antifa= terrorist PPR thread
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist
Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist
Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist
Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew
Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
- Martin Niemöller
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VegetableMan wrote:
TuskenR wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
Not my website and don't know the lay of the land yet , still finding my feet. I don't find it alarming though. I know some Antifa ( as in they use their logo's and slogans on Facebook ) and they are not terrorists.
What I do find alarming is the amount of arguing with mods ? Is this normal ?
I find it alarming because we're talking about censoring people's posts based on their opinion or belief. Good Lord, if you edited out every comment for false or misleading statements, you'd wipe out half the content, here.
As far as fighting with mods, no it's not normal. But I'll be gone soon, so it will be all good.
I don't mean alarming with you , or at least not just you. I've read a lot of strange things since joining and I just can't find the lay of the land. What do you mean 'will be gone soon' ? Are you leaving or are you alluding to your account being terminated ? Are you committing forum suicide for your principles ? Take it from someone who knows , forum suicide achieves nothing and leaves a bitter taste in your mouth.
_________________
So unscrew my head
And rinse it out
Polish my thoughts
Turn into doubts
VegetableMan wrote:
TuskenR wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
Not my website and don't know the lay of the land yet , still finding my feet. I don't find it alarming though. I know some Antifa ( as in they use their logo's and slogans on Facebook ) and they are not terrorists.
What I do find alarming is the amount of arguing with mods ? Is this normal ?
I find it alarming because we're talking about censoring people's posts based on their opinion or belief. Good Lord, if you edited out every comment for false or misleading statements, you'd wipe out half the content, here.
As far as fighting with mods, no it's not normal. But I'll be gone soon, so it will be all good.
Stick around, Veg. It's good to see you back.
Magna wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
TuskenR wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
Not my website and don't know the lay of the land yet , still finding my feet. I don't find it alarming though. I know some Antifa ( as in they use their logo's and slogans on Facebook ) and they are not terrorists.
What I do find alarming is the amount of arguing with mods ? Is this normal ?
I find it alarming because we're talking about censoring people's posts based on their opinion or belief. Good Lord, if you edited out every comment for false or misleading statements, you'd wipe out half the content, here.
As far as fighting with mods, no it's not normal. But I'll be gone soon, so it will be all good.
Stick around, Veg. It's good to see you back.
Thanks, man! I appreciate that.
_________________
What do you call a hot dog in a gangster suit?
Oscar Meyer Lansky
TuskenR wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
Not my website and don't know the lay of the land yet , still finding my feet. I don't find it alarming though. I know some Antifa ( as in they use their logo's and slogans on Facebook ) and they are not terrorists.
What I do find alarming is the amount of arguing with mods ? Is this normal ?
Generally speaking we encourage a degree of healthy discussion. Just speaking personally, I think it's healthy to have a mod team that is open to challenge.
There are a small number of users who take advantage of this occasionally. Broadly speaking, the users who complain about "mod bias" are nearly always the ones who have had favourable treatment. There's an extent to which that's just a cost of an egalitarian moderation philosophy, but of course mods are users like any other.
TuskenR wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
Not my website and don't know the lay of the land yet , still finding my feet. I don't find it alarming though. I know some Antifa ( as in they use their logo's and slogans on Facebook ) and they are not terrorists.
What I do find alarming is the amount of arguing with mods ? Is this normal ?
On the other forums you have experience with, are mods generally neutral in their stances on things such as politics and religion or do they freely profess their opinions on the matters?
I've had experience with a few different forums not related to autism. On one such forum the mods made an effort to remain neutral. Referees of sorts. As such when someone became a mod, they were no longer regular members and in a way didn't fraternize with members in the same way they used to. Similar to how it generally works in a business environment between line level employees and management. The two groups are different.
On another forum not related to autism, it was similar as to the above, but then one of the mods became hyper-partisan in regard to politics and started wielding power and influence in unprofessional ways to the point that long standing members started to leave. Myself included. It was uncomfortable and unsettling to watch. It was sad, really, because that site had thousands of followers and ended up ceasing to exist after being a premier international forum for many years. The change was a result of internal tumult.
There was a reason Johnny Carson was revered as the King of Late Night. He remained neutral during his career unlike Late Night hosts of this era.
Last edited by Magna on 02 Jun 2020, 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
IsabellaLinton wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Another question: Is it acceptable to call someone an "ignorant bigot " for identifying as an "equalitarian" rather than a "feminist?"
Yes, apparently it's acceptable content.
Hey! For some reason, I can't reply to your PM.
_________________
What do you call a hot dog in a gangster suit?
Oscar Meyer Lansky
The_Walrus wrote:
Please try to stick to the topic at hand rather than posting unrelated grievances and particularly rather than starting new conversations.
It is related to the topic. By the way, the last one, and I'm sure you know what we're talking about, made me really sick!
_________________
What do you call a hot dog in a gangster suit?
Oscar Meyer Lansky
Magna wrote:
TuskenR wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
Not my website and don't know the lay of the land yet , still finding my feet. I don't find it alarming though. I know some Antifa ( as in they use their logo's and slogans on Facebook ) and they are not terrorists.
What I do find alarming is the amount of arguing with mods ? Is this normal ?
On the other forums you have experience with, are mods generally neutral in their stances on things such as politics and religion or do they freely profess their opinions on the matters?
I don't frequent forums that discuss politics or religion although you will find it on any forum. Nearly every mod I've encountered usually had a limited posting presence unless it was for disciplinary reasons. Some of the things I've seen here would have easily led to a restriction on your posting privileges on other forums. I don't think I could give a fair comparison of other sites as this is alien to me , moderators decisions are usually final and even questioning them leads to trouble. It's good to know that moderation appears to be very open here even though it's not what I'm used too.
_________________
So unscrew my head
And rinse it out
Polish my thoughts
Turn into doubts
ASPartOfMe
Veteran
Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 39,637
Location: Long Island, New York
Antifa is both a cause and the belief in the use of certain tactics to achieve that cause, more equivalent to the conservative cause, then people who are conservative. Calling Antifa "terrorist" or any other pejorative should not be banned.
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“Self Acceptance is a process not a performance”
“You are autistic enough. And you always have been”
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity.
VegetableMan wrote:
Doesn't it alarm anyone that we're actually having a discussion about whether or not calling Antifa terrorists should be allowed here?
The mods seem to operate from a viewpoint of "does this offend someone" and to a lesser degree, the rules.
So, it seems like a good discussion.
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Then a hero comes along, with the strength to carry on, and you cast your fears aside, and you know you can survive.
Be the hero of your life.
The_Walrus wrote:
That’s a good post, NP.
When I locked the thread, the attacks on Antifa were a long way down my list of priorities. The overriding reasons were 1) personal attacks, 2) a single post which said that all Conservatives were Nazis, a distant 3) the provocative framing of the OP. Perhaps I shouldn’t have mentioned Antifa at all.
Agree that “Antifa” as an organisation is stretching the definition of organisation. But other political beliefs such as liberalism and conservatism are also not organisations. We don’t accept “liberalism is a mental disorder”. I don’t think we should accept “conservatism is a terrorist organisation”.
Speaking hypothetically, if a couple of users started publicly identifying as Antifa members or followers then I don’t see why we wouldn’t give them the same protection we would give other non-bigoted ideologies.
Obviously if the President really did have the power to label domestic non-groups as terrorist organisations then stating “Antifa is a terrorist organisation” would just be a statement of fact. But if it were done provocatively, in a manner intended to rile up other users, or in an attempt to insult them, then that would be a breach of the rules. Likewise if say the Iranian government declared the Republican Party (or American conservatism or whatever) to be a terrorist organisation - it would then technically be true that the GOP is a recognised terrorist group but it wouldn’t be OK for users to use that to belittle or provoke other users.
I hope we can keep having open and frank discussions about this as this is certainly an evolving area where moderation will benefit from a wide range of viewpoints.
When I locked the thread, the attacks on Antifa were a long way down my list of priorities. The overriding reasons were 1) personal attacks, 2) a single post which said that all Conservatives were Nazis, a distant 3) the provocative framing of the OP. Perhaps I shouldn’t have mentioned Antifa at all.
Agree that “Antifa” as an organisation is stretching the definition of organisation. But other political beliefs such as liberalism and conservatism are also not organisations. We don’t accept “liberalism is a mental disorder”. I don’t think we should accept “conservatism is a terrorist organisation”.
Speaking hypothetically, if a couple of users started publicly identifying as Antifa members or followers then I don’t see why we wouldn’t give them the same protection we would give other non-bigoted ideologies.
Obviously if the President really did have the power to label domestic non-groups as terrorist organisations then stating “Antifa is a terrorist organisation” would just be a statement of fact. But if it were done provocatively, in a manner intended to rile up other users, or in an attempt to insult them, then that would be a breach of the rules. Likewise if say the Iranian government declared the Republican Party (or American conservatism or whatever) to be a terrorist organisation - it would then technically be true that the GOP is a recognised terrorist group but it wouldn’t be OK for users to use that to belittle or provoke other users.
I hope we can keep having open and frank discussions about this as this is certainly an evolving area where moderation will benefit from a wide range of viewpoints.
Presidents control who’s labeled a terrorist organization via executive order. Obama added servers right leaning groups to the terrorist list.
So when trump does it do you really want self identifying antifa here a. Cause then wp would be shut dow n by the federal government for harboring terrorist. Same if we had isis members here. You might not be American but wp is an American hosted website and such falls under American law. So you might want to consider the legal ramifications of having members of a group classified as terrorist in the USA on a USA website thst can be shut down by the fbi.
The USA shuts down sites with active isis or other terrorist groups, I’d hate to see wp shut down cause a few mods want to make a political grand standings.
I doubt you’d allow isis, neo nazi, kkk identifying members on here.
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