Help me figure out what to say to this parent

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Tough situation. Sorry

There is a boy in my son's school who was nice to him in the beginning of the school year. My son really likes him. He is now loosely involved in the bullying that was happening with him a short while ago. My son said that he kind of stands on the fringes and isn't exactly mean to him, but he's not nice to him, either. But then when the lead bully is not around, he is nice and sometimes if my son has started to cry, he comes back and tells jokes to try to cheer him up. Honestly, for as angry as I feel toward this kid, part of me feels sorry for him.

Middle school sucks. I was the kid getting bullied, so I know it sucks from that perspective. But I bet it also sucks from the "middle kid's" perspective. By middle kid I mean the kids who don't come by meanness and ugliness naturally, but pick it up in order to avoid becoming a target. I'm not saying that is where N is coming from, because I can't know that and the use of obscenities directed toward a young girl makes me wonder...but the fact that your son still wants to hang out with him must mean he has some redeeming quality. Even when your social radar is not too sharp, I think you can still pick up on "all bad," ykwim? And it doesn't seem your son is picking up on that "all bad" vibe. I know for me, sometimes my son's ease in forgiveness seems to be a curse because it makes me think he will always be someone's kicking target, but on the other hand, sometimes I think his ease in forgiveness is beautiful and more evolved than most people can ever hope to become.

I don't think you can make your son not want to be friends with this kid. But I think you already know that. It's one of those "unjoys" of being a mother. I do think it is a blessing that his mom so willingly said that he can come to your house. Your house. Your rules. Your supervision. At least it will give you an opportunity to see if you can see the salvageable thing that your son sees. Maybe there is a great kid hiding in there somewhere after all and being friends with your son and spending time under your watch will help him. Who knows? But maybe it would help you feel better if you saw the possibility of something good coming out of this?

I am going to take a shot at this one, but keep in mind my judgement on social issues is not the best: It sounds like there is a part of her that absolutely believes what she has been told by you and the girl's mother about the incident. There is another part of her that has decided to offload the bulk of the blame onto your son. So she punished her son, because she did understand his role in it, but at the same time is also upset your son was not punished more than hers to reflect your son's "greater" culpability. If she thought the texts were harmless, it would not be such a big deal. In addition she might be upset he deleted them b/c now she cannot show his "innocent" texts to you, to show you what an angel her son is.

I think "Middle School sucks" pretty much says it all. What I noticed and discussed with my kids is that the boys are trying to figure out their social footing and status and the process is messy. They have the kids they either share interests with or like, but notice that other kids don't respond the same way, or that these friends aren't of the social rank they aspire to, and so they act one way when they feel their social status is at stake, and another way when they don't. My son was keenly aware of having no social status, and he didn't care about it, but he could see the play clearly once we talked about how that concern was underlying his "friends" reactions. With the friends I'd say things to acknowledge that I knew the social waters were difficult, but that one should stick up for the people they want to be friends with and not let others dictate that for them. But, for insecure kids, that is difficult, and so a quirky kid like mine is much more likely to have trouble with a close but low social status friend than a less-close but socially secure friend (the later being the one who would quickly stand up for him, if he happened to be around).

Thankfully things settled out quickly in High School and everyone is getting along. My son has a small group of anti-social friends who also seem to get along fine with the rest of the school, just have no interest in the rest of the school.

I do think it backfires when a parent tries to dictate who an older child (4/5th grade and up) can or should be friends with, so we have to find a way to deal with and control friendships that bother us without making our disapproval seem controlling to the child. I think the biggest danger coming into these the teen years is having a child who no longer feels he can be 100% honest with you because you'll over-react (in his eyes) or try to ruin his life (in his eyes). We want and need for our kids to come to us with their issues.

Anyway, MomSparky, it sounds like you are finding your way through it OK, even if it isn't exactly a smooth road. Your consolation might be that I don't think it is likely this friendship will continue into High School; the kids sort more by shared interests and personalities then, in my observation, so that may well give this it's natural end. Well, one can hope.

I actually agree with this.

Aspie children do not have the same skill set as NT children so need help making decisions and having some decisions made on their behalf. I know we can't wrap them entirely in cotton wool, but children are vulnerable just by nature of being children and an Aspie child much more so. If you know a child is a bad influence on your son then you are doing the right thing keeping that child away and any other such children, until he catches up on that same skill set at the age it happens for him. Probably your son is confused that N will play with him outside of school but treat him like an outcast at school, and this makes your son want the friendship more because it's given then withdrawn, like dangling a carrot and keeping him on a string. He needs self-respect which means learning which children are using him and mistreating him, sometimes that means mum has to tell him who is wrong for him and take action. You do mention other friends, so he's not without any friends that he needs to latch on to N out of desperation.

I cannot understand why the girl's mum told you what your son did but not N's mum about her son - his was the greater offence. Even after all this time has passed this should be put right. Does the girl's mum also know that your son was led and manipulated into this behaviour by N? That your son is vulnerable to this type of manipulation as an Aspie? That he didn't realise how wrong it was and what the impact of it would be? If she still has the texts she can show them to N's mum to set the record straight (or forward them to you to do so?)

I don't believe N has any excuse for his behaviour because a child is either like that or not, hearing or seeing bad stuff from other children doesn't make a child that doesn't have it in them in the first place commit the same behaviour.

Also, N's mum sounds pretty hands-off as a parent. She admits to you that she can't supervise two children inside her own house! Who can't do that! Then, she backs up this by merrily allowing her son over to your house for you to supervise after everything that has happened!

N's mum sounds at the very least, an insensitive person. She fails to understand your son's condition and defends her child no matter what.