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Fnord
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25 Jan 2024, 1:34 am

Transphobia is a difficult thing with which to deal, but it can be overcome.  I can only speak for myself as a cis-male who has had it (no more, I hope), so I will say this . . .

Trans-gendered people are PEOPLE.  If a PERSON presents as something other than the sex they were assigned at birth, then that PERSON deserves to be treated with RESPECT, and not as a fetish-object, and certainly not as a freak or a threat.

If people cannot adjust to the normalcy of someone coming out as trans, then maybe those people should just shut up about it and deal with their own regressive attitudes somewhere far, far away from any trans person -- or any LGBTQ+ person, for that matter.


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Yugoslav1945
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25 Jan 2024, 2:25 am

Fnord wrote:
If people cannot adjust to the normalcy of someone coming out as trans, then maybe those people should just shut up about it and deal with their own regressive attitudes somewhere far, far away from any trans person -- or any LGBTQ+ person, for that matter.


There are those who don't want to accept trans people so, it's for the best that we specifically create closed communities for transphobes so that they are content with their delusions and at the same time, they don't inflict harm on the outside public.


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Fnord
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25 Jan 2024, 6:29 pm

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
There are those who don't want to accept trans people so, it's for the best that we specifically create closed communities for transphobes so that they are content with their delusions and at the same time, they don't inflict harm on the outside public.
These are YOUR thoughts, not mine; and what a sad, sad set of thoughts they are.


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cyberdad
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25 Jan 2024, 6:56 pm

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
There are those who don't want to accept trans people so, it's for the best that we specifically create closed communities for transphobes so that they are content with their delusions and at the same time, they don't inflict harm on the outside public.


It would be good for you to broaden your cultural experiences outside of socially conservative societies in Bosnia and Croatia. There is literally no such thing as LGBTQI ghettos in western countries. The idea itself is an antitheses to freedom of movement which people should be allowed to live where they want.

What you are thinking only happens in Asia where you have neighborhoods in cities where trans people (all male-female) congregate for personal safety. In Africa (particularly Uganda) their existence is enough to endanger their lives.



funeralxempire
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25 Jan 2024, 9:09 pm

cyberdad wrote:
There is literally no such thing as LGBTQI ghettos in western countries.


Church and Wellesley comes to mind. It's just one example.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_gay_villages


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cyberdad
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25 Jan 2024, 9:59 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_gay_villages


I can confirm the Melbourne one is wrong. The area that attracts most gays in Melbourne is Prahan. Brunswick and St Kilda are alternative suburbs close to the city. but none of these three inner city suburbs are what I would call "gay villages".

Prahan is a gentrified upper middle class part of inner Melbourne suburb that is known for bars and nightlife. It has a reputation for gay bars, saunas and bath houses and does have a reputation of having a lot gays living there. But the vast majority of Prahan's residents are upper middle class professionals with a lot of money. The gay people who live their are loaded financially.

St Kilda (along the city/beachside) and Brunswick (inner city) are hipster zones where hippies, beatnicks, young people of various lifestyles/backgrounds, backpackers and tourists reside. They are both famous for alternate arts scene, curio shops and themed restaurants/cafes. Nobody would consider them gay areas but they are definitely "gay friendly".



funeralxempire
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25 Jan 2024, 10:49 pm

cyberdad wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_gay_villages


I can confirm the Melbourne one is wrong. The area that attracts most gays in Melbourne is Prahan. Brunswick and St Kilda are alternative suburbs close to the city. but none of these three inner city suburbs are what I would call "gay villages".

Prahan is a gentrified upper middle class part of inner Melbourne suburb that is known for bars and nightlife. It has a reputation for gay bars, saunas and bath houses and does have a reputation of having a lot gays living there. But the vast majority of Prahan's residents are upper middle class professionals with a lot of money. The gay people who live their are loaded financially.

St Kilda (along the city/beachside) and Brunswick (inner city) are hipster zones where hippies, beatnicks, young people of various lifestyles/backgrounds, backpackers and tourists reside. They are both famous for alternate arts scene, curio shops and themed restaurants/cafes. Nobody would consider them gay areas but they are definitely "gay friendly".


Some of the examples do seem over-stated, but unless you're disputing every single one the point still stands that gay neighbourhoods most certainly exist.

Some of the overstated examples used to be solid examples but have now gentrified to the point that they're more just affluent and progressive these days. A lot of the examples that might be debatable are similar, just less gentrified.

A lot of the time, a lower/working class neighbourhood becoming a gay neighbourhood (or even just a 'bohemian neighbourhood') is part of the process of gentrification so pointing out that some of the examples have gentrified to the point younger queer people can't afford to live there anymore doesn't make the case you're hoping it makes.

I would say that there's heavy overlap between what I'm calling bohemian neighbourhoods and gay neighbourhoods though. Insisting that a community is only very welcoming towards gays instead of them forming a local majority just moves where that community falls on the spectrum between those two.


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cyberdad
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26 Jan 2024, 12:52 am

funeralxempire wrote:
I would say that there's heavy overlap between what I'm calling bohemian neighbourhoods and gay neighbourhoods though. Insisting that a community is only very welcoming towards gays instead of them forming a local majority just moves where that community falls on the spectrum between those two.


I think there may also be a gender divide in Melbourne gay locations. Prahan is predominantly known as popular with gay men (it's possible gay women live there too but you never see them there). Actually now that I think of it I can't ever recall ever seeing openly lesbian couples in public? Certainly seen plenty of male couples.



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26 Jan 2024, 5:40 am

cyberdad wrote:
What you are thinking only happens in Asia where you have neighborhoods in cities where trans people (all male-female) congregate for personal safety. In Africa (particularly Uganda) their existence is enough to endanger their lives.


Which is why I personally believe that what we need are these closed-in communities also for people who are homophobic, transphobic, and in general have a distaste for LGBT stuff. They can't inflict any harm on others because they are forbidden to express their hatred outside and can only share it among themselves. If by any means they try to get out, they will be killed.

But if the situation is reverse, then we need protected closed-in communities for LGBT people so that they aren't persecuted as you seem to mention Africa and Asia. For Bosnia, I would honestly consider such ghettos to have only LGBT people so that they are protected by the still-prevalent conservative environment. Their human rights are simply protected from persecution by putting them in safe spaces to prevent any killings of LGBT people by transphobes, homophobes, and such.


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26 Jan 2024, 5:41 am

If anything, I would pursue for the establishment of ghettos for LGBT people to offer them safe space, especially so I can have my former trans friend put with other LGBT people who would better understand them better than I do. In this case, I see it as a win-win for both sides. No persecution! No people died!


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26 Jan 2024, 6:58 am

This just in. I had another nasty argument with my former friend. This time I wanted to comfort them by assuring that they passed most of tests during the winter break and I sent them a funny meme to calm the down. Apparently, despite them having Gen Z humor, they berated me and muted me to which I teared up feeling as if I was unworthy of them and unworthy of anyone.

I f*****g hate myself.


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Fnord
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26 Jan 2024, 7:00 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
If anything, I would pursue for the establishment of ghettos for LGBT people to offer them safe space . . .
That sounds like the one back in 1940 when the Jews were relocated to the Warsaw ghetto (a.k.a., the "Jewish Residential District in Warsaw"), and we all know how badly that turned out for the Jews.


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Yugoslav1945
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26 Jan 2024, 7:03 am

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
If anything, I would pursue for the establishment of ghettos for LGBT people to offer them safe space . . .
That sounds like the one back in 1940 when the Jews were relocated to the Warsaw ghetto (a.k.a., the "Jewish Residential District in Warsaw"), and we all know how badly that turned out for the Jews.


What the f**k? Not those kinds of ghettos!! ! That is not a safe space, that is a killing space!


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26 Jan 2024, 11:11 am

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
If anything, I would pursue for the establishment of ghettos for LGBT people to offer them safe space . . .
That sounds like the one back in 1940 when the Jews were relocated to the Warsaw ghetto (a.k.a., the "Jewish Residential District in Warsaw"), and we all know how badly that turned out for the Jews.
What the f**k?  Not those kinds of ghettos!!  That is not a safe space, that is a killing space!
Hey, it's YOUR idea!  Back then, the Jews were also told they were being sent there for their own 'safety'.

Speaking of safety, is it safe to assume that your educational background did not focus on European History?


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Yugoslav1945
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26 Jan 2024, 12:40 pm

Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Yugoslav1945 wrote:
If anything, I would pursue for the establishment of ghettos for LGBT people to offer them safe space . . .
That sounds like the one back in 1940 when the Jews were relocated to the Warsaw ghetto (a.k.a., the "Jewish Residential District in Warsaw"), and we all know how badly that turned out for the Jews.
What the f**k?  Not those kinds of ghettos!!  That is not a safe space, that is a killing space!
Hey, it's YOUR idea!  Back then, the Jews were also told they were being sent there for their own 'safety'.

Speaking of safety, is it safe to assume that your educational background did not focus on European History?


Holy s**t! I shall retreat from that then. No more ghetto BS!

Back to the topic, my trans friend once told me that I shouldn't use they/them pronouns on them and I find it very offensive because they/them doesn't mean they're non-binary. They're GENDER-NEUTRAL.

Image


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26 Jan 2024, 1:22 pm

Yugoslav1945 wrote:
Holy s**t! I shall retreat from that then. No more ghetto BS!

Back to the topic, my trans friend once told me that I shouldn't use they/them pronouns on them and I find it very offensive because they/them doesn't mean they're non-binary. They're GENDER-NEUTRAL.

Image

Why not obey them? Since the name can be customized, why not expand the scope to gender? They're not radical enough to demand the removal of the wall between the toilets.


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