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Jasparch
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04 Jun 2015, 4:49 pm

Hey all
I have been trying to make sense of my life and my mind for a long time now.
I feel like I have found out a lot about myself.
Diagnosed with emotionally unstable personality disorder and symptoms of bipolar , to only be told my symptoms are too rapid for bipolar, ie, moods too up and down, can last minutes and be very extreme.
And now am going through an Asperger assessment... About half way through...
But...
I get this feeling sometimes. It's like fear of self awareness. I drive, and during this time, I am alone, and my mind wanders, I become conscious that I am a human, I become almost embarrassed of myself. I'm not ashamed of who I am, I don't hate myself, but I'm embarrassed of my mind, like , I am struggling so much here to explain, but it's like , Yiu know when you're with someone you hardly know, and it's majorly awkward, similar to like being in a lift ... I get that feeling, but I'm on my own, and im getting the awkwardness with myself. It really makes me so anxious, usually as an escape I call someone, then the feeling goes away and im no longer so over conscious of myself, but it comes back, especially if im in the bath, or looking at mysef in the mirror, I just can't handle making eye contact with myself. Seriously what's up with that?
I don't like to masturbate because I'm so embarrassed and no ones even there! It's just me!
But it's so severe to a point where I sit with my head in my hands, thinking , 'brain, stop being so aware!'
I've googled it and I've never met anyone with it so severe or even know a name forit.
Hoping on replies ️️anyway and thanks for reading.
:jester:



MollyTroubletail
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04 Jun 2015, 5:52 pm

Self-consciousness is an acute sense of self-awareness. It is a preoccupation with oneself, as opposed to the philosophical state of self-awareness, which is the awareness that one exists as an individual being; although some writers use both terms interchangeably or synonymously.[1] An unpleasant feeling of self-consciousness may occur when one realizes that one is being watched or observed, the feeling that "everyone is looking" at oneself. Some people are habitually more self-conscious than others. Unpleasant feelings of self-consciousness are sometimes associated with shyness or paranoia.

When feeling self-conscious, one becomes aware of even the smallest of one's own actions. Such awareness can impair one's ability to perform complex actions. Adolescence is believed to be a time of heightened self-consciousness. A person with a chronic tendency toward self-consciousness may be shy or introverted.

Unlike self-awareness, which in a philosophical context is being conscious of oneself as an individual, self-consciousness, being excessively conscious of one's appearance or manner, can be a problem at times. Self-consciousness is often associated with shyness and embarrassment, in which case a lack of pride and low self-esteem can result. In a positive context, self-consciousness may affect the development of identity, for it is during periods of high self-consciousness that people come the closest to knowing themselves objectively. Self-consciousness affects people in varying degrees, as some people are constantly self-monitoring or self-involved, while others are completely oblivious about themselves.[3]

Psychologists frequently distinguish between two kinds of self-consciousness, private and public. Private self-consciousness is a tendency to introspect and examine one's inner self and feelings. Public self-consciousness is an awareness of the self as it is viewed by others. This kind of self-consciousness can result in self-monitoring and social anxiety. Both private and public self-consciousness are viewed as personality traits that are relatively stable over time, but they are not correlated. Just because an individual is high on one dimension doesn't mean that he or she is high on the other



Jasparch
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05 Jun 2015, 7:49 pm

Hey. that was really interesting to read, but it still doesn't feel like it answers my question.
I am sometimes, usually, an extrovert, but not where I want to socialise, but one where I'm not scared , ashamed, or shy, sometimes I'm quite blunt, and will say, 'dont wanna speak, leave me alone, dont like you' but like not embarrased.
The feeling I get, is not where I feel people are watching me, all eyes on me, ts when I am around people or speaking I actually feel ok, and the bad feeling goes away, but its when I am alone, I feel like I am watching myself, and I don't like it, I am so aware I am a person, but I don't mind that, I just hate being the person I am, but if I was anyone else I know I would feel the same. I wish I was oblivious to who I am. I have never knew who I am, and have always been lost, but the fact I am a person who can think and just exist, whilst judging myself kind of, it scares me, it really does, It just makes me want to take drugs of any kind cos then I'm high and forget who I am, and dont think so deep into being a person!
I sound crazy I know it, but I dont speak of this fear cos its so complex.I just pretty much hate being alone with my own thoughts, when I am not concentrating on something I think about thinking, and I become so aware I am one person, and I will always be me, and it just proper gets to me, and I just end up calling somone and asking how their day is even though Im not actually interested I just want to stop thinking and being alone with myself!
I knew I wouldnt get answers I cant even explain it so how am I ever gonna get a answer. Just usually theres been hurdles with my mental health, they have always had a name, a reason, but this, its jsut mental! Its like, I couldnt ever look myself in the mirror for longer than a minute or so, not because of my looks, because im happy with them, but because I can see myself, looking myself in the eye, feels like.... its just too much!
:( pray to god i can understand better one day.
So jealous how everyone else doesnt get it! just me!



dryope
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14 Jun 2015, 11:19 pm

I feel like your question is close to a question I've been asking myself: Why can I sometimes interact with people effortlessly and also juggle tasks easily sometimes...and other times I seem to be completely in my head, over-analyzing every little thing and thinking about myself, and also at the same time misunderstand others, misrepresent myself, and get confused doing even simple things?

I've gone down the rabbit hole a bit on this in PubMed searches, and I wouldn't say that I'm sure I know the answer. But I do know that the "good" state of mind is correlated with spending hours and hours on very slow, deliberate tasks, like organizing and drawing, and the "bad" state of mind is my more common experience, which seems to creep back in as soon as I go back into the world. Basically, if I spend a lot of time alone in deliberative tasks, I get a few hours to days among other people where I am in the "good" state, but this erodes into the "bad" state. This is like the common idea we have that folks with ASD need lots of time with special interests to get over interaction with the outside world.

I first searched on meditation, because that seems to be a similar mental state to the kind I get when I do these deliberative tasks. I found an article from Garrison et al where they hooked up experienced meditators to fMRIs and found that the the state of "undistracted awareness" and being in the moment is associated with deactivation of the posterior cingulate cortex (PCC).

Here is that one: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3734786/

That led me to an article by Gentili et al that suggested social phobia has to do with an impairment in the default mode network (DMN), including the PCC, leading to a feeling of wariness of others, a focus on the self, and which may prevent individuals from observing external info that could disconfirm their fears.

Here is that one: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0361923009000628

Then I found an article by Leech and Sharp that is well worth reading (free full text available). It claims that autistic individuals have abnormalities in the PCC that correlate to severity of symptoms and that ADHD -- often co-morbid with autism -- may be involved with a dysfunction in DMN regulation. Depression adds more factors to this, basically leading to excessive rumination. (It also argues that different parts of the PCC do different things, which gets pretty interesting.)

Here is that one: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3891440/#!po=47.9730

So I am now focused on seeing how much I can shift my thinking in my private time to prevent the "bad" state -- essentially practicing things like the N-back test -- the last study mentioned fMRIs show that brains of individuals engaged in the N-back test are active in the areas that the first study mentioned were active during meditation. So I do the N-back test as a kind of biofeedback to train me to recognize that mental state. (Just google "N-back test" if you're interested in trying it out.)

My hypothesis is that if I spend enough time regularly in this state -- hopefully through drawing with the right mindset rather than the boring N-back test -- then I will train my brain to stay in the "good" state longer, and to return it easier. I don't know if I have a regulatory issue or what, but clearly something is going on. It's almost like thinking gives me a headache and I think constantly -- about myself, about what I'm planning, what I've done, on and on. It's like my thoughts are pounding fists in my head. It's unpleasant, and exactly the kind of thinking (remembering, planning, thinking about the self) as that that the studies above describe as taking place in the DMN -- though I think mine is more problematic than normal brains'. But when I am in the "good" state, I have no need to do this...and I also talk to people without too much drama.

Anyway, does this resonate with you? I've been pretty obsessed with this this past week but neuroscience is not my field, so I'm just learning as I go here. I'm reassured by the idea that no one is really an expert in this subject -- there is still so much we don't know.


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ArcadeBlaze88
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19 Jun 2015, 10:12 pm

Hey Jasparch,

I was reading your post and I think what you might be experiencing is something in the realm of Depersonalization/Derealization. It's like those moments when you're using the bathroom and you suddenly become aware that you're a creature called a human with a certain name and all of a sudden existence seems extremely bizarre and off-putting. Usually those moments go away after a minute or so, but sometimes they can stick around for a long time. It can be an enlightening time, eventually, but it can also cause a pretty serious existential crisis (which can then cause crazy amounts of anxiety).

You should research Depersonalization/Derealization and see if any of the descriptions or stories sound like what you're feeling. I have the same issues as well and have a lot of really odd thoughts that are hard to shake and make me feel very strange for periods of time (I won't post any so as not to get your mind distracted on another facet of existence, lol).

I don't have autism or asperbergers, I was cruising the forums for info for a friend but noticed your post and thought I'd toss in my two cents.

To finish, I'll say that I had a therapist that told me I was realizing that I had taken everything in life for granted before and never realized why people do the things that they do and how strange and random the idea of being a human is. But if you try thinking of it like you used to think about life, you realize that it also makes complete sense as to why things are the way they are and why we do what we do (ie why we think, why we speak, why we like to eat food). Existence is an odd thing, but it has evolved this way for a reason. I hope this has been helpful, at least in a way that you know someone else out there has felt weird about being a human, too. I think its more common than we think.

If you think it'll help, you can try reading Albert Camus's The Myth of Sisyphus, which I found helpful. There is also Jean Paul Sartre's Nausea, but its like way heavy and depressing and might not be so great if you're already struggling with making sense of being a person. But it might be good for a future read.

Take it easy everyone!



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20 Jun 2015, 8:52 pm

I have some experiences like this. I too have trouble looking myself in the eyes. It's like looking at a stranger. I don't know why. I noticed today at the gym where there is a mirrored wall, I caught myself briefly making a facial expression at myself as if I was there with a friend and thinking what to do next in the workout. I don't think the other person there noticed. If they did, I don't think I really care. It wasn't that noticeable I hope and could have looked like a little facial tic or something.

When I was younger I used to have the really scary more derealization/depersonalizations things where I'd be alone and suddenly the reality of my existence would painfully and abruptly ascend on me. I think it's from spending so much time deep in thought combined with overwhelm and tiredness. It happened most often at the end of the day when I was doing homework alone in my room in the quiet. Seems familiar that's when it was most often. I think during the day we forget about the life things and our recurrent issues like socialization, organizational stuff, will things ever be better, etc. The past and present get muddled some when you have so much to think about and have to put so much effort and thought into things most people don't have to think much about that the brain sort of "trips a circuit" when you are in a "safe" place (like alone and aren't distracted) and everything that worries you hits you and leaves you at the same time so you are temporarily at a standstill. Kind of like when a pendulum reaches the farthest it can go, technically it might appear or actually stop moving for a second or less before it falls back in the opposite direction. Your brain just kind of "stuns" and if it doesn't start up again, you have to do something about it yourself, like you said call someone. If I remember correctly I used to have a lot of anxiety when this happened, especially when it would go away easily. It's like calling someone is a grounding sort of thing?

Anyway, as I have gotten older, it doesn't happen anymore. It's been a long time anyway. Sure made me think so was losing my mind though.

Do you sleep enough?


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beneficii
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22 Jun 2015, 4:04 am

QuiversWhiskers wrote:
I have some experiences like this. I too have trouble looking myself in the eyes. It's like looking at a stranger. I don't know why. I noticed today at the gym where there is a mirrored wall, I caught myself briefly making a facial expression at myself as if I was there with a friend and thinking what to do next in the workout. I don't think the other person there noticed. If they did, I don't think I really care. It wasn't that noticeable I hope and could have looked like a little facial tic or something.

When I was younger I used to have the really scary more derealization/depersonalizations things where I'd be alone and suddenly the reality of my existence would painfully and abruptly ascend on me. I think it's from spending so much time deep in thought combined with overwhelm and tiredness. It happened most often at the end of the day when I was doing homework alone in my room in the quiet. Seems familiar that's when it was most often. I think during the day we forget about the life things and our recurrent issues like socialization, organizational stuff, will things ever be better, etc. The past and present get muddled some when you have so much to think about and have to put so much effort and thought into things most people don't have to think much about that the brain sort of "trips a circuit" when you are in a "safe" place (like alone and aren't distracted) and everything that worries you hits you and leaves you at the same time so you are temporarily at a standstill. Kind of like when a pendulum reaches the farthest it can go, technically it might appear or actually stop moving for a second or less before it falls back in the opposite direction. Your brain just kind of "stuns" and if it doesn't start up again, you have to do something about it yourself, like you said call someone. If I remember correctly I used to have a lot of anxiety when this happened, especially when it would go away easily. It's like calling someone is a grounding sort of thing?

Anyway, as I have gotten older, it doesn't happen anymore. It's been a long time anyway. Sure made me think so was losing my mind though.

Do you sleep enough?


Some researchers would call this strong introspective tendency hyperreflectivity (from hyper- + reflectivity, as in reflection). The researchers who look at this did so while studying schizophrenia, which can involve many "as if," non-psychotic experiences the same as depersonalization, though it has extra non-psychotic experiences that don't occur in depersonalization disorder, those appearing to be "erosion of first-person perspective" and a tendency to confuse oneself with others and/or the world. Basically, the strong introspective tendency of hyperreflectivity is an aspect of hyperreflexivity (with an 'x'), which involves being not simply living in the hear and now but an abnormal awareness in many different ways, including being way too introspective. This can lead to and strengthen something called diminished self-affection, which in its pure form equates to depersonalization and derealization.

https://www.sussex.ac.uk/webteam/gatewa ... df&site=42

The best medicine is definitely finding something that you can get into without having to sit and think all the time. Find something to get your body going, something that excites you, and play it out!


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Oxytocin
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27 Jun 2015, 7:59 am

I was chatting with the OP in private messages recently, but now when I click on their profile it says "this user doesn't exist"... I thought there was no way to cancel your account (I just checked in my preferences and I don't see the option anywhere), how did they do that? Or is that an error because of the update to the site recently? I can still access their author page http://wrongplanet.net/author/jasparch and I can still PM them, but yet when you click on their profile button here in this thread it says "the requested user doesn't exist".

Does anyone know what's going on? Jasparch I hope you didn't cancel your account, I liked you! :( And plus people are here to try to help you, look at all the helpful feedback since you last posted! Anyway if anyone knows what's up with that please let me know (I also have the same message for another person I was PMing and it says they don't exist now either). Mods maybe you might know? (Did they both cancel their accounts because of my PMs, am I that scary? :( lol)



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29 Jun 2015, 6:03 am

I just tried clicking on Jasparch's name myself and it gave me the same message: This user does not exist. Odd. Tried some others and only one did that though I haven't PM'd anyone. Don't know what it means either. Did you pose this question in the Wrong Planet website subforum?



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03 Jul 2015, 7:05 pm

Boy can I relate. I think you may be suffering from empathy. Sounds crazy I know. But I think that much of our brain worry comes from wanting to be a better person to others for their sake. I am often afraid of failing at making others happier because of my presence. Of course, I am also afraid of having no one to care for and share my deepest and most meaningful selves. And ruining my precious ties with family and friends.
We're afraid of our minds sometimes. Usually when your mind is active, there is some kind of genius or creativity trying to get out. Don't force the issue or doubt yourself much. Just let the back and forth logic of your mind become you. Let all the demons and gods of your mind act without judgement. Your mind will make judgements automatically. Remember, you are very fortunate to not have many or any biases. Your neuro-diverse mind is designed to strive for truth. Let it.



selin
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17 Jul 2015, 1:02 pm

Hmm about this self-awareness...Do you feel like you are being watched? but by something abstract? So not by a person who you imagine is in the room but like *the idea* of other people watching you is too real, you misplace it so that you feel it even when people aren't around? That might create the horrible self-awareness. I find it very distracting and it's difficult to do many things because of it.



beneficii
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17 Jul 2015, 5:02 pm

selin wrote:
Hmm about this self-awareness...Do you feel like you are being watched? but by something abstract? So not by a person who you imagine is in the room but like *the idea* of other people watching you is too real, you misplace it so that you feel it even when people aren't around? That might create the horrible self-awareness. I find it very distracting and it's difficult to do many things because of it.


Feeling like you're being watched is a bit different from dissociation: It's more like paranoia. Nevertheless, it might trigger dissociation.


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