1-4% of eurasians carry Neanderthal genomes
10 May 2010, 6:05 pm
I know there are some American Indian groups who believe that Natives have always been on the continent and reject the out of Africa theory out of hand. I wonder if they will take anything from this.
Actually they are young earth creationists too. They just dont have a firm cronology.
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davidred wrote...
I installed Ubuntu once and it completely destroyed my paying relationship with Microsoft.
10 May 2010, 6:24 pm
I know there are some American Indian groups who believe that Natives have always been on the continent and reject the out of Africa theory out of hand. I wonder if they will take anything from this.
Actually they are young earth creationists too. They just dont have a firm cronology.
I'm confused about this, because I thought it was their own mythology they were following rather than christianity/judaism. Or is it some mix of the two. I know in the documentary Spencer Wells did, he talked to some Natives in the Southwest and they were not wanting to hear his out of africa stuff but they seemed pretty receptive to the thought that the Reindeer herders in the arctic circle might be their distant relatives just based on resemblance.
10 May 2010, 10:24 pm
I know there are some American Indian groups who believe that Natives have always been on the continent and reject the out of Africa theory out of hand. I wonder if they will take anything from this.
Actually they are young earth creationists too. They just dont have a firm cronology.
I'm confused about this, because I thought it was their own mythology they were following rather than christianity/judaism. Or is it some mix of the two. I know in the documentary Spencer Wells did, he talked to some Natives in the Southwest and they were not wanting to hear his out of africa stuff but they seemed pretty receptive to the thought that the Reindeer herders in the arctic circle might be their distant relatives just based on resemblance.
Sorry to confuse you.
Yes they are following their own mythology. Its just that their creation myths do not assume the world is billions of years old. Or even millions. Their myths are a bit vague about how old the world is, but there were not eons of time before humanity arrived on the scene.
Their myths are human centric.
When remains are found for instance, if its on their land they claim it as their ancestors. The idea is that they have always been there and didnt move around. So the world can only go as far back as their oral history, and anything that contradicts that is... Know what I mean?
_________________
davidred wrote...
I installed Ubuntu once and it completely destroyed my paying relationship with Microsoft.
10 May 2010, 11:04 pm
The early hard dates are for the Clovis, 13,000 years, but they were wiped out, and the next wave is 11,000 years ago, from Siberia.
Their hair marks them as Chinese, and their teeth Erectus. An early hunter people from before the Neanderthal line bred into China.
While most say they wandered in from the Northwest, some say they came from a hole in the ground.
Medowcroft rock shelter is a deep hole in the ground on the Ohio Pennsylvania border. Of the people who can be connected to it, Souix and Objibway, they share a genetic marker with Norway, on the male line, from 15,000 years ago.
It is fairly easy to follow one flow out of Africa going across south Asia, with only two people going north, becoming cold adapted, wearing clothes, eating grass seed. Native Americans are another multiregional group, early Chinese Erectus.
It is much harder to see from the Americas, 500 Nations, little knowledge of the old world. They are the only surviving Erectus line.
Byron Skyes wrote, The Seven Faces of Eve, about seven mother lines who make up almost all of Europe. Only two fit the Neanderthal pattern.
In the east, the Han Chinese make up 92% of all China. They all fit the Neanderthal pattern. There are also 56 minorities, Chinese without Neanderthal.
South Asia, India, Africa, no Neanderthal, Sapiens with perhaps another species.
Genetics is not yet a science. while we can spot different, we have little idea of function.
Austrailians were in isolation, and are the most like Sapiens of 50,000 years ago. Their main trait, wavey hair. It sets them apart from African hair.
The lines that went north were few, line bred, and produced Neanderthal, with the coloration of an Orangutang, red hair, golden eyes.
Sapiens became Lucistic, yellow hair, blue eyes, pink skin. We have some alligators in the zoo that show the same.
In China the line developed straight hair, and golden skin.
Albinos have white skin and red eyes, but never got far.
Europeans and Neanderthal gold and blue eyes, produced Green and hazel eyes. There are reports of gold eyes in eastern Europe, and Grey, with red hair. The grey points to yet another line. There is a whole people through Siberia, grey eyes, red hair, and well thought of.
Each of these sub species has a differance in thought and perception.
This overthrows the concept of Homo Sapien Sapiens.
Not races, breeds, but different DNA, each evolving along divergent paths.
10 May 2010, 11:09 pm
I knew a girl with gold eyes. They were quite remarkable, and couldnt be called green or hazel. I never met her family though, to see if they had it too.
_________________
davidred wrote...
I installed Ubuntu once and it completely destroyed my paying relationship with Microsoft.
11 May 2010, 3:54 am
Their hair marks them as Chinese, and their teeth Erectus. An early hunter people from before the Neanderthal line bred into China.
While most say they wandered in from the Northwest, some say they came from a hole in the ground.
Medowcroft rock shelter is a deep hole in the ground on the Ohio Pennsylvania border. Of the people who can be connected to it, Souix and Objibway, they share a genetic marker with Norway, on the male line, from 15,000 years ago.
It is fairly easy to follow one flow out of Africa going across south Asia, with only two people going north, becoming cold adapted, wearing clothes, eating grass seed. Native Americans are another multiregional group, early Chinese Erectus.
It is much harder to see from the Americas, 500 Nations, little knowledge of the old world. They are the only surviving Erectus line.
Byron Skyes wrote, The Seven Faces of Eve, about seven mother lines who make up almost all of Europe. Only two fit the Neanderthal pattern.
In the east, the Han Chinese make up 92% of all China. They all fit the Neanderthal pattern. There are also 56 minorities, Chinese without Neanderthal.
South Asia, India, Africa, no Neanderthal, Sapiens with perhaps another species.
Genetics is not yet a science. while we can spot different, we have little idea of function.
Austrailians were in isolation, and are the most like Sapiens of 50,000 years ago. Their main trait, wavey hair. It sets them apart from African hair.
The lines that went north were few, line bred, and produced Neanderthal, with the coloration of an Orangutang, red hair, golden eyes.
Sapiens became Lucistic, yellow hair, blue eyes, pink skin. We have some alligators in the zoo that show the same.
In China the line developed straight hair, and golden skin.
Albinos have white skin and red eyes, but never got far.
Europeans and Neanderthal gold and blue eyes, produced Green and hazel eyes. There are reports of gold eyes in eastern Europe, and Grey, with red hair. The grey points to yet another line. There is a whole people through Siberia, grey eyes, red hair, and well thought of.
Each of these sub species has a differance in thought and perception.
This overthrows the concept of Homo Sapien Sapiens.
Not races, breeds, but different DNA, each evolving along divergent paths.
that's a really beautiful post. I'm such a dork it made me cry.
By australians you mean aborigines right?
I would love to think the concept of homo sapiens sapiens is overthrown. I don't know why. I like to see things overthrown I guess. As an someone from the American South its awesome that Africans have turned out to be the most 'purebred' people on the face of the earth.
There was the story of Tom Joyner on African American lives and he had striking grey eyes and they showed him a picture of his caucasian ancestor, who had the same striking grey eyes, and he was struck because he said people had made note of them all his life and he finally saw who he got them from (it was a painted portrait by the way, of a wealthy ancestor).
I can believe that thought patterns and perception is different. Some people may consider it racist. I feel it on the Cherokee reservation. When you see aborigine people on tv there is something different there.
Those two examples are something I have felt drawn to all my life. My particular culture has an energy that I have always found repulsive and frightening. That is not genetics or science but it just a sense of something, an energy. I don't know how much of it falls outside of culture, if any. I just know it's there.
also I read Sykes book a few years ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Daughters_of_Eve
it is fascinating, athough like the wiki article states the narratives he makes up are flawed (and ridiculously sexist in my opinion) which kind of marred the book for me a bit, he could have just stuck to the science, but he's pretty much the guy that got me interested in all of this (i'm sure that's true for alot of people).
I guess my question is, since Sykes and Wells both have orgs where you can send off and get your DNA analyzed, would it be possible for me to find out if I am part Neanderthal? I want to be Neanderthal really bad now.
11 May 2010, 4:08 am
I know there are some American Indian groups who believe that Natives have always been on the continent and reject the out of Africa theory out of hand. I wonder if they will take anything from this.
Actually they are young earth creationists too. They just dont have a firm cronology.
I'm confused about this, because I thought it was their own mythology they were following rather than christianity/judaism. Or is it some mix of the two. I know in the documentary Spencer Wells did, he talked to some Natives in the Southwest and they were not wanting to hear his out of africa stuff but they seemed pretty receptive to the thought that the Reindeer herders in the arctic circle might be their distant relatives just based on resemblance.
Sorry to confuse you.
Yes they are following their own mythology. Its just that their creation myths do not assume the world is billions of years old. Or even millions. Their myths are a bit vague about how old the world is, but there were not eons of time before humanity arrived on the scene.
Their myths are human centric.
When remains are found for instance, if its on their land they claim it as their ancestors. The idea is that they have always been there and didnt move around. So the world can only go as far back as their oral history, and anything that contradicts that is... Know what I mean?
yes I know, the problem is that many natives have strong mythology with burial and disturbing the remains of the dead so if remains are determined to be ancient there is a tug of war between science and native rights and with DNA studies advancing they are going to eventually be disappointed I am afraid, if this hasn't already happened, when the DNA of remains contradicts the DNA of the tribe, and some see it as an attempt to usurp native land rights. It seems like quite a sticky situation and I bet some Natives suspect that adhering to the belief in their creationism is the safest course in terms of what land rights they do have. It must be unsettling, I can definitely understand the conundrum they face.
