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Lintar
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10 Aug 2017, 9:09 pm

Maybe this is a silly question, but does Google control Bing? I've been using Bing instead because it isn't Google, but they didn't buy it up or anything did they? I hope not, because I don't want to go back to using Yandex.



Marknis
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11 Aug 2017, 11:47 am

Chronos wrote:
Marknis wrote:
Chronos wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
His argument:

Women in tech are underpaid/underrepresented because of biological traits that make them less successful as men.


He also thinks women are more neurotic than men, and have lower stress tolerances, due to their biology, which I disagree with.


Speaking as a male, I definitely have a hard time with stress. At the end of the day, it's the individual that should be looked at.

I think the expectation that men are supposed to "suck it up", suppress their emotions, and force themselves when it comes to getting a job or getting promoted is hazardous to many mens' health.


I agree. People are individuals first and men should not always have to suppress their emotions. There were no prohibitions against men crying in my family. My father cried more than my mother and I always thought he was a strong person for that because in our society it takes a brave man to cry.


I was once going into the break room at my job and one of my co-workers was telling another co-worker she wanted a mug that said "White Male Tears" as I walked in. She noticed me and quickly said "Don't worry, Mark. I am not saying that to you. Just the white male patriarchy." I told her in response, "If I cry, it's because I am hurt. It's not because my 'priveleges' are being denied or taken away." before I left.

This is partly why I don't fit in with either the left or right. The left thinks I am upset that my 'priveleges' are being taken away while the right thinks I am a 'wuss' who needs to 'toughen the f**k up'. Until someone can show me how I am being guaranteed a mansion, high level work position, a 7 figure income, and harem of young girls or that crying from pain is truly 'wussy', I will continue to defy both sides.



LoveNotHate
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11 Aug 2017, 2:24 pm

He sterotypes male and female personalities.

A scientific approach would be to cite research into the Mejers Briggs personality classification by gender.

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hurtloam
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11 Aug 2017, 4:39 pm

I thought this was an interesting article, mostly because her experience was similar to mine. Then men around me were learning to program for fun in their spare time. I didn't want to. I realised that there is no way I could be as good as them because I really didn't want to or enjoy it enough to be bothered.

I enjoyed 9-5 programming much more than I do an admin job. Admin is boring, but I want a job, not a career that is going to drain all of my time and you can't be a programmer and just work 9-5. You've got to be more dedicated and I wasn't interested enough to do that. I just like it more than admin. So I've gone back to admin because I can go home at night and do things that I actually enjoy without feeling guilty that I'm not putting enough effort into my job.

http://www.startribune.com/that-guy-at-google-was-right-about-women-in-tech/439744793/



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11 Aug 2017, 4:49 pm

Lintar wrote:
hurtloam wrote:
They're buying into a dog eat dog philosophy because it makes logical sense, but what they really need is the exact same thing we all need. Love, respect and understanding.


"Dog-eat-dog" philosophies never make any sense, logical or otherwise.


Please elaborate, I'm interested.

I think that we are all too harsh on each other in this world. That keeps on perpetuating because people think, "well, I'm just going to give as good as I get." and it just goes on and on and on.

I often stop and realise what good friends I've actually got. They are not cool, they're not popular, but they are caring and they are interesting and I enjoy spending time with them. I don't understand these guys who want to shout about what makes the world unfair or what makes people nasty and shallow.

I'd rather spend my time seeking out kindred spirits and enjoying them and just leaving the shallow people I don't get on with to live their lives.

One or two things irk me. Say when my friends get hurt, I will b***h quite publicly about that. I especially don't like the way society treats single people and I think that most people who know me are getting sick of my rants. So I do have concerns.

I can understand the need for justice, but when only seeing a snippet of people's lives through what they write on the internet, it looks like this anger consumes their thoughts (like Google guy) and that makes me sad. There are good things to be enjoyed in life. Being obsessed with looking up studies and writing memos and on forums about how screwed up people are encourages negative thoughts in one's own head and I don't think that's healthy.



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11 Aug 2017, 5:17 pm

Lintar wrote:
Quote:
In the memo, which is the personal opinion of a male Google employee and is titled "Google's Ideological Echo Chamber", the author argues that women are underrepresented in tech not because they face bias and discrimination in the workplace, but because of inherent psychological differences between men and women.


So he got fired for telling the truth.

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - wrong with what he wrote, and much of it is patently obvious to anyone with a functioning brain, which apparently those idiots at Google don't have.



Here's a quote from that article I linked.

Quote:
Damore should probably have used fewer words with high negative emotional indices when more neutral ones were available.


He framed his position badly. He could have made the same points in a much more engaging manner, but instead he set out to attack. He just comes over confrontational and bitter and that attitude doesn't foster a positive work environment.

It's like a dog with its hackles up baring its teeth at you.



karathraceandherspecialdestiny
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11 Aug 2017, 7:04 pm

Duh guys, women are obviously biologically unsuitable for tech jobs. It's science.

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Chronos
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11 Aug 2017, 10:13 pm

hurtloam wrote:
Lintar wrote:
Quote:
In the memo, which is the personal opinion of a male Google employee and is titled "Google's Ideological Echo Chamber", the author argues that women are underrepresented in tech not because they face bias and discrimination in the workplace, but because of inherent psychological differences between men and women.


So he got fired for telling the truth.

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - wrong with what he wrote, and much of it is patently obvious to anyone with a functioning brain, which apparently those idiots at Google don't have.



Here's a quote from that article I linked.

Quote:
Damore should probably have used fewer words with high negative emotional indices when more neutral ones were available.


He framed his position badly. He could have made the same points in a much more engaging manner, but instead he set out to attack. He just comes over confrontational and bitter and that attitude doesn't foster a positive work environment.

It's like a dog with its hackles up baring its teeth at you.


I didn't get the impression that his intent was to attack. I think he just thought he was being logical, but he suffers from the same situational myopia that has plagues humans for decades, which makes it difficult for one to fully understand the experiences and perspectives of groups of which they are not a part of.

It was not uncommon in the 19th century and early 20th century to find papers on the "primitive man", meaning people who lived in tribal societies, often in Africa or the Amazon, and scientists of the day, who were almost entirely European men, would inevitably conclude these naked tribal people were inferior to white Europeans and this would seem like a logical an obvious conclusion to them because European ideas of superiority were based on technology. So they concluded these technologically less advanced individuals who ran around naked were also less intelligent, less moral, and had less complex societies than Europeans. Of course that isn't actually true. A conversation with your average person from a tribal society would reveal they are just as intelligent and their society is just a complex as "civilized" societies. That even though they wear fewer clothes, they have concepts of modesty...there are appropriate and inappropriate ways to act in their society, and they are not the barbaric savages that just run nilly willy around the jungle that these scientists had pegged them as.

In one instance, I think in the mid 20th century after the dropping of the atomic bombs, one tribesman from possibly an Amazonian tribe, on seeing footage of this, remarked to an anthropologist that the white man calls his people barbaric because they are head hunters, but he knows who he kills, and only kills who he knows, but "civilized" people kill indiscriminately and it was actually they who were barbaric.



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12 Aug 2017, 1:03 am

I feel like he was attacking Google and therefore overly forceful. I didn't mean he was attacking women. Sorry I should have made that more clear.

I'm enjoying your points here chronos.



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15 Aug 2017, 12:50 am

Fired Google Engineer Says It’s ‘Likely’ He Is On The Autism Spectrum

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The former, temporary Harvard doctoral student revealed his personal inklings during an “ask me anything” (AMA) session on the social news platform Reddit, after a user expressed empathy.

“Hello James. I have been diagnosed with Autism Spectrum Disorder and I recognised a lot of myself in your interviews,” Reddit user “TheKingsRaven” said. “I was curious if you’ve ever been diagnosed with ASD/Autism/Asperger's [sic] yourself? Sorry if this is too personal.”

Damore appeared to have no qualms with the question, answering in a straightforward, apparently honest way.

“I am likely on the spectrum,” Damore said, “because my thinking is very pattern oriented and I didn’t start talking until much later than normal.”

Another Redditer then asked if people with ASD innately have problems with leadership, drive for success, or ideas in general.

“I’m not sure, I haven’t read enough [on] autism and those on the spectrum can be very different than the most extreme,” Damore responded. “I personally have problems with leadership and don’t have as high a drive for success as others.”


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“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


ASPartOfMe
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15 Aug 2017, 2:12 pm

Don’t Look Now, But Alt-Right Demonstrations Are Scheduled for Nine Cities Next Weekend

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Alt-right protests against Google’s allegedly anti-white-male diversity policies were already being planned before the white-supremacist violence in Charlottesville this last weekend.

The “march” will be directed at Google facilities in Atlanta, Austin, Boston, Los Angeles, New York, Pittsburgh, Seattle, and Washington, D.C., in addition to the company’s headquarters, GooglePlex, in Mountain View, California.


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Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity

It is Autism Acceptance Month

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


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15 Aug 2017, 2:13 pm

Double post - Delete


_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity

It is Autism Acceptance Month

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 15 Aug 2017, 6:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

karathraceandherspecialdestiny
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15 Aug 2017, 2:30 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Don’t Look Now, But Alt-Right Demonstrations Are Scheduled for Nine Cities Next Weekend

Quote:
Alt-right protests against Google’s allegedly anti-white-male diversity policies were already being planned before the white-supremacist violence in Charlottesville this last weekend.

The “march” will be directed at Google facilities in Atlanta, Austin, Boston, Los Angeles, New York, Pittsburgh, Seattle, and Washington, D.C., in addition to the company’s headquarters, GooglePlex, in Mountain View, California.


I wonder what a Venn diagram of MRA/PUA misogynists and white supremacists would look like. I have a feeling there would be a lot of overlap. It certainly seems so from the sort of guys who showed up in Charlottesville. I think the white supremacist/nationalist movement is intentionally trying to recruit guys who hate women because they often have other issues that make them vulnerable to propaganda (like social isolation and mental health and anger issues) like ISIS does. They seem to recruit the same sort of guys (hateful loners) in the same way (online).



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15 Aug 2017, 2:58 pm

Another way of looking at it is young men are looking for a cause. There is a void in their lives. Wouldn't it be good if we could encourage them to take up something purposeful that helps the community. Not sure how or what could be set up, but society has become too fragmented and some vulnerable people are slipping through the cracks.

We need to care about each other and nip the disenchanted feelings in the bud before they fester and turn to hate.



karathraceandherspecialdestiny
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15 Aug 2017, 6:42 pm

hurtloam wrote:
Another way of looking at it is young men are looking for a cause. There is a void in their lives. Wouldn't it be good if we could encourage them to take up something purposeful that helps the community. Not sure how or what could be set up, but society has become too fragmented and some vulnerable people are slipping through the cracks.

We need to care about each other and nip the disenchanted feelings in the bud before they fester and turn to hate.


I have to admit that I struggle to empathize with people who turn their anger and mental health issues into violence and hatred directed at others because that is not at all how I coped with my own anger and mental health issues; if I was violent I was violent to myself and hateful to myself, I directed it inwards because that is my nature. It is difficult for me to sympathize with violent men.



Marknis
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15 Aug 2017, 6:53 pm

hurtloam wrote:
Another way of looking at it is young men are looking for a cause. There is a void in their lives. Wouldn't it be good if we could encourage them to take up something purposeful that helps the community. Not sure how or what could be set up, but society has become too fragmented and some vulnerable people are slipping through the cracks.

We need to care about each other and nip the disenchanted feelings in the bud before they fester and turn to hate.


My void comes from being born into the most mentally unstable and backwards culture on the planet, not being allowed to develop as a person, being discouraged from finding out what my passions were or expanding my knowledge, having a sick ideology (mainstream Christianity) shoved down my throat, and not fulfilling unfair expectations such as being able to take violence directed me, fighting it off, suppressing my emotions when it comes to getting a job, resisting frying my brain for college despite how it was also called "fancy book learnin'", and knowing how to get a girlfriend.