To all the bitter men

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314pe
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13 Jan 2017, 8:59 am

Sabreclaw wrote:

The more my depression improves the less interest I have in getting a girlfriend.

Why is that?

Sabreclaw
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13 Jan 2017, 9:01 am

314pe wrote:

Sabreclaw wrote:

The more my depression improves the less interest I have in getting a girlfriend.

Why is that?

I dunno. It just doesn't bother me as much as it used to.

Jacoby
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13 Jan 2017, 9:05 am

There is no point to the tired argument about who has it harder, making some declarative generalization about 50% of the population is pointless and probably not all that accurate and will just piss people off. It's better to try your best to see everyone as individual as there is such variance between the 7 billion people on this planet and it is undeniably true that individually some people do have it tangibly harder than others. Lot of bitter angry women out there just like the men, lot to be bitter and angry about these days, I feel like whatever I carry is probably a pretty rational response to what I've had to deal with.

I am more hung up about things now than I was in the past, as a lot people say us on the spectrum mature later and not linearly like NTs so there's a lot I am feeling now that wasn't there when I was 20 or definitely 15. I think that is because I am trying to push my limitations a lot more, I am fighting against my depression and anxiety that have honestly ruined my life whereas in the past I was completely avoidant to stressors altogether and now I have nowhere to hide. It's very tiring, it's wears you down and enacts a emotional toll on you for sure. What always scares me is the idea that I am too far gone or too disabled to ever be able to have any sort of life worth living no matter how hard I try, you got to have to have a reason to want to do things and to put yourself thru this hell. I don't feel a lot of purpose or happiness in my life, I just try my best to jump thru the hoops in front of me hoping that it all turns around eventually. I've become way more depressed over the last couple years that I've been trying to 'improve' myself, it's dreadful process and while I've become a good student as I've been expected to be since forever but everything else in my life is the same or worse. School will be starting soon and that will distract and overwhelm me until like May probably, this last month of so has been tough but a lot of that is family drama which is also distracting but May-June last year right after I started living alone again and school was over was probably the worst I ever was depression wise where people were really worried about me. Medications really don't help much anymore, I thought they did for awhile but now I feel like it's more just a placebo and that it doesn't really effect me much anymore. Taking on more this semester, trying to work on some long term plans, just trying to stay motivated. You can still be depressed while not wallowing in it, there isn't a switch that you can just turn on to be happy and doing something about the way you feel sometimes makes you feel worse unfortunately.

Alliekit
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13 Jan 2017, 9:17 am

nurseangela wrote:

Alliekit wrote:

Closet Genious wrote:

314pe wrote:

nurseangela wrote:

I'm having a hard time taking you seriously after reading your other posts from another thread, but, a man's main goal is to get a great paying job - which sounds exactly what you are planning.

To all the bitter men, find better paying jobs.

I guess I am screwed then, since I chose to work with something I am passionate about, knowing that my chances of earning high pay are pretty slim and it will take me years of additional experience ..Atleast my job won't bore me to death.

Nurseangela, I don't condone some of the generalisations made here, but honestly you sound just as bitter as the men here. And by the way, who the hell are you to tell me(and all men on the planet) what my main goal should be? I think men and women(individuals) should be allowed to decide that for themselves.

I wouldn't be too worried women find passion sexy. That's why you get women going after starving artists or charity workers (that and helping others is so goddamn attractive. In fact there is science behind this if you are seen helping children or animals women are more attracted to you)

My partner is in a low paying job and I don't care because everything he does he puts hard work and passion into. Ambition isn't just wealth

Are you being serious? You really want to have a family with someone who can't support a family? I know that you are going to college, so it doesn't matter to you that a future spouse wouldn't have the same ambitions? And how do you expect to have the kids, the house, the cars without a husband with a decent paying job?

I've got pretty good prospects and should earn a good wage and am happy to support my family out of that. He is a good honest man who works hard so I know he would provide as much as he could.

I want the kids and the house but I'm not as bothered about it. I grew up working class so know that hard work and grafting can get you somewhere. My father went from being a minimum wage labourer who had to work nights to a site manager who earns a good wage while my mother is only a TA.

To be honest I'm not even going for the job I am for the money. The ultimate meaning of life for me is too help others and my fiance ia a kind and honest man who puts everyone ahead of himself. Even to the point of nearly getting fired because he left work to stop his friend from commiting suicide.

Sure you can't live on love alone but living on money alone is no more fun.

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13 Jan 2017, 9:20 am

^I forgot to mention that his hard work and caring nature will make a great role model for our children. I want them to have a father they know they can always turn to

MsV
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13 Jan 2017, 9:20 am

Just from a female perspective, having a long term relationship is difficult for female Aspies too. For me at least.
I can understand at 22 or whatever age that can be incredibly frustrating and just hope that maybe this can help: love you first. Be happy with who you are, undefined by "scoring" with anyone else.
I was in a really really bad relationship for four years because I thought that's what I deserved. Afterward yes I could have gotten in new ones but I keep attracting the same type of manipulative (not so) nice guy.
So even though, yes, women in general may have it easier to get into a relationship, but at what cost if you are viewed as a naive innocent easy target and then have to deal with everything that comes with that perception (and no its not like the behavior is easily visible from the start - at least not to me)??

Ok this turned into a rant. Sorry. My point was that I too give up and will probably once again go on a "no dating" spree, admittedly voluntary, but also out of frustration and fear. So that is kind of two sides to the AS coin. But as long as you can stand and even like yourself, the bitterness should be manageable. I think at least... Ugh maybe this makes no sense at all. In which case, just another rant :?: :nerdy:

nurseangela
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13 Jan 2017, 9:22 am

Outrider wrote:

nurseangela wrote:

Closet Genious wrote:

314pe wrote:

nurseangela wrote:

I'm having a hard time taking you seriously after reading your other posts from another thread, but, a man's main goal is to get a great paying job - which sounds exactly what you are planning.

To all the bitter men, find better paying jobs.

Pardon me, but don't speak to me like that - it's rude. Also, I'm not bitter. I'm tired as hell hearing all the negativity and people feeling sorry for themselves. I pointed out the women bashing in this thread and that is all it's going to become - another women bashing thread. I'm tired of men feeling sorry for themselves and thinking they have the worst end of things. BS! Grow up. You have no idea what it is like being a woman on her own having to support herself while also having to worry if she will find a suitable husband before her biological clock runs out. To women, MEN have it easier. Men don't have to worry about getting pregnant and trying to find a way to support unplanned pregnancies because men don't want to take responsibility. Then once men get married, it's the woman also having to work and most of the time, take care of the kids. That's the reality of it all. So yes, men really just have to find a great paying job and the rest will pretty much take care of itself, IMO.

I don't agree with these men that believe women have it easier at all, personally.

The only thing I am willing to bet is that a lot of men have a lot more trouble dealing with loneliness and social isolation than women do, that or women are much, much better at keeping it all inside or only complaining to their female friends about it.

Social isolation, that is no friends, no girlfriend, and not many/no family, has been massively proven by psychologists to cause low self-esteem, depression, anxiety, and pre-mature death.

The elderly also suffer from this sort of loneliness.

Why is it there are so many lonely men complaining online in the first place? So much more than it appears to be for women?

I'm not just talking about Wrongplanet, which is a male dominated website.

I have seen this all over the internet.

I understand why you see it as whiny and unattractive. In fact most people do.

Some of us however actually see that as a problem. Not a problem because people find it 'unattractive', but because no matter where you go, no matter what forum or space, it seems men can't complain about being lonely without being criticized, shamed, guilted, called pathetic, loser, etc.

You are one of the most polite and civil person to ever have a problem with lonely men who complain.

Lonely men can't complain online about being single. Ever.

I'm not talking about the bitter, misogynistic a55es who are sexist towards women.

Those men are different to the sad depressed guy who's been trying to work hard his whole life and has tried meeting and getting to know women and has always been positive but consistently failed.

See, if you have no girlfriend, no friends and no family, whenever you feel sad or depressed, who the heck are you supposed to complain to?

Most people share their fears, worries, etc. with family and friends.

Even the men with friends often can't complain to their friends because their friends will ignore them and try to change the subject.

And there's only so much you can complain to your family about before they get sick of you.

Better to complain anonymously online on as many websites as you want, whenever you want and with other lonely people who share your pain than to be a negative, miserable bastard in real life, right?

Quote:

AND something else. If you see my posts before, I try to give a positive way to go about giving Aspie men support through a support group, but no one commented on that. I'm more of a fixer - I will listen to a person say what their "problem" is, but I will not help them to wallow in self pity. I know that I'm not where I want to be when it comes to being married and such, BUT I accept my circumstances and try to make the most of them. That is why I'm not sitting at home and feeling sorry for myself. Instead, I'm trying to better myself with more education and staying focused on the positives so I will be ready for if and when that special Hunny should come along. I've already come to terms that I will never have a family because it is too late for that for me now, but I would be perfectly content to find a Hunny who would like to be married and have fun traveling and just enjoying life. I would like to see the men on this forum come up with some positive ideas for a change like Dox47 starting that Aspie support group or that other poster who said he had "steps" for Aspie men that would make dating easier. I tried to get him to reveal what these were. Nothing comes out of being negative all of the time. I wish someone would do a positive thread for once.

This has little to do with improvement.

I complain all the time about how lonely I am but am very far down the 'self-improvement' path.

It's just even if you self-improve, you need to have people in your life, family friends and love.

I could come online and complain after another hard day's work volunteering at the Zoo, I could complain online after another heavy workout, I could complain online after coming home in my ferrari from my $100,000 per year job as a Manager at some place, etc.

Loneliness and social isolation come in all shapes and forms.

Not all of them are unfit, unattractive jobless slobs who put no effort into their health, hygiene or appearance.

A good example is the user Ecomatt.

He is confident, hardworking, has a job, has two degrees, has publicly spoken at multiple events, is an active environmentalist, has volunteered for many groups, travelled to New York, Hong Kong and other places around the world, is fit, average looking, meets new people all the time, has good number of friends, he's like a 25 year old virgin now, he has Aspergers and is legally deaf. He made a humanitarian effort in Hong Kong to help the poor or something.

Heck, even Alex is single I'm pretty sure.

ALEX.

Programmer, world traveler, web series and tv series producer, charismatic, average looking, confident, has acted before, in average shape, etc.

Alex never complains about being single, but Ecomatt does. All the time, in fact.

And you know what, in my opinion, if someone HAS improved their life and tried meeting women and is still single after several years?

They've EARNED the right to complain.

I also think you've earned the right to complain.

You don't have to be so positive and super optimistic all the time, but if you want to that's fine.

I try to but I know I can't always keep it up.

I'm not going to say that I never complain because I do. I complain to my women friends (of which I only have two) and my Ma. Women communicate by talking about their feelings - men don't know how to talk about their feelings and that is why they have no one to talk to in this regard. They are taught to hold it all in. I have even tried to talk to men about my feelings and they get so uncomfortable that I have to stop. What I have observed is that most men don't have a lot of male friends to spend fun time with and do just "guy stuff" which could help ease some depression. Men, I believe, are also conditioned that they must be in a relationship or they just aren't living up to society's expectations and aren't "manly". Fine, I get that. Even if you had some guy friends, I don't think men would feel comfortable talking to other guys about their feelings. I doubt most men will want to talk to their girlfriends or wives about their feelings either because they think the woman might see them as weak. I don't see a problem talking on a forum like this one, but when someone starts saying because women are this or women are that is the reason they end up bitter, that's what pisses me off.

Another thing is I don't like seeing people saying the same negative things over and over again about themselves. How is that going to help? It's like they don't even want to try to make things better or try to focus on the good things in their life that is happening - they just keep going over the same stuff like a broken record and all that does is keep reinforcing the negative and keeping them in a depressed state. Have you ever been around someone who is in a constant negative mood? My dad has always been like that and it just sucks the life right out of you. My next door drunk neighbor is like that and I swear since the day she moved in it's like the building has a black cloud over it and me and my neighbor friend both said that we have been depressed the whole 7 yrs she has lived here. That's why I try to keep somewhat of a positive outlook on life because people will not be drawn to a negative person. Seeing all of these negative threads, one after another, just depresses me and it actually makes me feel sad for the people writing them.

Outrider - don't take this the wrong way, but I see you saying the same negative stuff over and over and sounding depressed about yourself and nothing is changing and it makes me feel sorry for you and I don't want to feel sorry for you. I want you to see the good things about yourself and focus on those for awhile. So what if you can't have a gf at this time in your life - find something else that makes you happy. Can't you find anything positive that is happening in your life or about yourself?

_________________
Me grumpy?
I'm happiness challenged.

Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 83 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 153 of 200 You are very likely neurotypical
Darn, I flunked.

Alliekit
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13 Jan 2017, 9:26 am

MsV wrote:

Rather than love yourself I would perhaps suggest more 'accept yourself'. Understand your good points and your bad points and realise that others have their good points and their bad points.

I still stuggle to love myself but I'm fully aware of my bad points and my goodpoints. Plus it means if someone points out a bad thing about me I go 'yea I know that and I'm working on it'. For example I'm too argumentative so I need to mellow out.

The_Face_of_Boo
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13 Jan 2017, 9:33 am

I don't want a woman who wants to be depending on me.

I want a woman who will depend on herself as much she is depending on herself as single - unless she suddenly loses job and that would be temporarily; and I am not really planning to have kids.

Is that fair enough?

MsV
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13 Jan 2017, 9:34 am

Alliekit wrote:

MsV wrote:

That is better. You're so right. I wish I was as self aware at your age! Got diagnosed late and even though the following will most likely sound corny, it helps so much in the self acceptance department!

Alliekit
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13 Jan 2017, 9:36 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

That's perfectly fair

MsV
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13 Jan 2017, 9:38 am

Alliekit wrote:

^I forgot to mention that his hard work and caring nature will make a great role model for our children. I want them to have a father they know they can always turn to

He sounds amazing! So happy for you!

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13 Jan 2017, 9:46 am

Alliekit wrote:

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

That's perfectly fair

...but it's almost quasi-impossible to find. lol

Alliekit
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13 Jan 2017, 9:48 am

MsV wrote:

Alliekit wrote:

^I forgot to mention that his hard work and caring nature will make a great role model for our children. I want them to have a father they know they can always turn to

He sounds amazing! So happy for you!

Thank you I was bloody lucky to find him!

It's so weird though because at first he was completely different and I was really put off. Once I spoke to him about how I felt like I had to walk on eggshells around him he revealed to me he had been trying to be a suave gentlemen (when we had spoken online he had been very different). He was trying so hard to impress me it nearly put him off, once we spoke about it he chilled out and let out his craziness. I can actually remember after that was the first time he properly smiled it was a goofy and lopsided, still cant stay annoyed at him when he smiles like that :roll:

Alliekit
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13 Jan 2017, 9:50 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

Alliekit wrote:

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

That's perfectly fair

...but it's almost quasi-impossible to find. lol

I can understand your trouble a lot of women want babies.

As for he take care of herself I don't know if it's a massive isue in yout area but it's not so bad in england, although babies would still be a difficult one

Closet Genious
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13 Jan 2017, 9:57 am

nurseangela wrote:

Closet Genious wrote:

314pe wrote:

nurseangela wrote:

I'm having a hard time taking you seriously after reading your other posts from another thread, but, a man's main goal is to get a great paying job - which sounds exactly what you are planning.

To all the bitter men, find better paying jobs.

I am not sure who you are responding to. I never said that women have it easier than men, that was not what my post was about at all. I find it paradoxical however that it bothers you so much that others feel sorry for themselves, when you clearly do the same thing.

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