Identifying toxic/abusive people who are stealthy & complex

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SSJ4_PrestonGarvey:

They may be golden in the eyes of a particular group of people while others know their true colors because they have been mistreated too or have witnessed them treat others a certain way.

While they seem to be the good guys in the others of others, that may not last very long because others will soon figure it out that they lie. How do they do this?
1. Most liers can't keep their stories straight
2. Most of them end up self-destructing
3. Others on the outside will see their true colors

I just want to understand motives and methods to be prepared to detect it, deal with it or at least be better at avoiding it. I also found it relevant here since they seem to target people with Aspergers or other mental illness. I think it may be a sort of hybrid thing since there's traits from antisocial, narcissism, etc.

They are able to decide on someone as a new target even before speaking/hearing them speak. Like just purely from nonverbal cues like body language and facial expressions. When you speak to them they already decided to target you and already are executing a strategy. I think an effective blind spot(for other people including Aspergers or NTs) is using "paradoxical" behaviours as a focal point, basically behaviours that cause an opposite reaction from what you might expect. Hindsight is usually 20/20 and it oftentimes appears that "mistakes" were actually planned by them.

The method when generalized is simply this: creating a behavioural feedback loop that causes toxic results and is stable/self-perpetuating. Results would be toxic to self-identity/self-esteem so basically shame and also to social reputation. Make them shamed by themself and also by the group. The end-game goal is causing a traumatic event especially if they can get the target to be upset enough to do something severe enough to get arrested. When they believe this is at hand they will state intentions more clearly basically dropping the facade. One quote of this variety that I remember is this "I can't ***ing wait till you get locked up in prison and I can't ***ing wait to hear about your Dropped the Soap in the group showers story, maybe you'll even die in there wouldn't that be ****ing fantastic!?". Another one was saying pretty much it would be a good thing if there were another holocaust specifically to get rid of the mentally ill people. Their facade is basically that generally they are as charming as Ellen Degeneres but inside they are pure Dark Triad like extremely sadistic and psychotic.

A small theory I have about this is perhaps they want to shape you into what you hate most or cause you to experience the event you desire the least? They may have some kind of reason to intensely hate those with mental illness.


I use "complex" in the sense that these people aim for psychological consequences which certainly isn't what typical bullies do. Most bullies aren't actively aware of the consequences for victims. These ones are aware and are actively trying to maximize it, and create other real life consequences for victims.


Maybe it could simply be experience, for those who seem to elude this?

Twilight!! !! I can't thank you enough for that list. I have the same list written in one of my notebooks. You saved me a ton of typing.

So true. Mean people out there.

Preston, don't trust anyone til they prove themselves to you. You are a wonderful person from what I see.

It's just scary cause they can "prove" themselves through trickery and deceit. They know what appeals to a person like what they're looking for and how to make connections with people. There are certain behaviours that signal to others that a person is safe/trustworthy and these people know how to fake those as good as or even better than a genuine good people. Meanwhile they can already identify weaknesses even if I don't share anything about myself even if I keep it to "Hello", "How are you" and "Good Bye".

It's like maybe they can be a brilliant psychologist or therapist but choose to use it for evil instead. Using it for good might lead to psychology breakthroughs or being the ultimate life coach.

They are very skilled at manipulating but after years of experience, those bumholes don't get far with me. Anyone that tries to get too close too soon, is suspicious to me. Preston, watch for that. Look at the people they hang around with. Are you included or are you only in the picture when their friends aren't around? Do you have something they want?

Don't trust anyone too much. Keep people at arms length. Don't confide in people.

Preston, have you been hurt by one of these types?

Preston, look at certain professions that thrive on a lack of ethics. Your deadly sociopath is likely to be there.

Former employer and multiple co-workers.

I conclude that my behaviour has patterns that consistently leads to these scenarios and can be counted upon to do so for the foreseeable future if no changes are made.


I don't know. The only things by default would be wanting to steer my life towards disasters. Like hate fantasys.

They'd say stuff like "You'd be doing the world a hell of a lot of good if you KYS" or that other example is like fantasizing about their target being physically or maybe sexually abused(Prison & dropping the soap "joke"). Or "Have you ever self-harmed? Why not? If I were you I am certain that I would self harm on a daily basis, perhaps the diagonal cut that leads to fatal bleeding."

Psychod$cks!

Mine would gaslight me endlessly and have me question my abilities. It was horrible.

Excellent advice. I have dealt with people who tried getting too close too soon. These same people often too eager to help with things like transportation. They want to get your most vulnerable family members alone so they can manipulate them and take advantage of them.

Maybe it's just the Aspergers in me but why would they want to manipulate them and take advantage of them? I just don't get the motives and the end game.

Is it to kill people without ever being convicted of crimes, they simply decide they would like that person to die?

I get a sense when toxic people would bring up suicide that they were excited for this moment and likely had been planning for it for a while. Like the self harm statement thing, they obviously hoped I actually would try it. What I also presume to be obviously is that death is the intention as they pointed specifically at the major artery in the wrist whereby an incision can cause death by bleeding within a few minutes. All that is clear to me is they have some kind of specific goals in mind and are extremely meticulous about it. They want something bad to happen to me but who really knows why or why I'm special for some reason?

HistoryGal has a point about people who get too close to you or are only nice when their friends aren't around. Usually, the ones that get close will talk about other people by
1. Making fun of them
2. Makeup stories about them

Sometimes these people who they are talking about are those who they hang out with on a regular basis.
Another thing they will do is use you for things or get you to do things for them while they never return the favor for you.

Another red flag that you will notice is that this person talks to you, it's usually when no one is around. Then when you try and tell others that you are "Friends" with this person, other people go "What are you talking about? That person told me he/she hates you." Then they believe that you are the liar.

There is one lady at my church who gossips about everyone. She made up nasty stuff about the pastor too because she doesn't like him.

Another red flag would be sneaking around to see you. If they don't want their spouse or other people knowing that they hang out with you, they will come around when their spouse or other people aren't around.

I stopped doing things for this one lady because she never did anything for me in return. When I needed something, she was nowhere to be found.

That congregant member sounds like an evil person who was there to cause trouble.

Two circumstances in my case:
1. I worked with a lady who was around at one of my previous jobs who happened to latch herself onto others and lie about them like she did with me while telling other people that we were not friends and getting them to believe that I had made it up.
2. The second was a woman who I thought was my friend turned out to just be using me out of loneliness and pretended to be someone who she wasn't by lying to me about all of her interests. Rather she never liked me and was always putting me down throughout the "Friendship."

Hahaha people that are ashamed to be with us out in the open get nowhere with me. At my age, I can have an attitude.

I definitely am done with people who are ashamed to be seen with me.

Lady Elaine and History Gal, those kinds of people probably feel ashamed of themselves and perhaps see something in us that makes them feel bad along with being really shallow.

The girl who lied about everyone had invited me to her wedding and asked me to get her a gift while asking me to help with the guest book. The next thing I knew, she had convinced others that I had showed up last minute and invited myself there. So she put me in the guest book so I wouldn't bother her other guests.