The National Socialist Question

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Joined: 10 Feb 2011
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09 Apr 2011, 8:23 pm

I think this would be a bad idea. I'm all for free speech, but this would be too much.

Remember. A while back one member advocated the setting up of a sub-forum for conservative christians, and was refused. If you allow a special Stormfront-lite sub-forum, you could have little argument against the conservative christian proposal. If those two proposals were implemented, you would then have to give serious consideration to any other proposal from all other bat-s**t crazy groups.

You could end up with special fora for muslim fundamentalists, fundie Pro-lifers, the KKK, the BNP etc.

I suppose I can see where the OP is coming from, but if the NSers are going to post on this site, then at least they should do it in the open where the other people on this site are free to register their disapproval.

Last edited by Butterflies on 09 Apr 2011, 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

HerrGrimm
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09 Apr 2011, 8:26 pm

MidlifeAspie wrote:

HerrGrimm wrote:

Zen wrote:

MidlifeAspie wrote:

WP will not be creating a "StormFront for autistics" as long as I am moderating here. Members who post racist remarks will continue to be banned as long as I am moderating here. Hate speech will continue to be shunned as long as I am a moderator here. The NS question has been answered. It is not welcome here.

Thank goodness. I can't put into words how this thread made me feel. I didn't know those people were here.

Sorry you felt those things.

I have a question: How many Moderators are on this forum? And on this specific board? Do they switch or something like that? This is very important to my next statement.

There are three. We all moderate all the boards.

OK, so...what I don't get is this...when you were in the Hitler debate thread, it was very obvious to see two links in the upper part of the page. I presume you read these things before you posted. You want to know the reason why I started this thread? And that I made this idea?

Because one of those links had hate literature from murderers and bank robbers. Extremely virulent stuff. That's the real reason why I made this topic. If that was going to pass then an attempt to segregate the board to prevent this stuff seemed reasonable.

How did you not click on that and see it? If you are banning people for racist comments (it is being applied unequally, but there are only three of you so I understand that more), why didn't you ban the guy who distributed it? Or is it some loophole with hyperlinks?

EDIT: YES!! ! I TOLD YOU I CAN HOLD ON FOR 3 PAGES!! !

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MidlifeAspie
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09 Apr 2011, 8:37 pm

HerrGrimm wrote:

How did you not click on that and see it?

I don't click on links to crazy talk, so I have no idea what was on there.

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HerrGrimm
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09 Apr 2011, 8:41 pm

MidlifeAspie wrote:

I don't click on links to crazy talk, so I have no idea what was on there.

You should probably do that next time so 1.) the community is better protected to get a proper banning, and 2.) I don't have to make threads with unconventional means to solve a problem.

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09 Apr 2011, 9:39 pm

HerrGrimm wrote:

I have a lot of music I want to share

Me too.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqUa_G1h3pw&feature=related[/youtube]

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HerrGrimm
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10 Apr 2011, 9:10 am

I figure since this thread cannot get to the top of the board (which you should know my feelings on), I would answer as many posts as possible.

I seriously thought that was going to be an NS song. I heard it before but did not know the band or the title.

You might ask why that person should be banned if I just went through all the motions to protect their speech. This one is quite simple: the post was out of context and was an attempt to incite something. That's not protected. If you are showing it as proof in an argument or to explain an argument, it should be OK in my opinion. I know, I know, the Terms and Agreements say otherwise...

There is a part of me that believes that some people don't want racists gone, but they want them to show up to fight them.

Again, if you go around WrongPlanet you can see my other posts have nothing to do with racism or NS or anything like that. I defended someone who was not NS from a personal attack. Don't you think that something might not be right there?

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Sallamandrina
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10 Apr 2011, 9:16 am

HerrGrimm wrote:

I do not think you understand the motive. In one thread, there was a poster who put a pro-Hitler website and a very racist bookstore in one of his posts. I believe that should have got you banned (yes, I surprisingly agree with you on that one). But instead of removing the thread due to complaints, the moderators LOCKED the thread so others can still see it. I know that if I saw a locked thread with 'Hitler' on it I would be the first to look there and see those sites. People have gotten away with abject racism like in that post, and he is not banned from what I know. So if you are not going to ban them and remove the thread, then you have to MOVE them somewhere else to minimize damage. There actually is something behind this. Numerous people I have seen complained about these things. THIS IS JUST AN IDEA. I cannot stress that enough.

This is I think a safe choice, believe it or not. WrongPlanet has not been mentioned on any website I know about for two years. Posters tend to complain about how liberal the website is.

If you would have bothered to ask before making assumptions and than jump to conclusions based on these incorrect assumptions you would have gotten an answer. You have no idea who was or wasn't banned and why and since there's a rule about not discussing it in public, people who really want to know ask privately. I always answer these questions. So I'll remind you - asking for someone to be banned or discussing a banned member in public is against the TOS.

Quote:

I do not think people truly understand what a banning really does. There are serious ramifications that one has to consider and make good judgments on them, like who exactly is a problem, etc. You cannot just ban someone because you can; you need really good judgment so it can be applied fairly in the future.

Again you have no idea what you're talking about and instead of asking you'd rather make assumptions. Nobody goes around swinging the banhammer as it takes their fancy. These things are documented in detail and when it comes to something as serious as banning all the other mods revise the situation and offer their own evaluation. On occasion the admin and Alex also participate.

It's very hard for me to believe you're "trying to solve a problem" when you cannot be even bothered to get your facts straight.

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Sallamandrina
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10 Apr 2011, 9:28 am

HerrGrimm wrote:

MidlifeAspie wrote:

I don't click on links to crazy talk, so I have no idea what was on there.

You should probably do that next time so 1.) the community is better protected to get a proper banning, and 2.) I don't have to make threads with unconventional means to solve a problem.

Again, please stop making assumptions. You assume the poster you refer to wasn't banned (based on what I wonder?) and 2.) indeed you don't need to make such threads, people who were really concerned about what happened contacted us privately and have the answers that you could have easily found out yourself if you really wanted to.

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HerrGrimm
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10 Apr 2011, 10:39 am

Sallamandrina wrote:

HerrGrimm wrote:

MidlifeAspie wrote:

I don't click on links to crazy talk, so I have no idea what was on there.

You should probably do that next time so 1.) the community is better protected to get a proper banning, and 2.) I don't have to make threads with unconventional means to solve a problem.

If the person was banned, wouldn't the profile and posts be removed? I based that on what happened at the Stormfront Trolls thread and other threads. A person's post and profile completely disappeared after they posted there. Other people's posts have disappeared based on the fact that I looked at conversations and they did not make any sense.

I still insist that that thread should be removed instead of locked. If you clicked on that link you would have seen how dangerous it was and removed the thread. I know a moderator can do that. It is still there after I made the public complaint it should be removed. That is the major basis for my argument.

EDIT: Removed some text.

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Last edited by HerrGrimm on 10 Apr 2011, 11:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sallamandrina
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10 Apr 2011, 11:22 am

HerrGrimm wrote:

No, they wouldn't. Who's profile and posts disappeared? Posts don't get deleted, they are removed so I could see them if they were. I'm afraid the conversation not making much sense is not a sign of missing posts.

HerrGrimm wrote:

I still insist that that thread should be removed instead of locked. If you clicked on that link you would have seen how dangerous it was and removed the thread. I know a moderator can do that. It is still there after I made the public complaint it should be removed. That is the major basis for my argument.

I find this reasonable and I edited the offensive links.

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HerrGrimm
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10 Apr 2011, 11:30 am

Sallamandrina wrote:

I find this reasonable and I edited the offensive links.

That was my point. If the thread was not locked but instead removed, I never would have made the original post. Based on looking at the profiles and still seeing them with the other posts they made, I had to take action and make a proposal based on what I saw. I'm sorry if I offended anyone, but I had to go with the information I had and do it quickly. Maybe I overreacted because I knew all this due to other research and people's opinions on what I saw on the other threads. Plus the freedom of speech gets a lot of confused with my affiliations.

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Last edited by HerrGrimm on 10 Apr 2011, 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sallamandrina
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10 Apr 2011, 11:35 am

Please tell me who's posts and profile were removed, it's worrying me that I don't know about it.

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10 Apr 2011, 11:38 am

HerrGrimm wrote:

You can contact me any time you want if you have such concerns, others do and I always answer. There's a rule here about not discussing banned members in public and except for issues involving someone's privacy, people can send me (or other mods) a PM and I'm always very open about it.

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10 Apr 2011, 11:45 am

Sallamandrina wrote:

HerrGrimm wrote:

OK, I'll do that next time. I believe this conflict is resolved then, I'll give you as much info as possible from here on as I get it. Since the conflict is resolved, I guess you can lock the thread. There is no reason for this to get out of hand.

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Sallamandrina
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10 Apr 2011, 11:48 am

Thank you, I'm glad to hear things are more clear now

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