Asperger's/Autism; a spiritual condition?

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Ba'al Shem Tov was a fanatic and a bit loony. Which is why the mitnagdim rebuffed him and his followers. Ba'al Shem Tov was Dionysian whereas most Jews are Apollonian in temperment. By what measure to you consider him a genius? On the same scale as Newton or Einstein? On the same scale a Rembrant and Michealangelo? Mystics we don't need. We need sound thinkers and reasonable people.

ruveyn

meh...closed minds deserve no respect

Last edited by alba on 16 Feb 2009, 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Baal Shem Tov was a mystical genius as was Pythagoras. His philosophy and intellect was on par with Jesus. He was considered a loony by the money making rabbis competing for Temple attendance.

The world needs mysticism. Without it, there would be no free thinking.
Without free thinking, there would be no innovation.

The talmud supports multi-dimensionality, to say otherwise is folly.

Pythagoras, how killed Hippasos, because he proved the 2^(1/2) is irrational and Pythagoras could stand the true that his theory of numbers were wrong than to execute the discoverer.



When we would know more about Jesus from reliable source, we may could have a clue of what Jesus' "philosophy and intellect" consisted.

Can you quote Ba'al Shem Tov's Theorem for us?

ruveyn

This story has the status of an urban legend.

ruveyn

The world need mysticism as well as a fish a bicycle. Free thinkers were all sceptics or rationalist (and a few Stoics and Epicureans). The most revolutionary thinker in western philosophy Democritus, Socrates, Kant, Hume, Locke, Descartes, etc. were by no means "mystics"



... wonder why Riemann worked on this issue and not Rabbi published something about this issue before.

What about Kierkegaard?

It was Pythagoras who was executed. History is written by the victors. Do some research on him. Pythagorean Theology is very interesting.

ruveyn, it is so unoriginal to revert to mockery to try to appear like a know it all.
Baal Shem Tov was not a mathematician, but you asked who's genius I was comparing his too so I said Pythagoras. I also compared his mysticism to Jesus.

The world doesn't need mystics? Should all the mystics go jump off a bridge? I've been a mystic since I was a kid. It's wired into my brain. Symbolism and abstract language, emotions and spirituality is something I understand, love and appreciate. These are the things that make up my world. You may not value these things and you may not even see them as real, many diagnosed aspies cannot understand these products of the imagination. Emotions are also products of the imagination. Why not just leave us mystics alone then? We don't need meds or ridicule.

Socrates was a mystic. He believed in reincarnation. Perhaps you couldn't find his writings, for he never wrote anything down. Plato had to resume where he left off. I shall as well mention Descartes had a dichotomy supporting his mind/body theories. If you want more....


Not sure if I fully understand that statement, so I'll leave you with this.

The talmud is to the kabbalah as science is to the imagination.

Esotericism is essential to the foundations of man. There are gaps with every theory within science, for science is the deduction of control experiments within statistics. Statistically, everything perceived in a laboratory is verily ever 100%.

I know the difference between solid and well founded knowledge on the one hand, and wishful thinking and subjective crap on the other.

How many lives has mysticism saved? How many lives has solid science saved? The answer is in the numbers and numbers do not lie.

ruveyn

That does not seem to work as an ethical argument. For one, there is no reason to accept life expectancy to be the only metric to judge by, in fact, people trade life-expectancy off for other goods. The mystic can counter-argue that mysticism increases the value of these lives, and thus is important, whether it is true or even if it is false, and basically assert utilitarianism over the life-expectancy view.

In any case, you have not provided the change in life expectancy brought about by a change in science vs a change in mysticism, with all other variable held equal. Thus there are no numbers to refer back to. In any case, how are we even going to define mysticism? Shall it include spirits? Free will? Ethics? Feelings of purpose and agency?

Exactly my point. There's too many variables and semantics involved within. I could go on for days...

I do enjoy many of your posts though, AG.

The mind body connection is scoffed at in western medicine. There are so many cases of the placebo effect that baffles scientists and is described in medical journals or in books by respected scientific researchers. For example, in a study to discover whether occulsion of the mammary artery would relieve the pain caused by angina pectoris, 100% of the subjects who received mock incisions while under general anesthesia showed improvement compared to 76 percent of the subjects whose arteries were actually tied.

Here is another example, a man diagnosed with multiple personality disorder is found to be allergic to citrus juices in all but one of his personalities. He remains free of rashes and other symptoms as long as that one personality remains in control.

Mysticism is self directed spirituality. If people were more aware of themselves in this metaphysical sense (which is not supernatural btw) the hospitals wouldn't be overflowing with clueless patients.

Also, experiments can be influenced by the researcher. His thoughts can alter the experiment.
There are so many variables that would be considered metaphysical, but if we only understood these mysteries, or at least acknowledged them, we would have more personal power.

i agree with the sentiments of alba's post regarding the obnoxious attitude of some on WP and the close-mindedness that is evident within this thread just as one example...

i think it's fair to say that there are definetly aspies who are as close-minded as NT's. it's posts like the ones i've seen here that completely put me off this drivel about aspies being the next step in evolution, or a world built around aspie logic functioning so much better than the way it all is now.

just seems to me like there are NT's who can make the world a good place as well as a bad place, and the same can be said for aspies .. we really don't need any more intolerance in the world.