What you think about forced sterilization?

Post Reply New Topic

I read an interesting article
http://www.newsleader.com/story/news/lo ... a/7641615/

About guy who from USA who was misdiagnosed as dump as kid and sterilized under Eugenic laws, he was later found normal intelligence and worked in Police and even FBI.

When I think about it, I think that if I were to place this guy, that if I was an FBI agent, is this what happened to him, it was me in his place, would contact the local residency of the KGB and sold for big money every "top secret" document I fell to my hands, why should be faithful to the country which hurt you.

"America's shame" has become a cliche but in the case of eugenics it is as accurate a statement that can be made

Wikipedia - Eugenics in the United States

So when Autism Speaks and others extensively use the "burden" language that was of often used by eugenicists, they pour money into genetics research and when taking into account the country where they were founded and are headquartered, suspicion that Autism Speaks has eugenics intentions is far from just paranoia.

Believe it or not, there are actually some parents who use the same eugenicists' "burden" language to justify their desire to chemically and/or surgically sterilize their own pre-pubescent children in order to keep them docile and manageable.

They're only supposed to spay and neuter their family dogs!

Children are not dogs.

What are you talking about?

Parents who use the same eugenicists' "burden" language to justify their desire to chemically and/or surgically sterilize their own pre-pubescent children in order to keep them docile and manageable.

What are you talking about?

You're right, my blood pressure jumped when I read that if you refer to this article?
http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archi ... fe/279765/

Maybe let's change the subject, I wonder if you sell the secrets of their country, to enemy countries to take revenge that your own state you hurt you in the past?

I think it's horrible. I would hate to have my tubes tied against my will even though I don't want kids.

I understand, but if you wanted to somehow take revenge on you country?

Eugenics is a shameful chapter of the history of many countries. Essentially, certain individuals were deemed to be less desirable than the rest, and so whether because of mental or physical defect, or race, it was decided they should not be allowed to produce children. I agree, we on the autistic spectrum need to be on guard against those who speak of us being a burden, especially when they claim to represent our best interests.

I can't say I like "eugenics," but I've long passed the point of believing that reproduction is a human right.

There is so much evidence that letting humans reproduce just because they have functioning organs isn't sound policy. Lots of people who are unfit to be parents are producing kids who are neglected, lots of parents who will pass on genetic disorders choose to have children knowing of the risk of passing on those disorders, and frankly, we can't keep breeding like rats because the global population is only sustainable because technology makes it possible to feed everyone (and that could change overnight).

My biggest issue would be how to determine who should make the decision of a couple could have a kid or what the standards should be for determining if someone is fit to be a parent.

So you believe we Aspies shouldn't be allowed to pass along our "genetic disorder?" Well, too bad, so sad for you, because I already did.

That was good

But the truth is that some syndromes can be transmitted genetically.

For example, my mother thinks my father, who died in 2002 due to cardiomyopathy, also suffered from Asperger's, but in the 70s and 80s in communist Poland, no one had heard of such a thing as Autism or Asperger Syndrome.

My father was a very busy, it was just a workaholic, than it was a very meticulous and precise, he had quite specific, sometimes macabre sense of humor, for example, my dad suffered from a hernia, it was a small defect, there were indications for surgery.
But my dad always postponed it until later, Dad was afraid of surgeons.
But when I finally decided it was too late, because sooner had already begun to heart problems, and it was a contraindication to performing unnecessary surgeries for not life threatening illness.

Returning to the subject, even when dad was dying would not leave his sense of humor, once he asked during his doctor does when finally kick the bucket does they make him surgery for that damn hernia

The only downside of my father was that he could not control his temper, easily upset, a little like Dr. House MD


My mom thinks I inherited Asperger's syndrome, after my dad.

My mother read some books about Asperger's Syndrome and is confident that he had AS too

Your description of your dad reminds me a lot of my dad, who was very intellectual, very precise with his hobby of gardening, and - oh Lordy - did he have a short fuse! I'm pretty sure my dad, had he been analyzed, would have been diagnosed as an Aspie.
As for Poland not knowing what Asperger's was back in the eighties and before - same here in America. I was only diagnosed later in life. Back as a kid, they pigeonholed me as hyperactive because they apparently had no idea how to classify me.

I'd say we live in a world where the most feasible solutions to problems generally find rhythm with optimal humanity more by accident than anything else. This is a case where happy accidents, ie. having kids turn out on one's personal merits rather than genetics, generally haven't been the case.

The trouble with human genetic testing and forced sterilizations is that the people who'd be considered the arbiters of such decisions are as fickle as the people whose tubes they'd consider worthy of tying. That and our understanding of epigenetics and how much they can or can't change is another stumbling block in the way of accurately prognosticating a person's future by reading their genes.

A concern I'd consider to be much more relevant than trying to decide who should have a right to their own fecundity is who should have a right to parent. Not to be used too liberally I can think of a lot of cases where absentee or deadbeat parenting should be displaced by boarding schools; something to break the cycle of a parent's maladjustment from necessarily becoming their child's maladjustment. IMHO that's a much more resolvable problem at this point rather than setting a person's future in stone when we just don't know enough about what can or can't be done with the human genetic code.

Why is everyone using the past tense? It's not like the 1920's Buck v. Bell ruling (that it's okay to sterilize disabled people) has been overturned.

During a period of four years (2006-2010 at least 148 women at the California Institution for Women in Corona and Valley State Prison for Women in Chowchilla, CA were given tubal ligations. They were coerced by doctors who failed to explain the medical intricacies of the surgeries they were about to undergo. Each prison surgery requires medical oversight by a review committee, something that did not happen during those four years.
http://cironline.org/reports/female-inmates-sterilized-california-prisons-without-approval-4917

Also, 24 European countries - and more than half of the United States - force trans people to agree to sterilization before they can legally transition to their identified gender.

1. We need to have our basic human rights reestablished not have even more taken from us. In some communities, a person can't even have lawn decorations in the yard that a person paid for with his or her own money. THAT is not freedom, that is nitpicking people and forcing them to adhere to the wishes of others. Lawn décor is not a crime nor should it be enforced at all. It's ridiculous and is the very minimal of a long list of rights that have been taken from us.
2. However, two wrongs do NOT make a right. IOW, when one person acts like a moron, we do not benefit by acting moronic ourselves. Which, is a prime example of how idiocy is perpetuated. If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything. Also, in retaliating with such magnitude, a person would in essence be hurting and possibly causing the deaths of many people because of a pain that was inflicted on them. We should use our pain and experience to change the world for the better, not to create, enable, or propel even more destruction. When people really learn and believe that lesson, they will grow stronger and change the world in a positive way.