12 year old Aspie son with depression/ suicidal thoughts

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Hi all, my 12 year old son has AS and I just found his journal which contained some very disturbing entries. I believe he is depressed and WAS suicidal. He told me he would never kill himself but he has thought about it and planned it. He wrote later in his journal that he would never do it. He is having trouble at school which is nothing new but he is also saying he is bi-sexual and telling people at school. He is very creative and writes some great poetry and I like that he has that outlet. He lies to me all the time about everything. He has also found religion lately. In his journal he talks about finally telling me everything and he wonders how I would react or what I would do. He thinks I would take him to a "shrink" as he said. I am definitely getting him some sort of therapy and would even consider putting him on anti-depressants. He is my oldest of four. My stomach hurts constantly from this and I feel like I can't let him out of my sight, even for a minute in case he hurts himself. He managed to scrape the skin off of his hand with a pencil eraser and lied about it. The principal at his school called me and told me that he did that to himself. He is seeing a counselor at school but I'm not sure how often or if he is honest with her. I feel like I failed him, like this is my fault. I just want him to be happy and have a "normal" life. I don't have anyone I can confide in or share this with without being judged. Any help and. or guidance is appreciated. Sorry for the rambling. Thanks.

You are going to get mixed reactions on the fact that you not only found the journal, but read it, so brace yourself for that.

I won't say how I feel about it, because the truth is you have uncovered information that I believe you needed to know. The tricky part, however, is that you can not visually USE that information, because that will permanently break your relationship with your son. His idea of trust would mean that he would assume his private thoughts were private. Don't lie to him if he ever asks, but do not confront him with anything you uncovered by reading the journal, either.

Ask to meet with the counselor at the school. While the counselor may be limited in what he or she can share with you, you are not limited in what you can share with them, which will be a simple, "I have reason to believe that my son has contemplated suicide recently and I am very, very worried about him." The counselor may have suggestions for you on how to proceed from here.

According to the most recent scientific studies, anit-depressents are just fancy placebos, but with very real side effects. I am not in favor of giving your child those.

Minor self-injury is common with spectrum kids and that part you need to take in stride. The more you react on the little things, the harder it will be for him to confide in you on the bigger things, for logic would dictate a magnified reaction. Building a level of trust is very important right now, where he begins to feel that he really can tell you anything and that you will be able to absorb that information in a constructive manner. Start with little things and allow it to grow.

Change your thinking and vocabulary about wanting him to have a "normal" life into wanting him to have the best life for him. The concept of "normal" can have pretty negative connotations with many AS, as they know they are not normal, and it feels like you are asking them to live a lie. The more a child hears this from you or others around him, the more he loses trust on all levels, and the less you will be able to help him.

I do not believe you are a bad mother. You love your child. But all mothers make mistakes, and the best we can hope for is to figure out as fast as possible when we've made them, and course correct immediately. Nothing I've said above is meant to tell you, "you are wrong" but is, instead, meant to give you what you need to decide how to act in the future.

Maybe he doesn't feel loved and accepted. I was like that, at the age of 14, because I didn't feel loved and accepted.

Yeah, that sounds like me when I was 12. Depressed, near suicidal, and with a mother who routinely snuck into my room to go through my things. I tried a journal once. My mother found it two days later and then yelled at me and smacked me because I called her an uncaring bully in my journal. Never made the mistake of keeping a journal again.

The truth is that I don't know what is bothering your son. I know for myself the bullying in school was about 10% of my problems, my own stupidity was about another 10%, and my mother was the source of the rest of my problems. Hopefully you aren't treating your son the way my own mother treated me. But ultimately the problem is that whatever is causing your son problems, it needs to be figured out, and handled. And in order for that to happen, your son needs to talk with somebody about what is making him depressed.

The problem of course is that your son is afraid to tell the truth because he fears what the consequences might be. For example, I normally don't lie. I just don't see the point in going through all the extra work to do so. But you can bet that nearly every single thing I tell to my mother is a lie. And the reason is simple, I don't trust her to handle the truth. Experience has taught me that if my mother finds out anything about me she will use it as ammunition against me. If she finds out I have some homework she will harass me until it is done, and she has checked it. And of course her version of checking it is to go through it and yell at me when I got the wrong answer.

Sorry if I am getting off track here, but what I am trying to say is that your son is afraid to tell you the truth because he fears that your response will be negative. He fears that you will label him defective, crazy, abnormal, and then try to fix him by sending him to a shrink, putting him on meds, etc. And based on what you have written his fears seem to be founded in reality. You have already said that you want to get him into therapy, on meds, and make him normal. And that is exactly what he is afraid of.

From my perspective it seems that what your son needs is not medication, it is not a shrink, and it is not to be made normal. What your son needs if for somebody (most importantly you his parents) to accept him. You need to let him know that you love him no matter what, and that it is his decision to be whatever sexuality, or religion he wants. If he wants to talk about it, you will listen and talk with him about it (not lecture, talk). Your son needs to know that you (his parents) are going to be accepting of him, and try to help him if he struggles rather then try to 'fix' him and force him into a predefined mold.

So, how do you go about doing this? Well, I would try having a mature discussion with just you, your son, and your husband. Tell him that you have been seeing some signs that he is under stress (don't mention the journal because that wont help). If he asks what your talking about then just say something like 'you seem nervous', or 'you seem on edge'. Tell him that you understand he is stressed out, after all being a teenager sucks, it is probably the worst phase of life. Then tell him that you are worried that the stress he is under might be causing him to have some problems, perhaps anxiety or depression. Next tell him that you are open to talk, and if he wants to talk about it with you then you will listen carefully, and not judge him for what he says. He doesn't have to talk if he doesn't want to. But he needs to know that if he wants to talk, you will be there to listen patiently, and be sympathetic and non judgmental if he decides to do so.

It might also be a good idea to share some stories from your own teenage years where you did something stupid. Perhaps there was a time you fell to peer pressure, got in trouble, and had some problems. You want to let him know that you understand being a teenager is hard, and that you aren't going to punish, harass, or insult him if he confides in you.

O, and I shouldn't need to say this but STOP READING HIS JOURNAL!

Thanks for the replies. Just to clarify a few things. I was not snooping when I found his journal. It was under our living room couch. I looked inside to see whose it was and I couldn't ignore what I was reading. I felt his life was at stake. I am not trying to make him normal and I regret putting that in my post. That's why I put it in quotes. I know he doesn't need to be cured that he is who he is I just want to make his life a little easier for him to handle. I want to give him the coping abilities he needs. I want to solve all his problems although I know I can't. I am the only one who truly accepts him for who he is. I am always here for him and he does know that. He is 12 and a boy and an Aspie. I can't relate at all that's why I am asking for help. I do not yell at him, belittle him, or anything else. I am 100% understanding of him. I want to nurture him and let him be what and who he wants but there are underlying things that are going on and I can't get to the issues by myself. I am just so deathly afraid of him hurting himself again. I worry that when I go to make sure he is up for school that I'm going to find him dead. I want him to be able to be honest with me no matter what he has to tell me. Trust and honesty is all I want from him.

Be careful with anti-depressants - they can have paradoxical reactions in children, teens, and young adults.

Of course. We all come up to times where we just don't know what to do. I think my suggestions still stand. I know they weren't well filled out, but I still don't feel I know enough about WHICH of those you'll need to emphasize to get really deep into it.

You will find many of our posters carry a lot of personal experience into their posts, and that it causes them to make certain assumptions. But since these posters are AS themselves, I personally believe it is important that we have that voice; even when the advice does not apply, understanding how the person reacts and why is a teaching moment for a parent. Tracker tends to be one of our best resources for digging down into what is making an AS child tick, but he does have his own negative experiences to deal with.

I really do appreciate the advice and experience shared on this post. Any insight into how I should handle this is great. I don't want to be the same kind of mother I had so I have always tried not to be. I guess what is hardest for me is that he is struggling so much but didn't feel like he could come to me with his problems. I always thought I had given him the ability to talk to me. I guess I was wrong. I'm just glad that I can now help him get through this and anything else he has to deal with in the future. And don't worry, I won't make him take any medications. I've discovered how damaging they can be. Thanks all

P.S. Anyone know of any good books for his age on Asperger's? I have books for parents but I haven't been able to find any age-appropriate ones for him.

Unfortunately, I can totally relate, although not with my AS child. The thing is, when you're deathly afraid of him hurting himself, and he wants to "protect you" from that fear, he can't be honest with you, and he can't trust you with his feelings if he wants to self injure. It's internally inconsistent.

You need to figure out your first priority. Is it to know what's going on with him, or is it to be reassured? If you want reassurance, you aren't necessarily going to get honesty. I'm not saying this to be mean or hurtful. I'm saying this because, as another parent, I know how difficult this is. You need to be there for your child and put aside your terror - and I know it's terror. I know what it's like to go into your child's room with your heart in your throat, hoping that it is just that your child is sleeping late, and nothing more awful. I know. And I know what it's like to have to deal with other children as if there aren't catastrophic fantasies playing in your head continuously.

Since your son has told you that he is not planning to kill himself, although he has thought about it, the topic is already "out there." That's a good thing. If you are concerned about his state of mind, it is okay to ask whether he is feeling like he is going to hurt himself. It won't give him any ideas he hasn't already had. Let him know that you are a safe person to talk to, but never lie to him. If he tries to get you to promise never to share anything he says with anyone, you can't do that. You have to tell him that you will do that as long as you believe he will be okay, but if you, as his mother, believe that he is in danger, you will have to act to protect him, and make sure he understands that. A counselor will also have to share information under those circumstances. Since the school counselor has never told you anything, it is probably safe to assume that your son has never shared any active suicidal expression with him/her.

The school counselor might be an appropriate person to gauge whether a therapist would be a useful support for your son. If so, and if your son has a good relationship with the counselor, maybe the counselor would be able to introduce the idea in a way that would be more acceptable and less threatening than if you were to suggest it; like by comparing it to the kinds of sessions that the school counselor has with your son. When parents suggest therapy, children usually hear it as "you're broken and need to be fixed." While there are, no doubt, some parents who feel that way, there are also parents who mean "you're hurting, I would like you to get some help in figuring this out, and I don't seem to be able to help. Maybe someone else can; maybe someone who you don't have to worry about protecting their feelings, or about what they'll think of you."

Your son is only 12. It would be good to get some supports in place for him before things get rockier, if he'll allow it.

^^Wholeheartedly concur^^




^^Ditto this^^


I see no reason for you to feel that you're a bad mother or failing as a parent in any way. We are how we were born and the genetic wiring schematic our brains were given has nothing to do with you personally, that's our gift and our curse and we make the best of it. Depression and anxiety are such common comorbids with AS, I don't think you can really separate them.

The very fact that we perceive the world, society and relationships in terms that are quite different from our peers can't help but be depressing, because we are constantly reminded that our way of seeing things is weird, or just plain wrong, when to us it seems logical and crystal clear, where everyone else's way of doing and interpreting everything is murky and muddle-headed with rules that change arbitrarily and without warning.

Imagine waking up in a country where everyone around you speaks the same language as you - but in a widely variant dialect - grammatical structure and word meanings are sometimes similar, but as often as not may have meanings you never imagined. So you can never be sure when someone speaks to you, exactly what they may be saying, or if their words mean what they seem to mean. Sometimes you draw conclusions from context, and often you just guess wrong and embarrass yourself or make someone angry because they think you're just being a smart alec or a thickheaded ass. Now imagine being stuck in that situation for years on end with no change or relief in sight. Enough to give you a headache just thinking about it, huh? Under the circumstances, a bit of depression and angst is inescapable. After a while, you start to focus on the negative and obsess on it without even realizing that you're doing it. You learn to expect the worst, so you won't be blindsided when you (inevitably) screw up.

Anyhow, that's what we live with and it's not your fault. But love and support are needed and appreciated, even if we often don't have the skills to show that appreciation properly.

And not to make light of your worries in any way, but please keep in mind, teenage angst often leads to overly dramatic expressions. Just be sure he knows how much it hurts and terrifies you to even think about losing him that way. Not to make him feel guilty, but to assure him that he is loved that completely.

umm here's one, but I am not sure if it is the one I am thinking about:

http://www.amazon.com/Aspergers-Self-Es ... 1885477856

Are you aware of Jessica Kingsley Publishing? It is a publishing company that prints non-fiction and fiction writing about autism. They print literature that would be age-appropriate.

It is good that he is writing things down in a journal. This is a healthy way to express emotions. It will help him in the future in developing his expressive capacity and becoming aware of his emotions. One thing you have to remember is that people with AS are not always aware of our emotions and they can be overbearing and we might be unaware of healthy social expressions of emotion.

I would talk to the counsellor and classroom teacher. I would not tell him (your son) that you read his journal, although it may be a sign that he left it out in the open for you to find it, which again, is a good thing. It would be a good idea to make sure that someone else has an eye out for him at school and he/she might give you some resources.

Depression is common among AS. I was very depressed at that age. I can't always remember why. Some of it was bad peer relationships and bullying. The other side was negative relationships with adults, which comes from a difference in perception of authority. I also lived in a large family so I never had alone time. I don't know how to help, other than, I've learned to deal with these things, mostly by myself, which is a rather terrible thing. The most important thing in my life are the people that are positive which are the people who are friendly and loving. Negativity from someone else can linger for a long time in my mind.
Some of the best things that I do is, is I think "I am glad that I am who I am today" and "I am happy I can do what I do". Pride and self-affirmation can do wonders.
HTH

Hello again

My apologies about the previous post. I just have some bad memories and they tend to cloud my perception at times. Please don't think that I am calling you a horrible parent. I am just trying to say that your child seems to be afraid of telling you the truth because he is afraid of what might happen. That might be a fear of you over reacting and try to 'fix' him. It might be that he is afraid of having you worry. But in either case it stems from the fact that he is afraid to tell you what is really going on. And the only way I can think to fix that is to sit your son down and tell him that you just want to know is really going on, and that you wont get mad, or upset no matter what he says.

Everyone has given me such great advice today. I am still so overwhelmed about the whole thing and it hit me all at once. I'm just not sure where to start. He only has one more day of school before Spring Break so I won't be able to talk to anyone at his school until April 19th. He assures me that he doesn't feel suicidal anymore and that he could never do it. I feel like I'm walking on egg shells now around him that I might say the wrong thing or he might take something I say the wrong way, which happens from time to time. I'm afraid that his interactions with his siblings are only going to aggravate things. I told him that he can tell me anything, that he is just as important as anyone else in this family. That I am always here for him, no matter what. That if he needs me and I'm busy with the other kids I will drop everything to talk to him. I'm not sure if I mentioned this earlier but his relationship with his dad isn't that great. His dad doesn't understand him and isn't really sure how to handle his AS. They fight a lot and usually only get along when they are playing video games. I'm not really sure how he would react if I told him what I found and what is going on. I know I need to let him know but I'm not really sure how to go about it. Family counseling maybe? Any ideas on that? I was thinking of telling him if he can't talk to me then maybe he can write to me, like a letter to express himself. That was the way I communicated with my parents when I didn't want to tell them something face to face. I really can't stand confrontation. That is part of this as well. Confronting him without being aggressive or blaming. I am very emotional and it is hard for me to even "talk" about this without tearing up. I don't know. Tomorrow is another day, the last day of school for him until he is off for a week. Maybe I can use that time to have some one on one with him and see what progress we can make. My mind can't help wandering back to the despair he wrote about. I wouldn't wish those feelings on my worst enemy and here my own son is feeling this way and I feel slightly helpless to fix it. Hence the message boards and posts. Thanks for all the support. I really need it.

Tracker: No need to apologize. I just wanted to make sure you understood the surrounding circumstances. I have a mother who snooped into every aspect of my life from the time I had a life until I finally got away from her. I hated her growing up and we still have a pretty terrible relationship although she would say it is just fine.

MrTeacher: thanks for the book suggestion. I am going to see if our local library has it.

Willard: Adolescence is hard enough for anyone and I can't imagine that combined with AS. It just doesn't seem fair.

Jat: You honed in on what I've been thinking, exactly.

Well, I'm going show restraint here, but it won't be a "we love you" post either. First of all, reading your son's journal was a mistake on your part, but since you found it on the living room floor and not in your son's desk, it was in the shared space of the house, so you're technically in the clear. You did not invade privacy, since your son took his journal to the living room himself; your conscience can be clear. Being an aspie and getting screwed over left and right, I make it a habit to read up on legal definitions, so that I can catch anyone trying to mess with my mind in the act.

The biggest problem with reading your son's journal is that you can never "unread" it. You mentioned that now you're worried about your son taking your words out of context or yourself accidentally blurting out something you read. By attempting to solve one problem, you inadvertently created another one. A better way would have been to ask your son: "is there anything in your journal that you'd want to talk about, instead of just writing it?". Most likely, the answer will be "no", but it's still worth a try.

I agree with Tracker. Even though you said your son can tell you anything, he might have already "wised up" to it, and sees it as a trap. He chooses to share something with you, and doesn't get the reaction he expected (doesn't have to be anger/yelling, could be something as innocuous as a wrong tone of voice). Bam! a switch gets flipped in his head, and he regrets having shared anything with you. He clams up even further, and the vicious cycle continues. All I know is that when I was 12, I knew better than to share anything with my parents other than my grades (on demand) or what I learned in school (they always seemed pleased to listen to that). Why? The highly emotional reactions I always got. I was suicidal at the age of 12 too, and maybe it's for the best that your son chose to write about it; you were able to "catch" it. I, on the other hand, didn't tell a soul, despite the elaborateness of the plan. As for writing to my parents, I must have been a lawyer in my previous life, because I didn't want to communicate in a medium that leaves an evidence trail, even at the tender age of 12.

A major caveat about therapy. If there's anything that aspies hate the most, it's Rogerian therapy (the one with "how did that make you feel?"), and that goes double for aspie kids. While adults can memorize answers and spew them out, kids don't have the smarts to do that yet. If the therapist is pushy (as in "no, 'I didn't know what to say' is not a feeling"), it will result in your son thinking his therapist is an idiot in the best case, and in a meltdown right in the office in the worst case, which can't possibly help your son's cause. While therapy might be of some benefit, do extensive research on the methodology used; aspies often respond well to Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy, which is very logical in nature, and focuses on thoughts. And preferably, don't tell the therapist about your son's suicidal thoughts; let him share it himself, if he chooses. Psych workers can get very paranoid when they hear any references to suicide.

Okay first off let me put it this out there. It is really bad to have an ASD and be queer, especially at this age. I have been there it sucks. Honestly, you can probably not comprehend the hell he is going through. The first thing you need to do as a parent is accept he may be gay or bisexual, don't try any bigoted reparitive therapy stuff, it will only make matters worse. Therapy works when it can help him make him accept himself for who he is, not forcefully change him.

In terms of anti-depressants. Do not look at it as a catch all or even the solution, in fact they should only be considered only after he has gone through counseling by a therapist who is not a psychiatrist. For one is anti-depressents can actually increase suicidal tendancies in children and adolescants. Secondly they only help if the depression is clinical in nature. If it is coming from other stress in ones life they do not do a lick of good. I don't think many people really understand psychosomatic drugs. For one SSRIs are not nearly as effective on people with ASD and NVLD because much of the depression is coming from stress related to the disability, not chemical depression. He has the double whammy of having stress from the neurological issue and stress from sexual development. His depression is not coming from a chemical imbalance it sounds like, but rather from social position.

With regards to therapy. I think it is a good idea, but he needs to be willing to go along with it and not feel forced.
Secondly I would not recommend taking him to a psychiatrist. (These medications were designed for adults, not children, especially not kids during puberty). I would infact recommend a social worker or psychologist who with LGBT youth, and focuses more on therapy sessions (in general therapy works better than drugs for anxiety/depression). From what it sounds like he is under enormous stress just in day to day life. It does need to be addressed, but in a thoughtful understanding way.

I've read the other posts, and they are extremely good -- their advice is pertinent and correct, I think.

I've been in your position, although my son was a little older. But having said that, he said in later years that when he was in elementary school, he ALWAYS thought about suicide. This was before we had ever heard of Asperger's (and we only heard about it when this son's younger brother was found to be on the spectrum). We could see that our son was struggling socially as a little kid, and his dad was awfully hard on him at times. He was quiet, not athletic, and unhappy. I only found out about suicidal thoughts when he was 14 and began to write poetry online when he realized that a girl he liked didn't like him. A mother of a friend of his read the poetry (this girl FRIEND showed it to her, thank heavens), called me, and we realized that it was relatively serious. But we also felt like he would not go to see a therapist (I asked). After a few years, the situation resolved itself. But in the interim, like you, I often felt like I couldn't let him out of my sight. It's a very uncomfortable, sick feeling, isn't it?

Along with the very good advice everyone has given, I can say this: talk with your son as much as possible. Become interested in his interests. I know that there are times when you will have to discpline, or things are hard at home, and you can't always be happy and cheerful. But when you can, make sure that you have FUN with your son. If he's affectionate at all, then you be affectionate. And do realize that boys who are NOT on the spectrum often do not discuss their feelings with their mothers or fathers. Boys just don't express their feelings as teenagers. That's why you really have to have FUN with your kids, and make your home as loving and happy as possible -- to counteract the outside world and how hard it is for our kids on the spectrum.