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OJani
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21 Jun 2012, 5:57 am

On the day of summer solstice (20th or 21th of June) you have the longest opportunity to observe the Sun for possible solutions. Good luck.


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21 Jun 2012, 10:00 am

brickmack wrote:
Oot using any technology that is even sorta close to our current level. Not much point to it either, theres no resources there other than the abundant energy supply. Just lots and lots of hydrogen and helium and other light gases. Not to mention the REALLY high gravity (as in, you would be squished like a pancake even when thousands of miles away probably)N


Energy can be exploited, only if there's a difference in temperature.

There isn't much usable energy for a colony on the sun.


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Jitro
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21 Jun 2012, 12:04 pm

brickmack wrote:
Oot using any technology that is even sorta close to our current level. Not much point to it either, theres no resources there other than the abundant energy supply. Just lots and lots of hydrogen and helium and other light gases. Not to mention the REALLY high gravity (as in, you would be squished like a pancake even when thousands of miles away probably)N


If antigravity is possible (no evidence in favor of it being) then perhaps the high gravity could be shielded.



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21 Jun 2012, 12:17 pm

i have heard the term that "the sun shines out of his arse", and i think that in order for the sun to be shining from his backside, he must have "colonized" the sun (ie stuck it up his bottom).


in reality, there is no possibility of "colonizing" the sun. the mere suggestion is ludicrous.



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21 Jun 2012, 12:54 pm

The underlying idea behind this question is. That there's a lot of energy on the sun.

With enough energy, you could shield your self from the heat, and extract the elements you need from the plasma. Something like inverted tocamac technology (magnetic fields).

The problem is, that usable energy can be pumped only if there's a difference in temperature. Sure, there is a lot of energy on the son, but its evenly distributed.


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b9
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21 Jun 2012, 1:15 pm

harnessing the small arc of energy of the sun (which shines in all directions) that bathes our tiny earth is very difficult. there is about 1000 watts per square meter of solar energy that shines upon the world, and that means that only 6 square metres of 100% efficient solar panels (i know it it is not yet possible) would be more than enough to provide a household with double the power that it needs during daylight hours, and surpluses are fed into the grid, so electricity credits should be able to be redeemed at night when they are needed at no cost (presuming that you have fed enough energy into the grid to cover the costs.
.



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21 Jun 2012, 1:39 pm

I'm not saying its fully thought through what i said.

I think solar panel work on the assumption, there is light in one direction, and less form the other (microscopically on the surface of the material). There's a caveat in what you are saying. I don't think they can work on the sun.

If you have total homogeneity, entropy is maximal, you can't do anything. Locally on the sun, everything is homogeneous.

Well, thats not 100% true. We could pump energy by the various local inhomogeneities. Solar spots, solar wind, solar currents, etc...

If this energy is enough, we could shield our selves from the heat and pump materials from the plasma.

Will it be enough? Its not clear cut

Even if very hard, its potentially interesting, because stars are huge.


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ruveyn
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21 Jun 2012, 1:53 pm

Quantum_Immortal wrote:
I

If you have total homogeneity, entropy is maximal, you can't do anything. Locally on the sun, everything is homogeneous.

.


From a thermodynamic p.o.v. the sun is low entropy. Very concentrated. And there is nothing homogenous about the sun. It is a boiling chaotic body run through with strong magnetic fields.
ruveyn



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21 Jun 2012, 2:13 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Quantum_Immortal wrote:
I

If you have total homogeneity, entropy is maximal, you can't do anything. Locally on the sun, everything is homogeneous.

.


From a thermodynamic p.o.v. the sun is low entropy. Very concentrated. And there is nothing homogenous about the sun. It is a boiling chaotic body run through with strong magnetic fields.
ruveyn


I meant locally. If every where around you is 5000 degrees, you can't do much with that.

I didn't considered fusion( artificial).

.... I suppose with artificial fusion you could colonize the sun.


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joannaaleksandra
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21 Jun 2012, 3:24 pm

Colonization of the Sun would never be possible.



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21 Jun 2012, 3:48 pm

Radiation is bad for fleshy things, moving to death valley would suck enough.... cold is fixable, heat is tricky to shed if your in a hot place, thermionics make electricity from heat, but will not work without a cold side.

Now fixing what we have now, or moving into undersea domes......



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21 Jun 2012, 5:04 pm

Ways to do it.

Heat:
Use inverted tocamac. If enough energy, the colony can shield it self from the heat. We are talking about ~6000°K. Aren't they materials that can survive these temperatures? (diamond = 4000)

Energy:
Well, its the sun. A lot of energy there, how much of it is usable? With enough energy, you do what ever you want.
Actual production from: Solar winds, flow of plasma, magnetic field variation, sun spots, Local Temperature differences. Sun spots are colder then the surrounding material. "Wind mills" could give energy. Magnetic fields could endure currents in coils. Fusion should give quite a lot of energy.

Materials:
Extract then directly from the plasma of the sun. Need enough energy

It would look like a floating city. Probably huge for economies of scale. Around it, it will have a protective magnetic field.

If energy production is high enough, it could be done.


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ruveyn
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21 Jun 2012, 7:23 pm

Quantum_Immortal wrote:
Ways to do it.

Heat:
Use inverted tocamac. If enough energy, the colony can shield it self from the heat. We are talking about ~6000°K. Aren't they materials that can survive these temperatures? (diamond = 4000)

Energy:
Well, its the sun. A lot of energy there, how much of it is usable? With enough energy, you do what ever you want.
Actual production from: Solar winds, flow of plasma, magnetic field variation, sun spots, Local Temperature differences. Sun spots are colder then the surrounding material. "Wind mills" could give energy. Magnetic fields could endure currents in coils. Fusion should give quite a lot of energy.

Materials:
Extract then directly from the plasma of the sun. Need enough energy

It would look like a floating city. Probably huge for economies of scale. Around it, it will have a protective magnetic field.

If energy production is high enough, it could be done.


How does one get through the near corona which is at over a million degrees Celsius?

ruveyn



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21 Jun 2012, 8:02 pm

ruveyn wrote:

How does one get through the near corona which is at over a million degrees Celsius?

ruveyn


"near"? some typo?

That thing is almost vacuum, normal shielding should be good enough. Also its a plasma, magnetic shielding should keep it out side. Anti radiation shielding for the radiation. Compared with actually colonizing the sun, this is trivial.


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21 Jun 2012, 9:37 pm

gravity? What kind of shielding? Again. Gravity. And how do you shed the heat?



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22 Jun 2012, 6:44 am

ThanatosSigma wrote:
gravity? What kind of shielding? Again. Gravity. And how do you shed the heat?


Gravity kills?

Something like a reverted tocamac + led

You'll need a heat pump (need energy)


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