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MrMark
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19 Aug 2009, 9:28 am

Q&A: Why We Lie So Much (Time)

By EBEN HARRELL Eben Harrell – Wed Aug 19

"A professor of psychology at the University of Massachusetts, Robert Feldman has spent most of his career studying the role deception plays in human relationships. His most recent book, 'The Liar in Your Life: How Lies Work and What They Tell Us About Ourselves,' lays out in stark terms just how prevalent lying has become. He talked to TIME about why we all need a dose of honesty.

"...The paradox here is that if you are 100% honest and blunt, you will not be a popular person. Honesty is the best policy. But it's not a perfect policy."

more...


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19 Aug 2009, 11:38 am

What an interesting article!

I lie 'socially' sometimes - I'm always aware that I'm doing it, it always bothers me and it also bothers me that I'm only doing it because wither I'm scared of being judged. Although sometimes I must admit that I just can't be bothered dealing with people's (normally predictable) reactions. Who can ?? :lol:


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19 Aug 2009, 11:58 am

Two things about this stood out at me. (Well, two that I want to say something about right now.)

Quote:
One of the reasons people get away with so much lying, your research suggests, is that we are all essentially dupes. Why do we believe so many lies?
This is what I call the liar's advantage. We are not very good at detecting deception in other people. When we are trying to detect honesty, we look at the wrong kinds of nonverbal behaviors and we misinterpret them. The problem is that there is no direct correlation between someone's nonverbal behavior and their honesty. "Shiftiness" could also be the result of being nervous, angry, distracted or sad. Even trained interrogators [aren't] able to detect deception at [high] rates. You might as well flip a coin to determine if someone is being honest.

Even though the indicators people use to judge honesty aren't accurate, it totally works against aspies. What they describe as "shiftiness" is also the result of an ASD. Does that mean that a person who is not making eye contact and who is fidgeting "nervously" might actually be being MORE honest. Not to mention that being honest might make people nervous in the first place.

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What's more, a lot of the time we don't want to detect lies in other people. We are unwilling to put forward the cognitive effort to suspect the veracity of statements, and we aren't motivated to question people when they tell us things we want to hear. When we ask someone, "How are you doing?" and they say "fine," we really don't want to know what their aches and pains are. So we take "fine" at face value.

Who here is being more dishonest: the person who asks a question they don't want an answer to, or the person who gives that asker the answer that they want? I don't think that the person who is answering "fine" in this case is being dishonest, because despite the words, they haven't actually been asked how they're doing; they've been told to state that they're fine.
I always use that example of when an adult tells a kid to do something by saying "do you want to _____?" and then yells at the kid if they answer the question honestly. Does that mean that they're instructing the kid to lie by claiming that they want to do whatever it is? I don't think that's what they mean, because they don't actually think they've asked a question, even though they have. They yell because they think that the kid has refused to do something they've told them to do, rather than honestly answered a question that they asked. Bottom line: There was no question to begin with. They're not asking for a dishonest answer to a question, they're asking for an obedient response to an order that was phrased as a question. :?



duke666
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19 Aug 2009, 12:57 pm

Good article. But you don't have to be blunt to be honest. When I learn a foreign language, I don't have issues with 'bien, gracias' or 'genki des'. Social rituals and non-verbal communication are foreign languages to me, but I can learn to get by.

I certainly don't want to hurt people's feelings (usually), or make them feel bad, and there are lots of different ways to say the same things, so we can often choose one that is gentle.

I get confused when people lie to me, though. A lot of times they are 'saving face', or saving my feelings, which I understand and don't object to, but it's jarring and makes me time-shift.


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MrMark
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19 Aug 2009, 1:55 pm

Maggiedoll wrote:
...Who here is being more dishonest: the person who asks a question they don't want an answer to, or the person who gives that asker the answer that they want? :?

"Do these pants make my butt look big?"




(I usually respond, "No honey, that's not what makes your butt look big. " ;))


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19 Aug 2009, 3:57 pm

duke666 wrote:
Social rituals and non-verbal communication are foreign languages to me, but I can learn to get by.


For Social Rituals: Are they really foriegn or do you see them as pointless and redundant? I see certain social rituals are redundant and pointless so I don't follow them.

For Non-Verbal Commun: What do you mean by "non-verbal communication"? Are you expression blind or some other true non-verbal communicative skill or is it you have trouble noticing that someone tapped their finger twice on the table which "means" "go away" in "NT speak"? Because the latter is not "NT speak" at all.

duke666 wrote:
I certainly don't want to hurt people's feelings (usually), or make them feel bad, and there are lots of different ways to say the same things, so we can often choose one that is gentle.


Or we can be firm yet not asinine about it and people can be mature and not get so ego-injured over it, I appreciate firm direct honesty over "nice" lies any day, it makes me respect a person more.

duke666 wrote:
I get confused when people lie to me, though. A lot of times they are 'saving face', or saving my feelings, which I understand and don't object to,


"Saving face" means "I don't wanna take responsibility, wah!" and is childish, as for saving your feelings, maybe... maybe not, maybe it's to spare their own feelings? I get angry when people lie to me, they are not sparring my feelings, I'm a grown man not a 7 year old or a 14 year old, I don't get why people wish to behave like children 24/7.


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19 Aug 2009, 4:21 pm

Interesting article. I think it is an important question, to lie or not to lie. I find that venting negative feelings isnt the thing that will make others warm to you but also keeping them repressed and lying or whitewashing over it doesnt help either... Its very confusing.


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19 Aug 2009, 5:31 pm

MrMark wrote:
Maggiedoll wrote:
...Who here is being more dishonest: the person who asks a question they don't want an answer to, or the person who gives that asker the answer that they want? :?

"Do these pants make my butt look big?"




(I usually respond, "No honey, that's not what makes your butt look big. " ;))



"Do these pants make my butt look big?" is an example that is brought up repeatedly, and supposedly women want to hear, "Oh, no, dear! You look even better than a Victoria's Secret model, especially in those pants" or something like that.

I don't get this, though. I'm a woman (albeit an odd one), but if I am trying on a pair of pants, I want to know if they look alright. I KNOW what my figure flaws are, and I assume most other women are even more aware of their own, since obsessing about our bodies is something a lot of women do far more than I do. I truly want to know if the pants make my butt look big, so I can put on something more flattering if they do. I don't want the person I'm with to LIE, and then have me go walking around all day in a pair of pants that make people, "Oh, God, those pants look hideous on that woman's figure."


If my husband said, "No honey, that's not what makes your butt look big", it would be funny, because it would be true. (Well, the "butt" isn't my specific issue, but for argument's sake we'll pretend it is.) It's no secret that I need to lose a few pounds and hit the free weights once in a while, and it would be silly to pretend otherwise.

It's bizarre to me that women ask that question and want a lie.



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19 Aug 2009, 5:41 pm

What's odd is that they ask their husbands or boyfriends. My (ex)wife would ask for my opinion on various issues and of course I gave it to her and she was invariably disappointed. I would say, "I don't know why you ask for my opinion," and she would respond, "I don't know why either."


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duke666
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19 Aug 2009, 5:47 pm

Thank you elderwanda.

The question isn't meant exactly literally. It's fine to say "that cut doesn't look quite right on you". It's a perfectly direct and honest answer to the question, but not a literal one.

A friend of mine once said "it's important to have friends who will tell you when your fly is open, and when you're talking crazy".


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19 Aug 2009, 6:57 pm

elderwanda wrote:
I don't get this, though. I'm a woman (albeit an odd one), but if I am trying on a pair of pants, I want to know if they look alright. I KNOW what my figure flaws are, and I assume most other women are even more aware of their own, since obsessing about our bodies is something a lot of women do far more than I do. I truly want to know if the pants make my butt look big, so I can put on something more flattering if they do. I don't want the person I'm with to LIE, and then have me go walking around all day in a pair of pants that make people, "Oh, God, those pants look hideous on that woman's figure."

I agree. The purpose of trying on clothes with somebody is to get advice.
It's especially bizarre when someone who is really obese asks that question, though.
My new one, however, which bugs Kris to no end, is asking him if the "My Silhouette!" stuff is making me look any less fat or less ugly. He says I'm not anyways. I say that even if he thinks I'm not, he might still be able to tell if it makes me a bit less flabby. :? It's not like I'm going to turn around and twist his words.. and if I do, I'll be kidding, and say so.

duke666 wrote:
A friend of mine once said "it's important to have friends who will tell you when your fly is open, and when you're talking crazy".

Does saying "XYZ" not work anymore to tell someone their fly is down?



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20 Aug 2009, 6:20 am

That is just it. People complain about politicians but they want people to lie to them. People want what they know damn well is impossible.



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20 Aug 2009, 7:07 am

Quote:
:lol: "Do these pants make my butt look big?"


In answering a question like that, I would typically say. Those pants look OK but these pants are more your style. They would really flatter your figure.



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20 Aug 2009, 7:15 am

Quote:
"...The paradox here is that if you are 100% honest and blunt, you will not be a popular person. Honesty is the best policy. But it's not a perfect policy."


Wouldn't brutal honesty be a good tactic to piss off the people you hate?



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20 Aug 2009, 8:08 am

I never received the instructions about lying. It's an alien and impossible concept to me.



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21 Aug 2009, 2:40 am

MrMark wrote:
Maggiedoll wrote:
...Who here is being more dishonest: the person who asks a question they don't want an answer to, or the person who gives that asker the answer that they want? :?

"Do these pants make my butt look big?"




(I usually respond, "No honey, that's not what makes your butt look big. " ;))


If anyone ever works out the correct answer to that question, let me know. (I'm female by the way)