Not sure if ds (13) even fits in here

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Ds doesn't have a hard time falling asleep at night but he does tend to get up early most mornings. No matter what time he goes to bed he gets up early. When I ask him why he's acting so grumpy, he will say he is just tired. As he's gotten older, we've been less strict with him about bed times. I'm not even sure how much sleep a 13 yo requires. We are certainly going to work on getting him to bed earlier to see if that helps the grumpiness.




I am so grateful that his grades are important to him but hate to see him stressed over it. He was never one to study & after he got the B, we talked about studying and he said he didn't know how.




I have asked my ds why he seems to have an 'enemy' wherever he goes and he explained that when he isn't sure if they are friend or foe, he decides to make them his foe so he doesn't have to worry. That made sense to me in explaining some of his behaviors. We've been working on it.


Also, it may help him if he can share his thoughts with you AFTER social events. Talking about the conversations later might help him stop feeling as if he must share them during the social event.


It might help to give him a timeline for social situations. Telling him when you will leave( and a time he can look forward to) will help him endure it. Without it, social events seem to drag on forever and it is difficult to pretend you want to be there.



He doesn't have any all encompassing special interests. He's interested in watching sports (especially football) and loves the competition aspect of it all. He doesn't talk about it unless he and dh are watching it or unless he's discussing it with classmates.

I've been thinking of taking him to a psychologist to work on his social skills but I'm also worried that he will think that I think he is defective. We've taken him to different dr's over the years for evaluations & one dr mentioned that our son was stressed over the fact that we thought there was something wrong with him. Part of me wonders if I have been putting unrealistic expectations on him based on some unreachable ideal that I have in my head. I also wonder if I'm just searching too hard for answers and not looking at him as an individual. My husband tells me I overthink everything.

Thank you. I've been trying to understand my child and I feel that I'm reaching for straws. If a dr hasn't been able to say "oh, yes, he's definitely AS", I can't help but wonder if there is something else or if I'm blowing things waaay out of proportion because of my own social anxiety issues.

Do you think taking him to therapy to work on the social issues would help? or does he need to be in a social skills group to be effective? I've looked at cognitivie behavioral therapy and am wondering if that is something that might be beneficial.

My son does this - and let me tell you, while it seems like this is a bad idea, it's far, far better than the alternative which we're dealing with now. DS was scarier before, and so kids left him alone. Now he's coming home with stories of being pushed, cuts from "falling down" and other tales which lead me to believe he's being bullied.

He is in Middle School and I do believe the school is watching carefully, and I haven't intervened since DS doesn't seem upset and seems to think it's all part of "normal" boy interaction - which it could well be. I am keeping a careful eye on things, though, and keeping a tally of all the bumps and shoves and cuts to see if a pattern emerges.

I do talk to DS about watching for patterns - Temple Grandin discusses this in one of her talks; she found her work was being sabotaged but lacked the social skills to figure out who was doing it, so she went by evidence and it eventually led her to the culprit.

As far as therapy, CBT is a good one, but it requires the full cooperation of the person in it. We've had no success with it so far because DS just isn't there yet (I have had success with it myself, though.)

Social skills classes and pragmatic speech therapy are both usually conducted where there are real-world examples of interaction for kids to model - at lunch or recess, for instance. I think for this age group, if done well, they are more successful.

My ds wouldn't qualify. He was in speech therapy in elementary school for articulation. I asked for help with pragmatics and they worked on that, too, but he 'tested out' of it.

I will ask my ds if he wants help and if he does, then we will try the CBT. Woulc CBT be helpful for someone with social skill issues? Do you have any other suggestions?

Do you think your ds just doesnt' want to upset you about getting bullied? My ds was slapped across the face about a month ago and ds didn't tell me about it. I had to pull it out of him after he got in trouble for a separate incident.

Nope, or he wouldn't be telling me about it at all, and I'd see other signs of upset, frustration and unhappiness. I am certain that he, at least. does not believe he's being bullied.

Problem is, there is an awful lot of typical boy behavior that really rides the line between bullying and friendly - not like typical boys who are friends don't shove each other, etc. on occasion. As long as DS isn't being hurt or isn't being targeted, it is probably better for him to be tolerating it...but I am keeping an eye on that line.

My son is homeschooled, but in a million groups, programs, etc..he is in social skills group too. He has the WORST TIME falling asleep, we are thankful for Melatonin helping out....and no matter what time he falls asleep he is up early. He has been like this since a baby.

One of my first clues that he was different was his sleeping or lack of it. His need for heavy rocking and to be held in order to fall asleep and staying asleep was so hard for him as a baby. He stil lhas issues with sleep.

The spectrum varies widely, however IMO, i honestly don't see your son falling into the Autism Spectrum.
I would consult with a different doctor who could take all the background info that you have told us, into account.
No Stims
No tandrums
Lack of shyness
No problem at all with speaking in public
Good grades
Numerous accounts of violent behavior against others
He seems to get jealous of those he perceives do not fit his similar "moral pattern" (student with better grades in class & one in scouts) and then "demonizes them", making fun of them

I would definitely have him re-evaluated by another psychologist.
ADHD can have a seriously negative prognosis with ODD
The earlier they can treat these disorders, the better the outcome can be.

Perhaps your son just doesn't want to make friends, as he perceives the kids around him are not the type he wants to be friends with.
He does have his group of friends at lunch he can socialize with at school.
He probably is just fine socially as long as the friends are ones he picks out.

I would still get a second opinion from a different doctor though. Sometimes if not diagnosed accurately, issues can tend to get out of hand. Especially when one hits the teen years.

Chloe 33,

Good grades disqulaifies one from having Asutim? Some of the smartest people in the world are on the spectrum! My own son is years ahead of his peers in academics. Most of his freinds with HFA are as well.

My son is not shy, never ever was.
My son has no problems speakng in public, he has been in a few plays and on stage, he will sing act silly or preform a part, give a speech, etc...anything.

I didnt realize that you NEED stims to get an ASD diagnosis? When my son was diagnosed at the age of almost 6, he had one stim that was so short lived and easily redirected I hesitated to call it a stim at all.

Tantrums? In the eye of the beholder perhaps? I am sure as a youngster he has some? I know plenty on the spectrum who have had mild ones as young kids but as they got older adapted and figured out other ways to handle stress (perhapse making fun of people, etc...).

My nephew has Aspergers, that diagnosis confirmed over and over, he has ZERO tantrums, ZERO stims.

I wonder if it is "jealousy" of those who do better, or rather an inability to understand how to handle a situation where he isnt the best, in which he could have learned a coping skill of teasing. Where else to learn such a skill then good old school...lol.

I would caution anyone to make diagnostic statements based on a post in a forum. We aren't professionals, we don't have the whole picture, and we haven't met the people posting or seen their children.

I want to point out that I see some "gatekeeping" of autism spectrum disorders on this forum and a tendency to respond to parents' concerns as invalid - at this point, I'm not calling out anyone in this thread in particular, I want to point out I am seeing this as a trend in many threads besides this one. I think our job as a community should be to help direct parents towards resources, not to deflect them. It is important to note that all of our experiences are different, many of us have children who didn't present in the usual way, but a diagnosis of autism spectrum disorder was critically important for getting the support we needed - I am one of those parents.

Here's my take: if parents are struggling with their child, and find that child benefits most from the accommodations and supports that work for kids on the spectrum - as far as I'm concerned, that is the course of action they should take. We didn't really believe my son's diagnosis by the school (we assumed a mood disorder or maybe ODD,) but we slowly found that if we acted as though he was autistic, everybody's life improved considerably. Whether or not a child "deserves" the label doesn't matter - finding solutions does.

In general, autism spectrum disorders are diagnosed by either a pediatric neurologist or a developmental pediatrician - psychologists, social workers, schools and other therapists who don't specialize don't always offer the specific answers parents need. Doctors in these disciplines will often also be able to direct a parent to the appropriate therapies and resources. (I would note also - a diagnosis without a careful explanation means you didn't get a good diagnosis. Keep going to new doctors until you find someone who can explain the results of the diagnostic testing. A sheet of paper with numbers on it is not an explanation.)

As I've posted elsewhere, the CDC has an excellent page on autism where all the gold-standard testing instruments are listed; knowledge of these tests is a benchmark you can use to evaluate a doctor's knowledge of the autism spectrum.

.The specialist to see for social skills will be speech. Different specialists offer different programs so you will have to look into it to decide if it was something your son could be willing to do.

Speech skills are a moving target, so graduating from the service in elementary does not mean he won't qualify now. My son has graduated twice and tested back in twice. In middle school the testing focused on symbolism, if I recall; in high school they tested non-verbal cues and social interaction. In both cases, my son met the standards for services.

I don't know what the levels for entry are without an IEP for ASD to start with, however, so I don't know if looking at the school or going straight to private will be best.