Some Mothers Chosen By God

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Another thing I feel I should point out is that I just found out that I have Asperger's a few weeks ago and I am still coming to terms with the realization that I am not just a little weird or eccentric or a nerd, but that my entire way of thinking is fundamentally different than everybody elses. I simply can't see past cold, mathematical logic and I don't know that I ever can. Even my emotions, under my worldview, are governed by chemical reactions that can be broken into math. Everything to me is math. It's like the programming language that the universe operates on. This is why, I think, I have so much trouble understanding the belief systems of spiritual people and thus why I persist in asking questions.

This helps me understand you a great deal. I understand you better already.

FYI, if you're making assumptions and stopping with them, you're doing logic wrong. Logic at least tries to be universal. But logic is a process, not a belief. You do have to start with testable information. You can then use logic to test it and derive conclusions, which usually disprove assumptions. For example, one of the most powerful logical tools is reductio ad absurdum, and it works like this: We start with an assumption, and if we can derive from it a conclusion that is logically impossible or absurd, then the assumption (or our process) must be flawed.

But this is all pretty abstract. You're probably not teaching your son formal logic, but something more practical that we might call common sense, which is really not universal.

Well, it honestly sounds like a cop-out to me. I asked a pretty simple question. And my experience with religion is probably not very different, except that I finally decided that everything I had believed didn't really make sense. But I don't recall a time when it ever encouraged me to learn anything except for the dogma. In fact, it was my curiosity and desire to learn about reality that initially put me in conflict with my faith.

Granted, they might be seeking a philosophical truth, but there's not really much seeking involved. They'll just tell you what they think that is, and you're just supposed to accept it blindly.

I think it depends on the particular preacher, and the level at which the education is occuring. For the very young, it's a simple set of rules. When you seek more, you are given more. The theory of conscious, and so on. But that will depend on who you seek that "more" from, since not all leaders and teachers have sought at that level themselves. Many like it black and white and choose to keep it that way. Which is the right way for some, but it wasn't for me, and it wasn't for you. My church, the catholic church, is an enormous umbrella, and I can find an entirely experience in the pew next to me, much less in the broader world. I needed faith to be flexible, philosophical, and asbract; so my searches brought me that. A lot of retreats, a good friend who became a priest, another who would have been a priest but married instead .... some I know with black and white views, but far more with a broader social justice perspective, who gave me a different background. Faith is supposed to speak to you in the way that you need it to and are ready for, but it comes at the hands of individuals and humans, and not all will point in the right direction at the right time.

But, yes, I really do believe that the church seeks knowledge and truth at this moment in time. I don't agree with everything they teach and everything do, but I do see a process that more often than not seems to be seeking rather than protecting. I was taught to seek, to never stop asking. Or maybe it's all I was able hear

Edited to add:

I realize that I probably STILL haven't answered the way you would like me to, and all I can say with respect to that is that I am probably not able to. I am not a collector of information and facts. I pull them together when I need to reach a conclusion, but once the conclusion has been reached, I remember only the conclusion, and not what supported it. I have a fairly poor memory and it's the adaptation my life found years ago. I'm really good at diseminating information and drawing accurate conclusions, however. While in the process, I can explain it beautifully. It's just that I don't keep it. Since you need the facts and support, and that is what you respect (or so it seems to me), I can probably never give you what you seek. Maybe someday you'll get to see my thought process while it's in the moment, and then you can understand it and maybe even respect it, but for now, I suspect we're just going to be at an impasse. I'm OK with that if you can be

Last edited by DW_a_mom on 14 Dec 2008, 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sometimes, drowbot, you are attacked on this forum because you invite it. You must not be aware of the emotions your words can evoke in others, but they are there nonetheless. Instead of crying and whinging about being attacked, try not to attack others. I realize this won't be easy for you, but it's definitely worth the effort.

It's not what you say it how you say it.

I tend to see parallels and similarities rather than conflicts. Probably comes from having a multilingual background and having seen people give different explanations of the same event according to their knowledge and culture. A Piano to you and I is "bikpela bokis i singaut tapos yu paitim long han" to my friend in Niugini (A big box that makes a noise when you hit it with your hand).

Just an example ... Book of Genesis ... Creation Story.

Original Hebrew word for "day" is apparently the same word used for "period of time", much like when we say "in this day" it doesn't mean just exactly one calendar day. Hence, each day in Genesis could be an indeterminate period of time.

The order of the creation Plants, Animals, Man agrees with evolution theory.

And God said let the water bring forth living creatures ... do not evolutionists also say that life originated in the oceans?

And God made man of the dust of the earth ... are we not made of the same atoms and molecules?

etc, etc

Perhaps Moses and Darwin were simply telling us about the same events in different languages.

Could evolution be the tool that God used to bring about the creation? I haven't read anywhere in the bible that the events of the creation happened instantaneuosly.

The parallels are myriad if you translate what the ancients wrote, with their limited knowledge of science, into modern language.

Agreed, there are also contradictions, but might these not vanish as our understanding increases?

Also agreed that there are religios dogmatics who will not accept, for example, that the word "day" in the bible might mean something more, even though it has been translated from another language.

PS: I am happy for my opinions to be challenged.

PPS: This should probably be in a different thread.

A man once sat his final theology exam and just wrote on the paper: "God knows all the answers, Merry Christmas". When his marked paper was returned to him later, the examiner had written "God gets 100%, you get 0, Happy New Year."

Again, this is coming from the person who resorted to ignorant, childish name-calling. Your words are empty.

Yeah, that's what I thought.

My words are empty.

Could you perhaps point out, specifically, where I attacked somebody and thus invited attack? If you could do that instead of just making another bold assertion, seemingly pulled from your imagination, your words might be worth consideration.

Never mind. This is not worth the effort it would require.

That's what I thought...

Ha ha, very funny. Now get back to work!

Contrary to what I think I should feel, I am always disappointed when my private assumptions about a stranger are proven correct. :/

No matter what, I think it's safe to say that we have a lot of intelligent people on this forum. Wow.
DW - have you taken a lot of philosophy classes?

Unfortunately, no. Always found it interesting, though.