West vs East : Relationship and family values.

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The_Face_of_Boo
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22 Aug 2016, 2:14 am

anagram wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
I think I see what you mean of pride now - I think it's something common in cultures with long imperial history.

Hmmm... if only Hannibal made it. :p Imagine how the world would have been today, would Italy and Europe have been the same?

the whole world would probably have been different. though it's fun to imagine how different. because the mediterranean would still have been dominated by a mediterranean culture, not an outside force. but would europe have been the center of the world order? probably not. would we have had a punic empire reaching global influence? what cultural values would it have spread and perpetuated?

i feel like playing civ5 right now :D


I feel like playing Rome: total war. :lol: Rome 2 did have a very nice Carthage campaign, it was well done.



Drawyer
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22 Aug 2016, 6:33 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Other typical differences based on observation/ again, they're generalizations and surely not true for every individual (it is impossible to talk about major cultural differences without making generalizations):


-The "sex for fun", such within flings or short terms.

- In the West: it is not uncommon, it is commonly talked about, even if it's less socially accepted than long terms. Sex is not exclusively for long terms and marriage.

- In the East: Typically, the concept is absolutely not accepted by eastern women, in my experience if you tell an Eastern woman about what's friendship with benefits or what's flings for instance, her brain "freezes" for a moment as if she can't compute the concept, for many of them they view the short term as something player men do by playing and tricking women for sake of sex but never as something that women may be willingly and mutually accept it as well. For the most of them, sex must be exclusive for marriage and at least for serious LT.

more on the difference in perception of sex: http://www.meldmagazine.com.au/2013/09/ ... ern-asian/
[.....]
Yeah, that's true. The biggest culture shock I've ever encountered here was about FB things. Another thing I wasn't able to understand was that some men seemed so much embarrassed by being a virgin themselves. It's way way wayyyy more respected and preferred to stay a virgin until marriage in my culture.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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23 Aug 2016, 7:26 am

Drawyer wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Other typical differences based on observation/ again, they're generalizations and surely not true for every individual (it is impossible to talk about major cultural differences without making generalizations):


-The "sex for fun", such within flings or short terms.

- In the West: it is not uncommon, it is commonly talked about, even if it's less socially accepted than long terms. Sex is not exclusively for long terms and marriage.

- In the East: Typically, the concept is absolutely not accepted by eastern women, in my experience if you tell an Eastern woman about what's friendship with benefits or what's flings for instance, her brain "freezes" for a moment as if she can't compute the concept, for many of them they view the short term as something player men do by playing and tricking women for sake of sex but never as something that women may be willingly and mutually accept it as well. For the most of them, sex must be exclusive for marriage and at least for serious LT.

more on the difference in perception of sex: http://www.meldmagazine.com.au/2013/09/ ... ern-asian/
[.....]
Yeah, that's true. The biggest culture shock I've ever encountered here was about FB things. Another thing I wasn't able to understand was that some men seemed so much embarrassed by being a virgin themselves. It's way way wayyyy more respected and preferred to stay a virgin until marriage in my culture.


....respected by the local women, but not much by the local men, at least that was my experience with the most of them.

But the typical reaction from an Eastern girl when she knows through a conversation that I had casual sex with some certain girl :
- "Why didn't you marry her? Why didn't you stay together?"
- "Because it was not a serious relationship in the first place"
- "Oh, you mean...you played her, you're a player."
- "No no , it was really something mutually accepted from the very start."
- <freezes for a long moment> "R...really? I don't believe you, I think she loved you and you just used her"

duh...something like that, always, every single time, obviously many of them believe that women can't have "sex just for fun".

Btw, what do you mean about the FB things?



Drawyer
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23 Aug 2016, 7:47 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
duh...something like that, always, every single time, obviously many of them believe that women can't have "sex just for fun".

Btw, what do you mean about the FB things?
..Duh.. obviously...I don't believe either...

FB things mean Friend-of-Benefit kinds of things.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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23 Aug 2016, 8:19 am

Drawyer wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
duh...something like that, always, every single time, obviously many of them believe that women can't have "sex just for fun".

Btw, what do you mean about the FB things?
..Duh.. obviously...I don't believe either...

FB things mean Friend-of-Benefit kinds of things.


Oh...but what about the plan of doing porn with me?



RetroGamer87
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23 Aug 2016, 8:44 am

Drawyer wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Other typical differences based on observation/ again, they're generalizations and surely not true for every individual (it is impossible to talk about major cultural differences without making generalizations):


-The "sex for fun", such within flings or short terms.

- In the West: it is not uncommon, it is commonly talked about, even if it's less socially accepted than long terms. Sex is not exclusively for long terms and marriage.

- In the East: Typically, the concept is absolutely not accepted by eastern women, in my experience if you tell an Eastern woman about what's friendship with benefits or what's flings for instance, her brain "freezes" for a moment as if she can't compute the concept, for many of them they view the short term as something player men do by playing and tricking women for sake of sex but never as something that women may be willingly and mutually accept it as well. For the most of them, sex must be exclusive for marriage and at least for serious LT.

more on the difference in perception of sex: http://www.meldmagazine.com.au/2013/09/ ... ern-asian/
[.....]
Yeah, that's true. The biggest culture shock I've ever encountered here was about FB things. Another thing I wasn't able to understand was that some men seemed so much embarrassed by being a virgin themselves. It's way way wayyyy more respected and preferred to stay a virgin until marriage in my culture.
That is a culture shock. I find it hard to imagine anyone actually wanting to hold onto their virginity. Losing it, for me was a huge relief.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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23 Aug 2016, 9:01 am

RetroGamer87 wrote:
Drawyer wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Other typical differences based on observation/ again, they're generalizations and surely not true for every individual (it is impossible to talk about major cultural differences without making generalizations):


-The "sex for fun", such within flings or short terms.

- In the West: it is not uncommon, it is commonly talked about, even if it's less socially accepted than long terms. Sex is not exclusively for long terms and marriage.

- In the East: Typically, the concept is absolutely not accepted by eastern women, in my experience if you tell an Eastern woman about what's friendship with benefits or what's flings for instance, her brain "freezes" for a moment as if she can't compute the concept, for many of them they view the short term as something player men do by playing and tricking women for sake of sex but never as something that women may be willingly and mutually accept it as well. For the most of them, sex must be exclusive for marriage and at least for serious LT.

more on the difference in perception of sex: http://www.meldmagazine.com.au/2013/09/ ... ern-asian/
[.....]
Yeah, that's true. The biggest culture shock I've ever encountered here was about FB things. Another thing I wasn't able to understand was that some men seemed so much embarrassed by being a virgin themselves. It's way way wayyyy more respected and preferred to stay a virgin until marriage in my culture.
That is a culture shock. I find it hard to imagine anyone actually wanting to hold onto their virginity. Losing it, for me was a huge relief.


Few years ago, a lebanese girl cut dating me the moment I told her that I had a sexual experience with a girl before (and I was still penetration-wise virgin back then). Oops. Big oops. We were both late 20s.



namaste
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23 Aug 2016, 12:39 pm

the thing about not living with parents in old age changes the whole scenario.

why would a person marry and have kids when the kids wont be a asset for them in old age. when they cannot play with their grandchildren.

i think the whole theory of evolution and family, generation comes to standstill when kids move out, get own life, not take care of parents in oldage.

here in my country mostly traditional families live together. they live in joint family the sons with their parents and when a daughter in law gets married and comes she takes care of old parents, the parents take care of grandchildren till the time they are able take care of the grandchildren.

the whole family live together and the cycle continues. that way there is extended families, lot of people to help each other, support sytem, the elders manage the money they see to it that the younger generation are doing virtuous things. the families live together, eat together, pray together.

But in my case everything was topsyturvy. My father was not following any of this he was into alcohol, watching vulgar hollywood movies, reading vulgar novels, he wont respect elders and not treat children well.

the result is me. i am not much of part of my culture. THe people here find me different and i have to gel with them to learn what actually is my culture.


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namaste
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23 Aug 2016, 12:49 pm

but nowadays there are lot of conflict in cities. especially parents dont want to indulge in grandchildren they find it burden they want freedom and dont want to be like servant serving kids first and then grandkids

because of this lot of married women are burdened with task of raising kids alone and they find it difficult without support.

lot of kids are addicted to mobiles, tv etc because they dont know what else to do.

overall there is deteriotion of family values. there are fights in marriages and lot of couples are drifting apart and there are lot of divorce.

but joint families were not all comfortable there were issues of heavy dowry demands, only male prodigy female child was killed, widows were condemned and isolated not allowed to remarry. harassment by inlaws. girls were not allowed to study and expected to learn household work and then do it in married house.

girls or women had no freedom, they were not allowed to speak, share or express their feelings, ideas, notions. so i was brought up that way but my father was enjoying things he wanted to enjoy


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The_Face_of_Boo
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23 Aug 2016, 2:10 pm

namaste wrote:
the thing about not living with parents in old age changes the whole scenario.

why would a person marry and have kids when the kids wont be a asset for them in old age. when they cannot play with their grandchildren.

i think the whole theory of evolution and family, generation comes to standstill when kids move out, get own life, not take care of parents in oldage.

here in my country mostly traditional families live together. they live in joint family the sons with their parents and when a daughter in law gets married and comes she takes care of old parents, the parents take care of grandchildren till the time they are able take care of the grandchildren.

the whole family live together and the cycle continues. that way there is extended families, lot of people to help each other, support sytem, the elders manage the money they see to it that the younger generation are doing virtuous things. the families live together, eat together, pray together.

But in my case everything was topsyturvy. My father was not following any of this he was into alcohol, watching vulgar hollywood movies, reading vulgar novels, he wont respect elders and not treat children well.

the result is me. i am not much of part of my culture. The people here find me different and i have to gel with them to learn what actually is my culture.


Hmmm it's exactly the same here, where are I live, grandparents/unmarried aunts/uncles are expected to take care of grandchildren if both parents work - typically when kids are still toddlers their grandparents still young enough to be physically capable to take care of children.
It is that why many newly married couples prefer to live somewhere near of the grandparents.

Is that an Eastern thing too? The social 'obligation' of grandparents to be babysitters when parents are busy? I certainly recall I spent a lot of time at grandparents, almost half of day everyday at certain very young age when both of my parents were working, or when they go out. It was the case with all the kids of my age.

I do have an uncle who's married to a British Australian lady, and he did say that her mother never accepted to babysit the kids when they're out while his mother (my grandma) always volunteered to take care of them.

Not sure if this is a West vs East thing or it's just an individual case?



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23 Aug 2016, 5:48 pm

Yes and no. When I was a kid my grandparents spent a lot of time babysitting me. They really enjoyed spending time with me, always volunteering to take me to movies and other outings. When ever mum needed a break they were happy to have me at their house for a few days.

That was then. 20 years later things are different. We have a new generation of kids an the grandparents are from a different generation. Nowadays generation x is becoming grandparents and they do things differently compared with my baby boomer grandparents.

Another difference is that nowadays people have much longer careers. My grandparents when into semi retirement just after I was born. Nowadays people are often working full time through their whole 60s.

Also, mum didn't work. I'm all for women's lib in the workplace but I see a trend of mothers working lower paying jobs, while sending their kids to daycare centres that cost most of what they earn. If two thirds of your minimum wage goes to the daycare centre than you're working for less than minimum wage.

At the other end of the spectrum there's the upper middle class parents were both have a professional job. It's more financially justified in their case. But I think that having kids in before school care and after school care for hours per day can be exhausting for them.

Why exhausting? Because roughly half of kids are introverts. Extroverts recharge their energy from being around people and introverts recharge their energy from being alone. Being with people isn't painful for us introverts but it's tiring. It uses energy. Using this energy is for a little while is ok. Introverts can still be sociable. But being around your peers from 8AM to 6PM everyday is exhausting for introverts. They need their own space to feel relaxed and comfortable.

Maternity leave only lasts for a year and kids need time with their parents throughout their whole childhood. Having kids raised by daycare is collectivism. If we wanted that, we'd be back in the USSR sending our kids to Uncle Stalin's proletariat daycare centre.


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23 Aug 2016, 7:02 pm

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Oh...but what about the plan of doing porn with me?
You have to marry me :lol:


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23 Aug 2016, 7:04 pm

RetroGamer87 wrote:
That is a culture shock. I find it hard to imagine anyone actually wanting to hold onto their virginity. Losing it, for me was a huge relief.
IDK..how hard it would be for men in my culture I need to research.


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24 Aug 2016, 2:52 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Not sure if this is a West vs East thing or it's just an individual case?


my mom was not ready to take care of my son and help me even after childbirth. but i dont see it with other couples here their mom's are willing to help whenever needed.

i think in western culture women go on dates after their husbands or after they take divorce. so they are not so much into child rearing or grandchildren stuff.

whereas here people are into family. they earn, they make houses, they give it to their sons, they buy gold and give to daughters, then third generation of grandchildren grow up around grandparents and grandparents are taken care of in old age.

but i missed out on all those things my house is very disfunctional


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24 Aug 2016, 3:14 am

Drawyer wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Oh...but what about the plan of doing porn with me?
You have to marry me :lol:


No. :ninja:



RetroGamer87
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24 Aug 2016, 4:18 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Drawyer wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Oh...but what about the plan of doing porn with me?
You have to marry me :lol:
No. :ninja:
Boo, you meanie :lol:


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