm.. if you haven't heard that I am literally considered a dance legend in real life, in my metro area; that also belies my law enforcement/military looking 230LB muscular exterior.. smiles..

But anyway, Nature is the same dam thing as GOD to me; seen and unseen; and the first thingy about art and god and abstract concepts up there, is just a general statement about any metaphor in life.

It's up to 'us' to create our reality; with the help of the GOD of Nature; all natural of course..

And if you cannot see Nature as art; trust me something is missing in your life; whether you as an
individual can see that or not; but I am assuming you can see Nature as ART and just can't see
Nature as GOD; and if not; different stokes for different folks; however, a definition of GOD as
Nature is both a valid religion, widely participated in modern culture, as well as a valid belief
throughout the history and pre-history of humankind..

I belong to no religion but GOD aka Nature.

And I dam sure don't belong to science;

It's just a pass-time and a 'little' tool; that
yes, I am as proficient at as art;
when I shift my brain.. just
a little bit to the metaphor
of 'left hemisphere' thinking,
friend.

I have mastery over
mind and body balance;
And that's a mightY
natural higher potential
of the GOD of Nature
manifest in my human
nature being
that allows me to
have 'superhuman'
strength and the
title of 'Dance Legend'
in my local area;
among other
stuff like
professionally assessed
Kung Fu expertise;
and stuff like THAT;
all gained with
all natural human
innate instinct, and
intuition straight
from the GOD of
Nature, without a
human lesson;
and for the naysayers
of life; all documented
in irrefutable evidence
on my blogs; as I do hope
other folks can one day
gain 'supermen and superwomen'
capabilities in all natural higher
power human nature manifest in
human being
by the GOD
of Nature
in co-creating
FORCE, just like
Star Wars,
my friend..

Signed,

Yoda with
a BIG
WINK AND
remember;
size
matters
not..

You're welcome..