The Dino-Aspie Ex-Café (for Those 40+... or feeling creaky)

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skeeterhawk
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15 Apr 2008, 1:41 pm

krex, I will try again.

When I made my comment about lying, I talked about how I felt it diminished my hold on a physical reality. I always long for plain and straight talk because it matches my primary, nuts and bolts oriented, reality. The responses y'all gave were exactly that. They were straight descriptions that I look for. The interaction we had was an instance of what we were talking about. Talking in nuts and bolts ABOUT talking in nut and bolts.

When I investigate my relatively uncommon mind features, it seems like I run into this sort of thing more than I expect.

I read a piece by Jane Meyerding where she described how eerie it was to read accurate descriptions of what she had always thought were her own idiosyncratic inner traits. It was eerie for me to read about that since I had had an eerie feeling about reading about what I had thought were my own idiosyncratic inner traits.

I start describing something about my mind and find that my description is an example of what I am describing.

Like the comic says "That stuff happens to me all the time".

(One of my favorite movies is Adaptation with NicK Cage.)

morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 1:48 pm

krex wrote:

I think that is some good advice postie...especially ..reality therapy. I admire anyone who can work in "those places". Hell on earth is not being dramatic.

As far as therapy...if he is aspie then he might benefit more from a very concrete "Rational Emotive Therapy" then the usual, feel sorry for yourself therapies.

My bigger concern is.... has he been tested for other possible cognitive problems. My BF has MS and also narcolepsy...(I think he also maybe AS but it is hard to tell because some of the MS cognitive issues look like AS. ) He takes ADD medication for the narcolepsy and it helps a bit as long as he doesn't drive for long. Having one disability doesn't protect you from having others. I think that it may even make it more probable. Your description makes me think Alzheimer's is something to have checked out.

When it comes to human behavior that I find "challenging" I always think....THUROUGHLY rule out physical causes before seeking psychological ones. that's y motto and I'm stick en to it.

Reika...about lying...yeah, I seem to understand intellectually "why" people would lie...I was a psych major,so there are bunchs of reasons...including self delusion. But, since I can't tell when they are and it sucks to go around being suspicious all the time, I decided it was just easier to assume that they are telling the truth until I have some good proof that they aren't...trying to figure it out, just over-loads me. I have to spend my energy just trying to get a sentence out, have nothing left to "read them". That decision led to some pretty bad experiences so I made a further decision to just stay away from people as much as possible. Now that I am with people(WP), that I think tell the truth more often then not...I can be a a little social again.

He won't go get tested. For as long as I've been alive, if something requires him to change, he won't do it or if he does he has to be drug along.

Now, to give you an idea as to the temper tantrums that I'm talking about,this morning I was supposed to take him to get the lift on his chair fixed.

I went in about 11 and checked on him. He was in his underwear watching tv. Now, one of my brothers has said that he will drag things like this out all day, then not do them. He's noticed that sometimes you have to tell him I'm leaving in __ amount of time and pretty much take off whether he is ready to go or not. Otherwise it will not get done.

Anyhow, I went in and told him that I would be leaving to get it done in about 20 minutes. Instead of getting ready, he came out and started getting after me about how it's going to cost $1,800 (which I don't know about knowing him). I told him that if I cannot pay it I will have the bill sent here. He tried to say that I don't know what to tell the repairman, which is a lie since I was there when we all tested his lift. I told him I would say that the lift won't go down. Finally, he said, go and get it fixed as he went back into his room but that if I did that I might as well go and find an apartment and not come home.

I have a feeling this is similar to how he acts with my mom when he takes to threatening a divorce over not being able to drive.

Now, I would want to consider Alzhiemer's, especially since he did have a mini-stroke about a year ago. However, my mom will tell you that he has always been like this. It used to be that when he would threaten divorce she would get scared and do whatever it was that he wanted. She says he's done this sort of thing the whole time they've been married.

I have to agree with her there. As a child I used to have to obey all sorts of silly rules of his, like not to buy books just because they take up space. When I didn't obey them without question, he would take to yelling and screaming in no time.

So this is not age-related.

I do like the idea of taking him to a nursing home and telling him that if he doesn't take care of himself he will go there, though.

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morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 1:52 pm

SleepyDragon wrote:

morning_after wrote:

My brother, the one that's a pastor, suggested that we all get together and tell him that we do not feel he should be driving, that it's nothing personal, and that we are concerned that he is not physically fit to drive, and, as a result, driving arrangements will stay as they are.

In the interests of your dad's safety, and the safety of other users of the road, this is the right thing to do.

His suspiciousness and distrust of people around him doesn't inevitably signal the onset of Alzheimer (or other form of dementia), but this possibility should be kept in mind.

His best asset is his concerned and caring family. Especially when the alternative is for him to be stuck in an aged-care gulag for the rest of his life. I agree that a person who has been accustomed to running his or her own life can take things pretty hard when their freedoms are suddenly curtailed.

Wishing you a happy resolution to all of this.

My dad has talked like he does want to go into assisted living.

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morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 1:55 pm

postpaleo wrote:

rereading what i wrote i might have come across all gruff, didn't mean to I just get worked up about this general subject.

Another thought, I never did well in a formal school setting, but did ok when i figured out a method to accomplish the same thing that fit me.
You can find out what the exercises (I assume) are and maybe find another setting or another way that he might like better.
Maybe something more aspie conducive? You did mention incontinence, that can be overcome if it is just poor muscles control.
It takes patience and he is aware, so baring the narcolepsy, it is fixable. It is a matter of holding it a little longer each time.
Like a little kid does and that's exactly why they do it, they just don't know it.
And as Krex and Sleepy said if he hasn't had a really thorough physical, that is a must. Just to rule out other problems.
He needs an attitude shift, not as easy. But again I go back to obsessions or likes.
Look, I hardly ever go outside, but have not enough time to do what I'd like inside as it is.
That is my attitude, it would probably drive most anyone up a wall, but not me. They're constantly trying to "fix" me.
Sometimes when it comes to therapists and doctors we relate easier to some better than others.
It very well might be the one he was seeing wasn't the right one for him.
Get inventive, think out of the box.

Any kind of doctor that you would suggest? We would need one that will come to the house and evaluate him quietly if it is to happen at all.

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morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 1:59 pm

sinsboldly wrote:

blessedmom wrote:

Heard about this http://www.freerice.com/ site on the news this morning. I figured with the huge vocabularies in the cafe, we may be able to feed a few children. It only takes a few minutes and it costs nothing.

oh, great! I am already late for work, now! :roll:

I certainly hope those grains of rice are making it to somebodies mouth!

and morning_after. If I had half a chance to sit on my ass and cry, believe me I would take it. My appitite that all things should go my way and flow to me has no reasoning, no bottom and no end. I have sat on my butt and whined and cried and people have just LET me ( for even I know there is nothing they can give me will comfort or satisfy me) and then I get bored of it and get up and do something else.

I can not even dream of how long I could milk it if there were people around me that I could guilt and manipulate and bug about it! Makes me shudder to think about it!
Horrible as it may sound, the reality shock will change your relationship with your father forever, but it seems to be his choice to change that relationship if he leaves you no choice.

Life is 'not fair'.
Merle

I know that, and it's hard.

It's like dealing with a 66 year old baby (born in 42)

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morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 2:01 pm

Nan wrote:

morning_after wrote:

Ok, I know this is off -topic a little, but I promised my mom I would post this on this board and see what other people here thought.

And my dad is over 60, so I thought the most appropriate place to post this question is in here.

for those who don't know, I think my dad has a very strong AS personality despite never being diagnosed.

His driving concerns us.

He is a handicapped person. He cannot walk and uses a powerchair to get around. the has tons of pain, so he doesn't have freedom from that, either. His bowls are, well... I'll just say he does not have the freedom of having them work properly.

He is given to narcellelpcy? and has shown he cannot stay awake.

A month or two ago, he had to have the doctor recommend that he not drive. His license has not been fully revoked, because ADOT is reviewing his case.

however, he was driving onto the sidewalk several times on his way to the doctor's office that morning.

My mom says there have been times when she drives with him and he nearly sideswiped people. She also says he's just about run them over in his powerchair on account of falling asleep.

I've ridden with him as he found himself doing 45 down the freeway (the speed limit is 65) while everyone else passed us doing the speed limit. I've also ridden with him as he's taken to swerving uncontrollably and hit a handicapped sign as he tried to park his car.

The decision that the rest of us came to was to have me take the car to work that she would drive, while she takes his. He's continues to insist that he can drive, indicating that he would take the car if he decided he was ok to drive.

Which means he would be driving, honestly, at times when he is falling asleep at the wheel.

But he insists in his tamper-tantrums. He's been threatening divorce, which we have learned he will not do. He claims that my mom is treating him like a child, claiming that he does not need another mom. He also calls her his warden.

he has activities here in the local retirement community he can go to, and we give him a ride when he wants to go somewhere, but he doesn't tend to take advantage of them.

He's said he does not want to go on vacation when the rest of us do because we will not let him drive.

This is despite the fact that we do not think he can take care of himself at all.

What do you do in a situation like this?

My brother, the one that's a pastor, suggested that we all get together and tell him that we do not feel he should be driving, that it's nothing personal, and that we are concerned that he is not physically fit to drive, and, as a result, driving arrangements will stay as they are. My mom basically already told him this, and gave him the number for ADOT so that he can have an avenue to pursue to see about getting tested and maybe regaining his ability to drive.

We think ADOT will tell him his license has been revoked in three weeks.

Since he had the recommendation from the doctor that he should not drive, he has been throwing temper tantrums about not being able to use the car and we are honestly at a loss about how to deal with him.

Anybody have any ideas?

Well, it's either take his keys or be partly responsible when he kills someone.... Glad I'm not you.

haha, I'm glad I'm not him.

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Nan
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15 Apr 2008, 2:32 pm

krex wrote:

Nan...I don't just look guilty when I am accused I actually feel guilty and second guess my reality...did I do something and forget...do I have MPD? That this seems more possible then that someone would lie to me or wrongly accuse me. I have had my moments of doubt about my sanity when accused of something I am "pretty sure" I didn't do. I wonder where that guilt comes from...and not trusting your own reality? Do you think it was from being punished for things that I didn't do when I was a kid?

I dunno, Krexie, but it sound really familiar.
Probably the "not trusting your own reality" bit. There's a lot of that running loose in the world, not just with Aspies.

krex
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15 Apr 2008, 3:32 pm

Nan wrote:

krex wrote:

I dunno, Krexie, but it sound really familiar.
Probably the "not trusting your own reality" bit. There's a lot of that running loose in the world, not just with Aspies.

Well,I think surviving 7 years with a cronic liar(king George), whose obvious lies and inconsistencies the media never used to even question....might have something to do with a sense of "unreality" in the world. Actually, the news itself seems to be shaking my sense of reality...."CNN, Can you really find nothing better to talk about then some movie stars antics or giving free air time to politicians slanted attacks n each other???" What the hell is happening in Darfur and with the UN's declaration that..."Yes, it is genocide".... I thought that it was designed to prevent genocide?

Skeeterhawk...thanks for the clairification. I think I "get it" now. I recall how shocked I was when I first came to WP and found that I wasn't the only one who experienced things a certain way. There were still misunderstandings but 95% more clear then my attempts to explain to people in my past...here, I often don't have to explain

That is the missing piece of the puzzle, I believe, in the problem of our "theory of mind".....we understand that others have different feelings/thoughts/goals but so many NT minds are just to alien to understand and when we try and relate it to our own minds....we are often wrong.(and so are they which is pretty important, considering they are the ones who are currently defining our reality) Here, we can often relate to the "others mind", even when it is different because at least it is in the same solar system as our own.

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15 Apr 2008, 4:18 pm

Lucky me .... I'm meeting SleepDragon and family in real life this weekend!! !

I've met Lau the magnificent already.

And of course Nannarob is my Mum.

I'm slowly making my way through the DinoCafe!!

Beware DinoCafer's ........ you could be next. *Evil laugh*

Helen

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15 Apr 2008, 4:57 pm

Sometimes I feel so helpless being an empathetic NT in a logical world, but here goes:

Morning_after, you and your mother have been under stress for a long time because of your father. Because he has never taken responsibility for himself and his health he has never grown up. To get his own way he bellows like a baby. He is manipulative and selfish.

I agree with all the comments made so far. I especially love PP's raspy voice!

Take away the keys. Tell him you will report him to the police if he attempts to drive again ..and do it if you have to.

It's obvious that you are an emotional aspie but your father may be logical. If that is the case ensure you deal with him in a logical way.

Good luck and peacefullness to you!

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I think there must be some chronic learning disability that is so prevalent among NT's that it goes unnoticed by the "experts". Krex

Nan
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15 Apr 2008, 4:58 pm

Smelena - Disneyland is cheaper in the winter, when locals can get discount tickets. Whale-watching is pretty cool, too. Why not have an Aspie meetup in SoCal next year?

Back to business - Now doesn't this seem like one of the most cool jobs ever? {sigh} AND they gots a dead guy, too!

http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/n ... icle/17640

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15 Apr 2008, 5:11 pm

About lying...

I describe myself as patalogically honest, and my father before me. It is just the way I am. I am also gullible.

I wonder if the way Krex and Skeeterhawk and others describe their reaction to lying is part of aspergers. You are continually reading the handbook on social interaction and analysing how it all works.

If someone lies to me I distrust them, dislike them, withdraw from them. I may be angry with myself for being so gullible but I don't have the big reaction that Merle does.

I think that it is sad that here is another thing that frustrates you so much.

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I think there must be some chronic learning disability that is so prevalent among NT's that it goes unnoticed by the "experts". Krex

Smelena
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15 Apr 2008, 7:38 pm

Nan wrote:

Nan, I am planning on a North American holiday but it's going to take me 5 years to save up. So I'll see you in 2013!

The job looks perfect for my sons!

Helen

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15 Apr 2008, 7:59 pm

Helen

Try to get the rush on that 2013 date, the world is going to end December 21st, 2012 AD.

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morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 8:43 pm

Smelena wrote:

I volunteer to be next.

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morning_after
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15 Apr 2008, 8:47 pm

nannarob wrote:

Thank you. I did manage to have him come with me to get his lift fixed. We had a lever that was bent and the guy that straightened it charged us nothing. Which is a far cry from the $1800 my dad was screaming about.

Thank you.

And I found a birthday gift to give him on his b-day in about a week. The one thing he wants is a Nintendo DS and the game "Brain Age".

Anyone familiar with this game?

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