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The disturbing trend of anti-intellectualism

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Fnord
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21 Sep 2011, 10:59 pm

I posted an article on this subject in my WP blog back in 2008. I will repost it here...

Quote:
Democracy Destroys Education
by: Fnord
Posted on: 11-04-2008 @ 09:05 pm

What I want to fix your attention on is the vast overall movement towards the discrediting, and finally the elimination, of every kind of human excellence -- moral, cultural, social or intellectual. And is it not pretty to notice how 'democracy' (in the incantatory sense) is now doing for us the work that was once done by the most ancient dictatorships, and by the same methods?

The basic proposal of the new education is to be that dunces and idlers must not be made to feel inferior to intelligent and industrious pupils. That would be 'undemocratic.' Children who are fit to proceed may be artificially kept back, because the others would get a trauma by being left behind. The bright pupil thus remains democratically fettered to his own age group throughout his school career, and a boy who would be capable of tackling Aeschylus or Dante sits listening to his coeval's attempts to spell out A CAT SAT ON A MAT.

We may reasonably hope for the virtual abolition of education when 'I'm as good as you' has fully had its way. All incentives to learn and all penalties for not learning will vanish. The few who might want to learn will be prevented; who are they to overtop their fellows? And anyway, the teachers -- or should I say nurses? -- will be far too busy reassuring the dunces and patting them on the back to waste any time on real teaching.

We shall no longer have to plan and toil to spread imperturbable conceit and incurable ignorance among men, as it will have been so trained and drilled into us that it shall have become our own pitiful nature.



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22 Sep 2011, 12:06 am

I'm definitely not as smart as many of the people on here but I love to learn. I remember that even when I was in grade school there were times when teachers would ask me why I was reading a book if it wasn't related to our work, like it was odd. That used to bother me. As I grew older they didn't even try to deny that they really didn't care whether we learned anything as long as we committed facts to memory for tests to help them get funding.

It's also pretty sad these days when you hear young people say things like "I don't need to know anything, I'll just look it up on my phone". Hmm, so if that's down, they don't know anything.

I've always noticed the persistent attitude of pushing all students into college even when they had no idea what they wanted to do with their lives, which always struck me as ridiculous, even when I was in school.



iamnotaparakeet
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22 Sep 2011, 11:49 am

Fnord wrote:
I posted an article on this subject in my WP blog back in 2008. I will repost it here...

Quote:
Democracy Destroys Education
by: Fnord
Posted on: 11-04-2008 @ 09:05 pm

What I want to fix your attention on is the vast overall movement towards the discrediting, and finally the elimination, of every kind of human excellence -- moral, cultural, social or intellectual. And is it not pretty to notice how 'democracy' (in the incantatory sense) is now doing for us the work that was once done by the most ancient dictatorships, and by the same methods?

The basic proposal of the new education is to be that dunces and idlers must not be made to feel inferior to intelligent and industrious pupils. That would be 'undemocratic.' Children who are fit to proceed may be artificially kept back, because the others would get a trauma by being left behind. The bright pupil thus remains democratically fettered to his own age group throughout his school career, and a boy who would be capable of tackling Aeschylus or Dante sits listening to his coeval's attempts to spell out A CAT SAT ON A MAT.

We may reasonably hope for the virtual abolition of education when 'I'm as good as you' has fully had its way. All incentives to learn and all penalties for not learning will vanish. The few who might want to learn will be prevented; who are they to overtop their fellows? And anyway, the teachers -- or should I say nurses? -- will be far too busy reassuring the dunces and patting them on the back to waste any time on real teaching.

We shall no longer have to plan and toil to spread imperturbable conceit and incurable ignorance among men, as it will have been so trained and drilled into us that it shall have become our own pitiful nature.


It sounds as though you've studied classical rhetoric, and I do not mean that as a pejorative statement whatsoever.



LostUndergrad9090
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22 Sep 2011, 11:57 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
shrox wrote:
What if one had simply chosen not to toss their pearls before the world?


Then the world would have less pearls but still the same number of swine.


Thats true too, people need to keep forging the world in a certain direction in whatever it is that needs to be accomplished to be accomplished. so wtf? For that reason people should continue to go to school instead of self studying until self studying becomes acceptable. If self studying isn't as affective as going to school then there is not forging and no continuation of what is needed.



iamnotaparakeet
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22 Sep 2011, 1:03 pm

LostUndergrad9090 wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
shrox wrote:
What if one had simply chosen not to toss their pearls before the world?


Then the world would have less pearls but still the same number of swine.


Thats true too, people need to keep forging the world in a certain direction in whatever it is that needs to be accomplished to be accomplished. so wtf? For that reason people should continue to go to school instead of self studying until self studying becomes acceptable. If self studying isn't as affective as going to school then there is not forging and no continuation of what is needed.


College accomplishes the accumulation of debt for certain but only the mere possibility of a career afterward. It is not forging ahead, it is falling behind. If it were not an expense of tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars but instead only hundreds to a few thousand dollars it might be worth it. However, it is not, so it is not worth it. My goal is to acquire knowledge, not debt. Autodidacticism allows for the acquirement of knowledge without the necessity of massive debt based financing, so autodidacticism is more preferable to my goal of learning than institutionalized debt accumulation ever will be unless there are extensive reforms within their system. Without competition to encourage reformation, there will be no reformation. Autodidacticism is at competition with colleges and hopefully it may act as an encouragement to reform the corrupt system if enough people become autodidacts rather than college wage slaves who can't find work in their preferred field or anywhere else without lying because they are then overqualified for every other job available.



LostUndergrad9090
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22 Sep 2011, 2:06 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
LostUndergrad9090 wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
shrox wrote:
What if one had simply chosen not to toss their pearls before the world?


Then the world would have less pearls but still the same number of swine.


Thats true too, people need to keep forging the world in a certain direction in whatever it is that needs to be accomplished to be accomplished. so wtf? For that reason people should continue to go to school instead of self studying until self studying becomes acceptable. If self studying isn't as affective as going to school then there is not forging and no continuation of what is needed.


College accomplishes the accumulation of debt for certain but only the mere possibility of a career afterward. It is not forging ahead, it is falling behind. If it were not an expense of tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars but instead only hundreds to a few thousand dollars it might be worth it. However, it is not, so it is not worth it. My goal is to acquire knowledge, not debt. Autodidacticism allows for the acquirement of knowledge without the necessity of massive debt based financing, so autodidacticism is more preferable to my goal of learning than institutionalized debt accumulation ever will be unless there are extensive reforms within their system. Without competition to encourage reformation, there will be no reformation. Autodidacticism is at competition with colleges and hopefully it may act as an encouragement to reform the corrupt system if enough people become autodidacts rather than college wage slaves who can't find work in their preferred field or anywhere else without lying because they are then overqualified for every other job available.


Yes it is not forging ahead if in the hands of the wrong person or people.



iamnotaparakeet
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22 Sep 2011, 2:38 pm

LostUndergrad9090 wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
LostUndergrad9090 wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
shrox wrote:
What if one had simply chosen not to toss their pearls before the world?


Then the world would have less pearls but still the same number of swine.


Thats true too, people need to keep forging the world in a certain direction in whatever it is that needs to be accomplished to be accomplished. so wtf? For that reason people should continue to go to school instead of self studying until self studying becomes acceptable. If self studying isn't as affective as going to school then there is not forging and no continuation of what is needed.


College accomplishes the accumulation of debt for certain but only the mere possibility of a career afterward. It is not forging ahead, it is falling behind. If it were not an expense of tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars but instead only hundreds to a few thousand dollars it might be worth it. However, it is not, so it is not worth it. My goal is to acquire knowledge, not debt. Autodidacticism allows for the acquirement of knowledge without the necessity of massive debt based financing, so autodidacticism is more preferable to my goal of learning than institutionalized debt accumulation ever will be unless there are extensive reforms within their system. Without competition to encourage reformation, there will be no reformation. Autodidacticism is at competition with colleges and hopefully it may act as an encouragement to reform the corrupt system if enough people become autodidacts rather than college wage slaves who can't find work in their preferred field or anywhere else without lying because they are then overqualified for every other job available.


Yes it is not forging ahead if in the hands of the wrong person or people.


Such as office bureaucrats whose only real interest is the amount of money their business takes in.



iamnotaparakeet
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23 Sep 2011, 8:46 pm

http://failbook.failblog.org/2011/09/22 ... he-future/



Fnord
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23 Sep 2011, 10:06 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Fnord wrote:
I posted an article on this subject in my WP blog back in 2008...
It sounds as though you've studied classical rhetoric, and I do not mean that as a pejorative statement whatsoever.

Some, but I have to be in a higher mental state to express myself properly in that mode - usually 10-15 minutes after a double espresso.



leviathans
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25 Sep 2011, 12:08 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
LostUndergrad9090 wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
shrox wrote:
What if one had simply chosen not to toss their pearls before the world?


Then the world would have less pearls but still the same number of swine.


Thats true too, people need to keep forging the world in a certain direction in whatever it is that needs to be accomplished to be accomplished. so wtf? For that reason people should continue to go to school instead of self studying until self studying becomes acceptable. If self studying isn't as affective as going to school then there is not forging and no continuation of what is needed.


College accomplishes the accumulation of debt for certain but only the mere possibility of a career afterward. It is not forging ahead, it is falling behind. If it were not an expense of tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars but instead only hundreds to a few thousand dollars it might be worth it. However, it is not, so it is not worth it. My goal is to acquire knowledge, not debt. Autodidacticism allows for the acquirement of knowledge without the necessity of massive debt based financing, so autodidacticism is more preferable to my goal of learning than institutionalized debt accumulation ever will be unless there are extensive reforms within their system. Without competition to encourage reformation, there will be no reformation. Autodidacticism is at competition with colleges and hopefully it may act as an encouragement to reform the corrupt system if enough people become autodidacts rather than college wage slaves who can't find work in their preferred field or anywhere else without lying because they are then overqualified for every other job available.


You know, not everybody lives in USA. Where I live going to university is only 3k/year. (For international students it's like 20-25k /year) and my university is in the top 20 universities in the world. Just saying.
There is a lot of good places too where education is free or very cheap. For example ETH Zurich would cost less than 3k/year for resident AND international students and it's the university where Einstein did go to.



LostUndergrad9090
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25 Sep 2011, 12:51 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
http://failbook.failblog.org/2011/09/22/funny-facebook-fails-weep-for-the-future/


How is it a fail? My idea is just as great as the next it just not expressed as pretty.

For now I take this back. I'm sure my or your idea has already been thought through and laughed at and something else I can't remember at the moment. and the below guy is right possibly but from the an own idea of mine I'm sure he is. its the thought of what is created now has already been planned to be created. Man created government, Man created the sciences, I'm sure he can create the now and the then. This is all of what little understanding I have of both. For someone like me to point out the loss of teacher jobs if self learning was a secondary way to gain certifiable knowledge and a white collar job then I'm sure any man with a higher intellect could.



Last edited by LostUndergrad9090 on 25 Sep 2011, 10:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Shebakoby
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25 Sep 2011, 1:45 am

I don't see so much anti-intellectualism as I see pseudo-intellectualism. That's where people think they're smart and think they have good ideas that look great on paper, but these ideas fail IRL. And especially if they've been proven multiple times to fail IRL, they insist they're right. EL OH EL.



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27 Sep 2011, 2:51 am

Universities and colleges are turning into factories. It is just like high school all over again. Some of the things I found were unpleasant about high school are drifting over into college.

You have young with with no ambitions and no motivation for learning and hard work. They bring their nasty, pre-college habits with them. People sigh at assignments. They hate reading. They hate writing. They just want to go out and party while I relish the challenge and ability to express myself and apply my critical thinking skills.

They will go to college for the degree, and that's why they all start to fail when they graduate. College used to be about learning and becoming a better person. The students now just don't want to seem to expand their mind. Then I come along, and the professors latch onto me as I am the sole type of student that wants to have an engaging discussion. They tell me it's depressing, because this is not what they signed up for when becoming a professor 20+ years ago.

People will simply forget everything they learned in college because "it was boring". They didn't realize the value of what they were given. So they are right back where they started before going to college. Knowing nothing. Retaining nothing. Why bother going? Yet they still went.

People will see some homeless person on the street, learn he graduated from college a year ago, and say to themselves, That guy has a degree?

It makes college look ret*d, and it devalues the college degree. People who make the best out of their degree and retain what they learn actually do very well once they graduate.



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27 Sep 2011, 8:42 am

I wish the lecturers here still had that kind of passion for teaching. A lot of them have become jaded, and just keep reading from the lecture notes now. When asked questions about the topic one of the things I'll always here is "for the exams what you'll need to know is ABCDXYZ". But I don't care about the exams, I'm in school to learn.

And I only know of one other student like me in the entire university. Pity he's not in the same major as me.


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