Sadly, meds are needed-Please share med experiences

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The worst thing for me about medicating my son is that we agonised about doing it, and finally decided to give meds a go, as a last resort. None of them worked. So our last resort treatment plan was no plan at all. He has trialled the ADHD meds (ritalin and dexamphetamine), several anti depressants and risperdal for at least the length of time that they were supposed to become effective by. The ADHD meds played havoc with his emotions - at 7, he became so depressed on those meds that he couldn't function. Tried them again at age 18 and had pretty much the same effect on him as they did initially.
Risperdal just had no effect at all. The anti depressants made him feel flat and did nothing to relieve his depression. Sedatives trialled as a young child and again as an adult turned him into an angry violent drunk.

It was heartbreaking for us that meds didn't work, because it was as if the safety net was just taken from us.

I hope the meds work for your child and your family. Don't invest too much in thinking of them as a panacea. They don't always work.

Has she explicitly said in so many words that she is angry, or is that based on the violence and perhaps facial expressions?

If the latter, it may just be frustration. For example, I apparentlly have an expression that looks like extreme anger if I'm frustrated or even just thinking very hard, rather than angry. If this is the case, it may be best just to leave her alone, and as others have said, make sure she has a quiet, safe place to be where she will not be disturbed.

If the former, and if she is angry at you, she may be willing to tell you why if she can write it instead of say it and if you coax her enough. A chat client can work well if you both type. I know it sounds silly, but for whatever reason it can be much easier for us aspies to communicate by typing or writing than by talking.

Thanks. It's clear that you've made a lot of effort in this area and it looks like you've eliminated most if not all potentially bad elements in her food. That's good.

There are, however, a couple of good elements missing from this diet that she may need.

The first is omega 3 fatty acids, specifically DHA, and possibly omega 6 fatty acids as well. These essential fatty acids are critical to brain function and need to be in the proper proportions. The only foods that contain both of these fatty acids in the correct proportion are certain animal fats.

Specifically, the best sources are animals that eat their natural diet. Wild caught fatty fish, like wild Alaskan salmon, are the best - make sure it's eaten with the skin left on so the fats are included. Next best is grass finished beef, again with the fat - or pastured pork, though that's very hard to find. Pastured - not just free range - eggs are also good. You want pastured eggs because pastured chickens get a good balance of fats in their diet from worms and insects, which are chickens' preferred foods when they can get them. Free range eggs are not enough because free range chickens are still fed a grain based diet that results in excessive omega 6s and a deficiency in omega 3s in their fat - including the fat in the yolks of their eggs.

Failing those sources, a fish oil supplement may be useful,

And I know that all the medical sources say animal fats cause people to drop dead of heart attacks, so your doctors will probably tell you they are bad. However, even if that is all true - and there's some evidence it may not be, especially for women - your daughter is young and not at risk of a heart attack for a couple of decades at least.

The other nutrient that may be missing is vitamin D, because the normal way to get vitamin D is from sunlight rather than from diet. You may want to consider a vitamin D3 supplement of 1000 IU per day unless she spends several hours a day in the sun. There is a blood test that will tell you whether she is getting enough vitamin D.

Thanks psychohist. I just read a Harvard study about Omega 3's hlping with mood instability. I am seriously considering trying this. I have just on problem: She won't take a large pill and she will refuse anything that tastes/smells funny. It took forever for me to find a sublingual melatonin that she would take. Is it possible to get the large doses of Omega 3's in just food intake? I will have to research this more.

Also, she does drink about 1 cup of milk a day-that's probably not enough. I will look into some other sources of Vit D and see if the docs will check her vitamin levels.

Also, I say she is "angry" because she speaks in a sort of growl and sneers/glares at me. She doesn't say she's angry. But she definitely acts irritable-has trouble being coaxed into fun activities or even enjoying things she usually likes.

Thanks for your comments! I am going to look more into the Omega 3.

Hi,
My son J is on meds, Lovan 10mg once a day for anxiety and depression and Strattera 60mg once a day for adhd and ocd. J is on the Strattera as opposed to traditional adhd meds because he also has tourettes, traditional adhd meds I've been told can make tics worse and can increase some of J's other problems.

None of the meds have taken all of J's issues away, they were never meant to. The meds have simply taken the edge off so that we can now try and help him work threw each issue as it arises.

J is 12 now he started when he was 10. He took them for about 10 months, things improved so I weaned him off, with the hopes of keeping him off. He had about 6 months with no meds, I had to slowly wean him back on. I was extremely anti meds, my family were very un supportive, so I didn't tell them. Then one day after J had been on meds for a while my sister commented on how wonderful it was to see J actually smile and engage. So I told her he is on meds now.It was good actually to get that feed back from my sister because I wasn't sure if it was just wishful thinking on my part that the meds were working.

I've never had the issue with weight gain whilst J was on meds, infact when we first introduced the Lovan, J's appetite decreased. The second time round his weight has been unaffected.

I used to hear all the time "I don't feel right" "somethings not right" but he could never explain it and it would really bother him and make him anxious and frustrated. J still says this sometimes but now he can work threw it much better. I learnt very quickly the more I tried to "fix" these feelings for him the more pressure it put on him and the worse it all became. So now I just listen or I tell him "Is there any thing I can do to help you feel better?". Sometimes he will say he doesn't know, sometimes he will ask me to just sit with him. I also learnt when I sit with him to try really hard not to look concerned because then he shuts down and or worries more that now he has made me sad or angry.

I think that what ever it is going on, the mere thought of what those emotions feel like and not knowing or understanding what those emotions are or where their coming from scare the crap out of our kids. If we appear to scared, concerned or frustrated by whats happening this just makes it 10x worse. We are our kids safety net and for years we have appeared to be able to "fix" their problems and make them better and when we can't fix them or explain them this scares them even more and often makes them angry with us for not being able to take the bad feelings all away. Is this making sense? Sorry if it doesn't or if I'm waffling.

You sound like a fantastic mum, and never ever feel like you are coping out by trying to help your child with medication, sometimes we have no choice and doing nothing is much much worse.

Good luck. aurea xoxox

How about just pulling her out of everything she does (School, social stuff, extra currics, being with siblings) and reintroducing it one by one to see what overwhelms her? Not sure if that would cause routine problems

I had no luck with citalopram or prozac-other people say they have helped but in much smaller doses than for NTs

Hi Mama to Grace-

I don't have much advice as my son is younger and we haven't encountered a lot of the things that you have so far. I just wanted to offer my support, as I know the struggles you have faced. I trust completely that you are trying to do the best for your daughter.

One thing that came to mind was: How is her sleep? Is she getting enough sleep? I know that when I do not get enough sleep, I am not a very happy camper. I know that she had some problems before not wanting to sleep in her own room alone. Just a thought?

Also, I found an Omega 3 vitamin by Disney in the regular grocery store. It does not have any artificial flavors in it. My son will not eat anything that tastes or smells fishy either and he likes this one. Just thought I would tell you about it.

Good luck and I hope things improve very soon!

I like this advice!

Hi Mama -

There was one thing a psychologist said to me when I was in the place you are now: kids are developing their neural pathways (basically creating habits but at a brain level rather than a behavioral level). What he said this means is that if our kids are reacting in a really unhealthy way, the more it happens, the deeper ingrained that reaction becomes and the more difficult it will be for them to change. While I felt that if we just held on he would grow out of it, the opposite was actually true. He would be less likely to grow out of it.

He explained how if a child needs medical support, you provide it and then work on the behavioral tools, and then slowly take away the medication. We will see about that.

Something that we have experienced....DS needs about 25% of a typical dose, sometimes less. He often will have the really rare side effects and always gets the common ones. He has paradoxical reactions to anti anxiety meds and stimulants make him crazy. Meds are not a walk in the park, but they are appropriate sometimes. Your daughter deserves a chance, right? If they don't work - stop.

We are in the place of taking DS out of everything. He's home, with a Dr. Note and the school district is fighting me. They don't think the Dr. Is correct. My son is much happier - I don't know what the right answer is, I do believe he needs an education and I don't feel capable of providing it - but we will see I guess.

A large part of this is probably hormonal. Different SSRI's have different effects in different people, and can have different affects in the same people at different times. There is generally a 3 week period in which transient side effects occur...for some reason side effects seem happen faster than intended effects. Side effects are usually weight gain, as other posters noted. I commend your doctor for referring you to a pediatric psychiatrist, as children should be monitored closely on these medications.

Hi Mama

Reading your OP was kind of like deja-vu, I could almost have written it myself. My DD has just started on SSRI's (fluoxetine) after her paed and I had a long discussion on friday. I had been, not anti med, but reluctant to medicate since her dx last year. However her meltdowns were becoming more frequent, and her behaviour more aggressive and violent at times, due in part I think to the fact she is nearing puberty. I hope you find the right med for your daughter, I'm keeping my fingers crossed that my DD's worls for her.

There should be plenty on the web about it, although you will have to sort through different sources. I think most fish oil capsules, which are the normal way of supplementing, are gel caps, but I don't know how they taste.

You can get definitely enough omega 3s from whole foods. When our family first identified this issue, we started by getting omega 3 eggs, which are from chickens fed a special diet. However, not all omega 3 eggs have significant amounts, since there are no labeling standards. You need to get ones that have at least 100 mg of omega 3s per egg. They will cost about twice as much as normal eggs, which still isn't all that much. If you have a nearby Whole Foods supermarket you can get them there; other supermarkets may or may not have them.

The main issue for most people is that omega 6s compete with omega 3s metabolically, so if you have too much omega 6 - such as a lot of vegetable oil in the diet - that will suppress the effects of the omega 3s. From your description of your daughter's diet, though, it doesn't sound like she gets much in the way of fat of any description, so that shouldn't be an issue for her.


The amount of vitamin D in milk is not really sufficient. Someone staying out in the sun all day gets about 10,000 IU from sunlight; the RDA is only 400 IU. Supplementing in the range of 1000-5000 IU per day would be better. Vitamin D capsules are fairly small gel caps and are pretty easy to swallow.

One more thing.... When we started this, we tried Krill oil for the Omega 3s (they are small and not gross - expensive though) and vitimin D - they are small too. Didn't have much luck - but we were able to get him to take them.

Hi Mama Grace - I'm a newbie here and by no means an expert. Some ideas came to mind that might be interesting to try, on one of the other discussions someone mentioned having trouble with creating a "poker face", someone suggested an acting coach to help hide how emotional they were, this is something I am thinking about for my son. He is 17 and is having more trouble subduing his annoyance by others in school thus leaving him wide open to riddicule. I also have another child on the spectrum, more severely autistic, when puberty hit, violence toward me heightened, my son stayed at home more to protect me, he lost more tolerance toward other people that way and I can see more anxiety toward social situations setting in. As one of the other posters mentioned above, this behavior may become ingrained. I fear this, I, myself have traits of Autism Spectrum Disorder, and find I have to force myself to "join" in social situations, but this idea, acting coach, really grabbed my attention.

Hi, The other idea I was thinking about was rewards for when all things are calm, when my daughter was first introduced to getting her nails done, she loved it, it was noted! Now, when she has good behavior, we mark it on the calendar for the next pay day, sometimes that could be 3 days away or 12, she really enjoys it though, so she really tries to keep her anger in check. She is self-abusive which she knows we don't like, but she is not violent toward anyone else and we tell her to continue working on not being violent toward herself or no nail treatment. We are also thinking about massage therapy for both. This could eventually be something we could do together as a gift for working hard on collaborating on a plan together to feel better everyday. This, of course, would be the "ultimate" gift and tracking good behavior for at least 3-6 months would make it become acceptable, because, let's face it, nothing so enjoyable is free! I would never do this for myself, then one day a girlfriend noticed I was always downing myself for not being a better Mom and she showed me, no one is ever going to be perfect and every once in a while, we need to reward ourselves for even the smallest effort taken to improve the situation. Hope this helps!