James Holmes may have Aspergers?

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I was just wondering if he did have AS, what are the percentages of AS cases that might have a co-morbid of schizophrenia. It seems like I have read threads here before where there might be a connection between the two. I am not implying that all with AS have schizophrenia, I am just wondering if there is a connection. I still feel like from the descriptions of Holmes when he was younger, he fit the description of AS.

Apart from the delusions and/or hallucinations, Schizophrenia is hard to distinguish from AS (after all, the term "autism" actually comes from Schizophrenia, and Hans and Leo took said term because that's what it was describing in their papers).

Obviously, age of onset is the easiest way to differentiate them when there's an absence of hallucinations and/or delusions, as is the lack of nonverbal cues in AS.

The interesting thing is that he was seeing someone; seems like that's showing insight into his deterioration.

Maybe this is of interest for you. It's from a study about comorbidity and AS:

link
And you may want to read this article.

he told the cops about his bomb rigged apartment....

Technically the diagnostic criteria in the DSMIV rule out a diagnosis of AS if schizophrenia is present. There is little to no potential that one diagnosing professional would diagnosis him with both conditions, because of the restrictions in the criteria.

There are definitely similarities between schizophrenia and Autism Spectrum disorders, as misdiagnosis is common, but technically they aren't diagnosed co-morbid, per the DSMIV. As stated earlier, the ICD10 includes psychosis as a potential in young adults with Aspergers, and there are genetic markers determined similar in association.

Two different diagnosing professionals can come up with two different analyses as has been reported in some of the rampage killings, and per anecodotal reports of individuals on this website.

Fitting the description of AS can be much different than being diagnosed, as one must be determined significantly impaired in a major area of life functioning. It's not likely that Holmes had traits of AS that were serious enough to meet that standard as an adolescent considering his mother was a psychiatric nurse. The schizophrenia often provides no clue during adolescence showing up later in young adulthood. But in others difficulties are reported similar to conditions like AS, in adolescence in examples like the Unabomer. But never the less, he was able to function at the level of gaining a PHD, and moving on to Assistant Professor, before falling off the map. The broader autism phenotype stretches far out into the population, much broader than diagnosed cases.

And as mentioned earlier by dillogic the negative expression of schizophrenia, has parallels with AS as well.

Thank you---I am just curious about this, so your knowledge is very helpful. I guess we will see how all of this plays out. I for one do not believe James Holmes should receive the death penalty. I am wondering if it will go to trial since his lawyers are saying that the media leaked the notebook and that it is risking his right to a fair trial.

I don't think that will have a direct bearing on whether or not it goes to trial.

I think the only way it won't go to trial is if he determined not mentally competent to stand trial. That seems to be a real potential, at this point.

I'm not a fan of the death penalty, period, as the court process is not without error, in determining guilt or innocence.

Interestingly, the state that executes the most people, also is the state that opposes health care reform the most vigorously and supports succession from the rest of the states.

The death penalty and modern civilization in my opinion are opposing ends of a spectrum of modern humanity.

The last place empathy lies is those with mental illness; it comes through loud and clear when a circumstance likes this happens, and not too unusual since most of the population cannot relate from personal experience, particularly if the diagnosis is schizophrenia, since only .07% of the population is estimated to be affected by the organic based mental disorder.

Just saw on NBC that he was apparently under the care of a psychiatrist in the months before the shooting, and that she specializes in schiophrenia...

N0tYetDeadFred writes:

http://nbclatino.com/2012/07/27/latino- ... r-shooter/


http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/27/us/colora ... index.html


Hopeful her expertize extended to other areas of DSM disorders as well....


TheSunAlsoRises

Schizophrenia can come into play if the reason for the murders was due to delusions and/or hallucinations, i.e., the aforementioned alien reptilian hybrids masquerading as humans that are planning on destroying the human race or he had voices coercing him to do it or else some greater tragedy will befall whomever (or similar levels of detachment from reality). Insanity is a valid defense there.

Kinda really sucks for the person who did it if that's the case (sucks just as much or more for the victims, of course).

I was elaborating on your point - I didn't mean I was contradicting because you didn't say either way.

I'll also add that starting in high school Bundy did have a history of theft escalating to burglary before he started killing.

No problem, thanks for the clarification.

I like this blog post and the discussion below:
link

Not sure about that blog myself.....

Had James Holmes just begun to take medication??

My GP suggested I start Fluoxetine. I wiki'd it and told the her 'no'. Here is some of what wikipedia says about the fluoxetine (prosac)

Akathisia, that is inner tension, restlessness, and the inability to stay still, often accompanied by "constant pacing, purposeless movements of the feet and legs, and marked anxiety", is a common side effect of fluoxetine
There are case reports directly linking akathisia with suicidal attempts, with patients feeling better after the withdrawal of fluoxetine, and again developing severe akathisia on repeated exposure to fluoxetine. These patients described "that the development of the akathisia made them feel suicidal and that it had precipitated their prior suicide attempts"
The work which eventually led to the discovery of fluoxetine began at Eli Lilly and Company in 1970 as a collaboration between Bryan Molloy and Robert Rathbun.[citation needed] It was known at that time that the antihistamine diphenhydramine shows some antidepressant-like properties. 3-Phenoxy-3-phenylpropylamine, a compound structurally similar to diphenhydramine, was taken as a starting point, and Molloy synthesized dozens of its derivatives. Testing the physiological effects of these compounds in mice resulted in nisoxetine, a selective norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor currently widely used in biochemical experiments.[68][69]
Fluoxetine appeared on the Belgian market in 1986.[71] After over a decade, the FDA gave its final approval in December 1987,[72] and a month later Eli Lilly began marketing Prozac; annual sales in the U.S. reached $350 million within a year.[70]
In 1989, Joseph Wesbecker shot and killed eight people and injured 12 others before killing himself at his place of work in Kentucky. Wesbecker had been taking fluoxetine for four weeks before these homicides, and this led to a legal action against Eli Lilly.[73] The case was tried and settled in 1994, and as part of the settlement a number of pharmaceutical company documents about drug-induced activation were released into the public domain. Subsequent legal cases have further raised the possibility of a link between antidepressant use and violence.[74] The Prozac Survivors Support Group created a report on 288 individuals who had suffered adverse effects from Fluoxetine during 1991 and 1992. It showed that most of the cases led to violence against self or other individuals. There were 164 cases in the suicide and suicide ideation category, including 34 complete suicides. There were also 133 cases of crime and violence, which featured 14 murders, nine attempted murders, 39 violent actions, 54 violent preoccupations and 17 crimes. The report also showed that 13 individuals had become addicted to Fluoxetine and 14 cases of alcoholism forming or worsening.[75] However, Mayo Clinic psychiat
rist Daniel K. Hall-Flavin is of the opinion that people cannot get addicted to antidepressants, stating "Addiction represents harmful, long-term chemical changes in the brain. It's characterized by intense cravings and the inability to control your use of a substance."


from http://www.peoplespharmacy.com/2012/03/ ... -violence/


Q. Is it possible Prozac may trigger violent and irrational reactions? Last year my son, who had been put on Prozac by his psychiatrist, had what I would call a gigantic temper tantrum. He destroyed his computer, his car and set himself on fire, burning himself over 90 percent of his body. Most of those were third degree burns. He rushed into the bathroom and put out the fire with a shower, which probably saved his life.

He had never expressed suicidal tendencies before this episode, and has fought to live throughout his treatment for burns.

How often do people on Prozac attempt suicide? I think families should be warned about this complication more effectively. I am concerned that ads don't emphasize this adequately.

A. The issue of violent, self destructive behavior associated with Prozac (fluoxetine) remains controversial. Many health care professionals point out that people who are depressed sometimes consider suicide.

There have, however, been way too many reports of violent acts linked to fluoxetine and other antidepressants. Ads do list suicidal ideation along with other potential adverse events including agitation, confusion and emotional lability (extreme mood swings). "Violent behaviors" are also noted.

Most people have a very hard time imagining that someone might commit violet acts because of taking a drug. To read more about this highly controversial subject take a moment to read our column, "Drugs That Trigger Violence Behavior" and "Do Drugs Drive People to Violent Behavior?"

The stop-smoking drug Chantix has also been linked to such problems. We have heard from a number of people that when Chantix is combined with alcohol it can have some unexpected and unsavory effects.

Those taking antidepressants should contact their doctor immediately if they begin to feel suicidal or have violent urges. Family members should be especially vigilant during the early going on such drugs or when the dose is readjusted.

Anyone who would like to learn more about these issues can download for free our guide to Psychological Side Effects. If you would like to learn more about a variety of ways to deal with the blues, we recommend our guide to Dealing With Depression. There are many non-drug approaches in this booklet.

from http://www.oralchelation.net/ProzacSideEffects.htm

Prozac Side Effects = Violence And Depression

Prozac is the antidepressant made by Eli Lilly. It is the most profitable drug in history. The side effects of Prozac include that it makes people violent. Many of the most sensational killing sprees have been committed by drug-crazed people who were made that way by Prozac. Click here for a page with many links to material about Prozac. You can even read about how Lilly knew that Prozac would cause the side effect of violence, but hid that truth.

Withdrawal from Prozac is harder than withdrawing from heroin! The withdrawal symptoms include trembling and tendencies to either suicide or violence to others.

Here is what Eli Lilly admits to in its official explanation of Prozac side effects:

Monoamine Oxidase Inhibitors--There have been reports of serious, sometimes fatal, reactions (including hyperthermia, rigidity, myoclonus, with possible rapid fluctuations of vital signs, and mental status changes that include extreme agitation progressing to delirium and coma) in patients receiving fluoxetine in combination with a monoamine oxidase inhibitor (MAOI), and in patients who have recently discontinued fluoxetine and are then started on an MAOI. Some cases presented with features resembling neuroleptic malignant syndrome. Therefore, Prozac should not be used in combination with an MAOI, or within a minimum of 14 days of discontinuing therapy with an MAOI. Since fluoxetine and its major metabolite have very long elimination half-lives, at least 5 weeks (perhaps longer, especially if fluoxetine has been prescribed chronically and/or at higher doses (See Accumulation and Slow Elimination Under ACTIONS/CLINICAL PHARMACOLOGY)) should be allowed after stopping Prozac before starting an MAOI.

Prozac side effects include murder! Prozac withdrawal symptoms include a desire to commit violence. Eli Lilly Prozac is soon to be replaced the same drug with a different name. Prozac antidepressant winds up CAUSING depression.

The initial effect of Prozac seems to be more calm. But, this is the symptom of becoming more like a vegetable. After a period of time on this antidepressant, the Prozac side effects are much more prominent that the intended main effect. This is the point where it is virtually impossible to withdraw from use of the drug, and the point where the person is more and more willing to commit violence, including murder, on others.

Eli Lilly is one of the most evil drug companies on the planet. They knew, many years ago, about the side effects of Prozac. They deliberately hid the truth for the sole purpose of making billions of dollars of profit on this harmful drug.

Those who ARE on this drug should go back to the doctor who prescribed it, and demand to be taken off. If that doctor refuses, that is the time to sue him for malpractice. It is possible to get off Prozac without dreadful withdrawal symptoms -- but doctors never will tell you about the method.

Avoid Prozac at all costs! If you are on it, demand help from your doctor to get off. He is the criminal that needs to be charged!

from http://www.sntp.net/prozac/prozac_info_2.htm



Prozac Information Sheet #2
Prozac Causes Violence
Originally Issued 4 June 1990

Widely Used Drug Turns People Violent And Suicidal

Prozac is a new structure drug currently being promoted as a "wonder drug" for depression. The drug company's promotion however, ignores considerable evidence which has accumulated showing how truly deadly this psychiatric drug really is.

The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has received 5,740 reports of adverse reactions from Prozac in less than two years compared with 2,923 reports received by the FDA on the long-standing market leader, Elavil, over twenty years.(1)

The adverse reactions reported on Prozac include aggression, psychosis, hallucinations and "akathisia", a drug-induced insanity with bizarre and frightening characteristics including hallucinations, aggression, self-destructive outbursts, terror, anger, suicide, hostility, hatred and rage.(2) Already, frightening reports of persons being turned violent and suicidal by Prozac have begun to surface.

A study recently published in the American Journal of Psychiatry exposed the fact that Prozac creates obsessive and intense, violent suicidal thoughts in patients who take the drug. According to the study, these bizarre and extremely dangerous self-destructive thoughts occurred in 3.5 percent of persons on the drug.(3)

The manufacturer states that there are up to two million people on the drug, placing the total of those being given intense, violent suicidal thoughts at up to 70,000 Americans.

As noted above, FDA reports show that Prozac can cause akathisia which can include self-destructive and suicidal thoughts and behavior. This has been confirmed by the manufacturer's literature and also by an independent study into the drug which estimated that between 10% and 25% of persons on Prozac experience akathisia.(4) These people are not being told that the drug can create insanity in them and can push them to the brink of self destruction.

In 1989, Janet Sims of Hamilton County, Indiana, was driven so intensely suicidal by Prozac that she was no longer certain she would not kill herself. Her psychiatrist persuaded her she was insane and convinced her to undergo electric shocks to her brain [at financial profit to the psychiatrist]. The shocks robbed her of her memory and destroyed much of her education, but the suicidal thoughts didn't disappear until she stopped taking Prozac months later.(5)

The files of the FDA contain tragic reports of persons on Prozac who were no longer able to fight thoughts pushing them to suicide. For instance, the reports stated, "This patient was reported to have died by suicide, (carbon monoxide poisoning) while on Prozac therapy" (submitted by Lilly to the FDA in May, 1989), "This patient died by hanging" (submitted by Lilly to the FDA in July, 1989), "Patient suicided herself by jumping under the train" (submitted by Lilly to the FDA in September of 1989).(6)

Even psychotic acts of murder have been perpetrated by persons on Prozac. On September 14, Joseph Wesbecker went into the Standard Gravure building in Louisville, Kentucky, and opened fire, killing eight former coworkers and wounding twelve others before killing himself. According to the Jefferson County Coroner, Wesbecker had a high therapeutic level of Prozac in his blood at the time of his rampage.(7) Concerned that Prozac may have contributed to Wesbecker's rampage, the coroner asked the drug's manufacturer whether any other acts of violence connected with Prozac had been reported to the company and was told that the company had no documented reports of violence from Prozac at all.(8)

However documents released under the Freedom of Information Act by the Food and Drug Administration show that, contrary to the denials of Eli Lilly, there had been several reports to the drug company of violence on Prozac. The documents show that these reports were all received by Lilly prior to the call which was placed by the coroner to Lilly regarding the possible role of Prozac in the Wesbecker killings.

These reports confirmed that Prozac can and does turn people hostile, aggressive and violent. Some of these reports stated, "This patient became agitated and violent after third dose of Prozac" (submitted by Lilly to the FDA in April, 1989); "'Shortly after Prozac was increased to 80 mg daily patient became extremely violent" (submitted by Lilly to the FDA in July, 1989), "This patient was reported to have become manic with prominent paranoid ideation while taking Prozac. Patient... illegally entered the house of an unknown family and required considerable restraint before being brought under control" (submitted to Lilly to the FDA in August, 1989), and "The dosage was increased to 40 mg and the patient experienced an intense homicidal rage. She made plans to kill a man from her past" (submitted by Lilly to the FDA in July, 1988).(9)

Another report submitted to the FDA in July of 1988, more than a year prior to the Wesbecker rampage, states "This patient became very aggressive while taking Prozac; after one week on the drug he had an argument with another motorist & attempted to run over him with his car."(10)

One of Wesbecker's coworkers, James Lucas, testified at the inquest that he was turned violent and attacked his wife with a ballpoint pen after seven weeks on Prozac. He said that prior to taking Prozac he had never so much as raised his hand to his wife in thirty-five years of marriage.(11)

Additionally,, Lucas pointed out that persons on Prozac are not capable of recognizing the violent insanity which the drug is generating. He said that it must be pointed out to the person by others around him.

The jury at the inquest recognized the possible connection of the violence to Prozac and ruled that "the effects of the 'drugs Mr. Wesbecker was taking may have been a contributory factor" to the rampage.(12)

In early 1990 ten survivors of Wesbecker's rampage petitioned Congress to look into the violence-inducing nature of Prozac, and to determine whether other cases of violence across the country have been precipitated by the drug as well.(13)

On January 13, 1989, in Madison, Wisconsin, Catherine Rouse murdered another person and then committed suicide. According to the coroners Rouse had a therapeutic level of Prozac in her blood at the time she went berserk.(14)

Despite the evidence which shows that Prozac generates violence and suicides the manufacturer of the drug has refused to issue a warning to the millions who have been exposed to the irresponsible hype about the drug. As a result many more Americans will be turned hostile, violent and suicidal by the drug unless action is taken now to bring this warning to the public.

This information was originally printed and distributed as a public service by the Citizens Commission on Human Rights (CCHR), Clearwater, Florida. CCHR has been investigating and exposing psychiatric violations of human rights since 1969.

Footnotes:

1. FDA Spontaneous Reporting System printout on Prozac dated 10 October 1989, and on Elavil dated 14 November 1989, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act from the FDA.

2. An in-depth description of akathisia is presented at Theodore Van Puttent "The Many Faces of Akathisia", Comprehensive Psychiatry, Vol. XVI (January/February 1975), pp. 43-47.

3. Martin H. Teicher, et al, "Emergence of Intense Suicidal Preoccupation During Fluoxetine Treatment," The American Journal of Psychiatry, Vol. 147, No. 2, (February 1990) pp. 207-210.

4. J. Lipinski and others, "Fluoxetine-induced akathisia: clinical and theoretical implications," Journal of Clinical Psychiatry, Vol. 50 (September 1989), pp. 339-342.

5. Affidavit of Janet Sims of 16 March 1990, on file with CCHR.

6. Drug Experience Report on Prozac (f luoxetine), Accession numbers 89050703603271, 89070703600341, 89090703600241 respectively released under FOIA from the Food and Drug Administration.

7. "Toxicology Sheet of Joseph Wesbecker" prepared by Dr. Richard Greathouse, Coroner of Jefferson County, Kentucky.

8. Transcript of Proceedings Jefferson County Coroner's Inquest, November 22, 1989, pp. 291-292.

9. Drug Experience Report on Prozac (fluoxetine), Accession numbers 89040703607252, 89070703601481, 89080703602421, 88070703600181 respectively, released under FOIA from the Food and Drug Administration.

10. Drug Experience Report on Prozac (fluoxetine), Accession number 88070703690341, released under FOIA from the Food and Drug Administration.

11. Transcript of Proceedings, Jefferson County Coroner's Inquest, November 22, 1989, pp. 253-254.

12. Jefferson County Coroner's Inquest findings of November 22, 1989.

13. Letter from Wesbecker survivors to Senators and Representatives, dated January 30, 1990.

14. Coroner's Investigation of Death/Inquisition, Dane County Coroner's office, pertaining to the deaths of Catherine Rouse and Joan Kebick, January 13, 1990.

This information was originally printed and distributed as a public service by the Citizens Commission on Human Rights (CCHR), Clearwater, Florida. CCHR has been investigating and exposing psychiatric violations of human rights since 1969.
Suggested Reading:
Talking Back to Prozac by Peter R. Breggin, M.D.

Brain-Disabling Treatments in Psychiatry : Drugs, Electroshock, and the Role of the FDA Today! by Peter R. Breggin, M.D.

Toxic Psychiatry : Why Therapy, Empathy, and Love Must Replace the Drugs, Electroshock, and Biochemical Theories of the New Psychiatry by Peter R. Breggin, M.D.

The Manufacture of Madness : A Comparative Study of the Inquisition and the Mental Health Movements by Thomas S. Szasz, M.D., Professor

Law, Liberty, and Psychiatry : An Inquiry into the Social Uses of Mental Health Practices by Thomas S. Szasz, M.D., Professor

Bedlam : Greed, Profiteering, and Fraud in a Mental Health System Gone Crazy by Joe Sharkey

The Limits of Biological Treatments for Psychological Distress by Seymour Fisher and Roger P. Greenberg

Physician's Desk Reference (PDR)

Psychiatric Drugs: Hazards to the Brain by Peter R. Breggin, M.D.