Is tolerance of LGBT people for real?

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Fifty years ago, "Men are men and women are women" was both mantra and prevailing attitude. This is what I grew up with, but I do not want to grow into being an old codger who believes that the world should always remain the same as it was way back then.

Most of the people of my parents' generation have passed away (including my parents), so why should I carry on their prejudices, hatreds and fears? Why should I remain as ignorant as they were? Times change, and the culture of 1950s America -- when society was dominated by straight white males -- should be removed from life-support and allowed to die.

People have equal rights and equal responsibilities, and no one person or group should be granted any greater privilege than any other unless they have earned it. If you want to be respected more than others, you should earn that respect and not expect others to give it to you just because you demand it. Same for love and trust.

Tolerance is for incremental measuring devices, not people. People should either accept others in spite of their differences (my choice) or go crawl into a hole and forget about being human. In either case, it's a matter of choice, and should not be imposed upon or beaten into those who are slow to accept diversity.

Tolerance is for incremental measuring devices, not people. People should either accept others in spite of their differences (my choice) or go crawl into a hole and forget about being human. In either case, it's a matter of choice, and should not be imposed upon or beaten into those who are slow to accept diversity.

I was with you until the end.

If the HR deptartment at a major firm finds out a hiring manager is "slow to accept diversity", firing them should absolutely be imposed upon them for not doing their job as the law and company policy demand. This is not optional. This is not playing nice. Tolerance is often required by law and social custom, and I am glad for it.

It is false to speak in blind principles, when what is actually needed is clarity. Words have multiple meanings; quoting one of those meanings does not invalidate the usefulness, or lack of such, of it's other meanings.

In major parts of the world Tolerance conveys the idea that the privilege of being treated like everyone else is respected. This is enforced internally. Failing that, and when appropriate (if not against free speech), by law and force of arms. This is natural and called for lest we end up in a Tyranny or Anarchy.

I don't think I tolerate a lack of appropriate tolerance.
I just have no tolerance for such behavior myself.
That is why the GI's fought the intollerant Nazi's!

Please learn to use the quote function correctly. Thank you.

Quotes cause the text after it to become smaller. That is why I use the system I do. Also, I will write what I want, within Forum Rules, how I want, when I want. Thank you.

Telling me what to do and adding thank you does not make me want to do anything, ever.

Sorry, your shtick is lame and predictable. Correcting people for spelling and other incidental errors that no one can complain back to you about. Makes you feel in control again when someone gets under your skin, right? It is pathetic. Control yourself and please have the honor to own up when you are wrong. I doubt that will happen though.

Your last post is off topic too. When will I see that picture of the check to AWAIC? You are in a state of dishonor that can easily be rectified by either sending me a picture of the check (better include video maybe of you mailing it with proof of life newspaper dated... does that prove it?), or by admitting you are wrong, or both. That is the open contract you offered.

I have guessed you are a Libertarian. That contract has been completed on my side (I found the Women's Homeless Shelter and it's financials, as required). As a Libertarian, are you not honor-bound to now complete your side of the contract? No court, except the court of public opinion here, but yeah, what is up with that? Your credibility is at stake, unless everyone here knows already better then to consider you credible... I would not know.

Honestly, are you a troll that just wants me to type words? Mostly I have a great laugh and some fun writing prose. This place is great sometimes, other times it is a bottomless waste of time. Then you gotta go.

Take Care.

Hey there tensordyne, I didn't have a prob understanding your msg.

You probably got the line above, too, despite my abbreviating "problem" and "message." Folks express themselves in different ways.

Wouldn't fret overmuch about those that want to score a point on grammar or literary quality or appear the wittiest, brightest or savviest. In the end, they win the forum king prize, which consists of $0.00 and no friends.

I decided I don't mind being insulted, contradicted, misinterpreted, or ignored. Don't care, just posting to sort things out in my own head, posting for myself, and if incidentally this mental waste disposal helps somebody else, that is good and all right by me. Please, dis me, if it makes you feel better, is the idea.

Manage my time here, only spend < 30 min. a day, and do not log in every day, either; same on Reddit and other forums. Don't let the Internet suck you into its rabbit hole. Leads nowhere.

I don't understand what you and Fnord are arguing about. Is it a dfference in opinion over the laws barring discrimination in employment? Or against political correctness in general? I don't really understand what all the words are about at this point. I would recommend abandoning the thread.

I read in Generation Me book that only 30% of the US believe in gay marriage and the acceptance of homosexuality is higher in the youth and younger adult generation than it is with boomers and senior citizens.

Also tolerance and acceptance are two different things. Just because you tolerate it doesn't mean you accept it. Times have changed and LGBT people are having more human rights now and even trangender people so therefore homophobia and transphobia has become socially unacceptable now and will give you consequences. So all we have done was silence those people (not saying this is bad because who wants to listen to bigotry), not get rid of them. We have created echo chambers for these people now. People who post their stuff online but dare to not express it in the real world because of consequences. It's a matter of don't ask don't tell regarding anti LGBT.

LGBT-stuff is a hot topic right now. Everyone who wants to appear like a good person will go above and beyond to try and prove how tolerant and accepting they are by being vocal about "trans issues" and "trans rights" and all the other nonsense.

I only believe about 10% of what I hear from people about LGBT+ stuff. I think you're correct in not buying it, because I don't either.
I think that the majority of people are fine and/or neutral about LGBT stuff. The people that go really hardcore for it are the ones I don't believe.
I'm trans, so I've had about 7+ years of watching this stuff happen whilst having it apply directly to me.

Now there is another letter to add to the acronym: “I”, for “Intersex”. This describes a person who, at birth, has no clearly-defined physical signs of gender. This seems to include hermaphrodites. This condition affects roughly 1 to 1.5% of the population, and in some third-world countries, babies born this way may be killed soon after birth for being “cursed” or for brining a curse upon the family.

They may have male genitalia on the outside, and female reproductive organs on the inside. Such a person may never have testicles (or at least none that descend) and may even experience menarche through their penises.

They may have female genitalia on the outside, but no uterus or ovaries, and their testicles may be under-developed as well.

Some may actually be chimeric - the result of fraternal twins that combined in the womb to form one whole person. Parts of them have male DNA, and the rest, female.

So we may have to get used to using “LGBTIQ” from now on.

You sound very sensible. I have a friend who's something of an anarchist and he is always ranting on about gay rights and trans rights and these rights and those rights (he's straight) and I just care about people's rights, I don't need the whole alphabet to prove it.

LGBTIQ people already have the same rights as everybody else. I think what most people in the LGBTIQ rights movement really want is for everyone to treat them with the same respect (and love) that anyone else would be treated.

This is why I (quietly) advocate for being indifferent toward each other’s sexuality — it’s just a thing, it’s nobody else’s business, and one person’s sexuality might very well be different from another’s, even though they may both claim the same label.

Denial of rights for being LGBTIQ? Exploitation of LGBTIQ people? No. These are wrong and should not be tolerated in any corporate, governmental or public environment under any circumstances.

Private circumstances? If a person does not want to date someone because that someone identifies as LGBTIQ, then that should not be a problem — requiring a non-LGBTIQ person to date (or even marry) an LGBTIQ person is wrong and should not be tolerated.

(How often does this happen? I don’t know. How many LGBTIQ people felt that they were “forced” into a male/female relationship just to keep their jobs? How many did so to keep from being targeted by angry “Morality” mobs, or even their own parents?)

Stop caring — that is, stop being obsessed with how other people get their yah-yahs, and make sure that your own past is clean before you start bashing theirs.

Are you really sure about that? Because as far I have heard, a lot of places don't have the right to fire people for being straight based on stating things like "religious rights". And that there is a higher level of cultural discrimination that leads to a lot higher mental health problems and suicide rates, or higher rates of homelessness or hate crimes. Just saying that the books have equal rights, is not too similar to saying people with autism have equal rights because they are no longer locked up into things like institutions for being burdens.

Same-sex marriage was only legalized in Australia in December 2017, and was unlikely to have been pushed into passing if many people just acted indifferent and passive, while horrible anti-gay ads played. Unfortunantly I can't seem to find the ad itself, but a news broadcast on it.


I am pretty sure that trans rights are not the best either. Starting with that to get legal recognition they had to get divorced prior to after the marriage equality law put into place. In two larger states (including my own), sex reassignment surgery is required to be recognised, which I was interested to learn with recent research that apparently not all trans people feel the need to change their pieces. And non binary is not recognised at all in my state.

I am looking into even more facts on Wikipedia for LGBT rights in Australia. Only one state has banned conversion therapy. Oh, another state has requirements for surgery until May next year. One state apparently allows something called the "Gay panic defence". Half the states don't recognise sexual orientation under hate crimes. I don't think there is going to be a change if people just act complacent.

Isn't Donald Trump in the USA trying to ban trans people from the military?

I don't actually believe trans women are biological women unless we redefine what woman means biologically, same as with trans men the other way.

I do believe people have dysphoria and in cases of physical dysphoria which can be helped along with medicine/surgery it's best to help them. If it can't then don't. And let them get what they need themselves.

I went to a very woke place and the toilets were still separated by sex (or bottom surgery), they were just more blunt about it. I think that's what needs to happen although it's tough because the language needs to be child friendly.

But guys need to quit beating trans women up in bathrooms.

I believe that in an ideal world the second wave would have sorted out sexism BUT most people do want to be treated as men or women and mostly that's to do with how they were born and even where it isn't, it's usually binary.

Because society is set up in that way, to suit the majority, people also have social dysphoria and in our society realistically that is part of being trans. Second wave feminists don't like that but they failed to create a world without gender. They've had since the 70s, most people don't want to live like that. So it's easier for individuals to transition socially then for our entire society to change 100% and eliminate gendered ways of acting.

I don't like this pressure to be constantly nice to trans women. That's not living like a woman, that's living like a spoilt princess.

I'm more comfortable treated like a guy but I don't demand everyone to like me. I act more like a guy and when people generalise I usually fall down on the male side.

Btw there are snowflakes in every side of this. Snowflakes who we all know about in the third wave. Snowflakes who refuse to call history history and who call themselves wombmyn in the second (and some nasty women in that too like the one who shot Andy Warhol because he was a man). And snowflakes who say 'don't swear, ladies present' from before feminism was even a mainstream thing beyond voting and property rights.

Oh and on the LGB side of it - I really do think people are ok with people fancying their own sex and if they're not ok with that then the problem's with them.

Trans rights are fine in the UK. Been trans for 7 years now, started at 17.

It’s certainly a heck of a lot better than a generation ago,

Yes. Whether or not other people will automatically honor those rights is another matter entirely.

LGBT people have the same de jure rights as anybody else.

De facto rights are another matter.

Black people had the de jure right to vote since the 14th Amendment (1865). They only attained the de facto right to vote when the Voting Rights Act was passed in 1965.

What's needed for LGBT people, perhaps, are anti-discriminatory laws which have more "teeth" in them. More power of actual enforcement.