I need help with school

Call an IEP meeting STAT ... Like NOW, and modify that to be "Individual".
Sorry, Waterfalls old girl, you absolutely MUST modify that to be 1:1. If it is group, then it is group. There is NO way for you to ensure that your daughter is being / will be included (as you have learned, to your peril), so it is best to amend her IEP to make RSP services "Individual".
Good luck !
_________________
O villain, villain, smiling, damnèd villain!
My tables—meet it is I set it down
That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain.
At least I'm sure it may be so in "Denmark".
-- Hamlet, 1.5.113-116
Thank you everyone! It was a relief to hear from other parents and not be so alone as the school left me feeling.
Going in as calm as I can manage and saying complimentary things, listening nicely and asking for a meeting about her IEP: I am going to really try to focus and remember all these things!
Going in as calm as I can manage and saying complimentary things, listening nicely and asking for a meeting about her IEP: I am going to really try to focus and remember all these things!
I am just curious - has she had an independent educational evaluation (IEE) so far ?
If she has not, I would send them a letter before the meeting, asking for an IEE, ahead of the meeting. If an assessment shows that she needs more intensive services than they are currently giving her, then you have more grounds to push for 1:1 RSP.
REMEMBER, you don't have to say any complimentary things at the meeting, although it does help to stay calm and collected. If possible, just listen and do not talk at the meeting. Do not sign the IEP as soon as it is over, even if they amend the existing document to make RSP services "individual". Just tell them you will return it the next day. Then, go back home, review the document carefully (especially any notes), and if you are in agreement with both services and notes, sign and return it.
You have rights. You are expected to be polite, but you don't have to grovel for services or pay them compliments. If she has never had an IEE, I strongly recommend asking for one. If they refuse, let them put that down in writing. I am doing this now with my daughter's school - the goal is to build a nice case first and log every disagreement you have with them on paper. It will all pay off (for you).
Good luck !
_________________
O villain, villain, smiling, damnèd villain!
My tables—meet it is I set it down
That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain.
At least I'm sure it may be so in "Denmark".
-- Hamlet, 1.5.113-116
^^^There are not enough gold stars in the world for this one. I wish I had done this sooner. Later, I got a little smarter and made them send me the thing in advance (including test scores for any assessments done) for me to review and refused to sign anything there at the meeting for one of the more ridiculous things they tried to pull. I should have made it standard operating procedure to wait until the next day to sign it, right away.
I was, like you, trying to preserve an amicable relationship. They clearly did not want to even pay to print out anything that was not going to be signed immediately. (They did not say it, but I inferred that was part of it) So, I thought I was making them more likely to like me. Later things got so bad I didn't care, and that made me smarter b/c I felt I had less to risk.
I can't really see right now from crying.
I'm not sure I think they were screwing with me. I think they had a big meeting with everyone but the CSE chair to push outside counseling which my child will never generalize to use at school. And then toward the end said they could have just said nothing but they saw her struggling and wanted to help with an implicit threat not to communicate with me anymore since I am difficult, resistant to their advice and suggested the CSE could look at doing more.
I am heartbroken.
And I can't believe the threat at the end of not telling me things
How do they do this to people? Can they just stop telling me there's a problem? Two of the teachers I think maybe were embarrassed? I did not understand at the time I think now the meeting was to bully me? I was supposed to go along not cry and say I feel she gets upset as a direct result of issues about her learning disability? I am so mixed up by this behavior and so sad right now.
They do not want to ask for anything more from CSE. They did not refuse I could have insisted but I feel there is no point, CSE will not do anything the teachers say is not needed. And that's their position. They say nothing is needed get her outside counseling. Her grades are reportedly good. They are just informing me she shuts down because they care and I can get her the help they think she needs or do nothing. It's up to me.
What do I do??
I'm not sure I think they were screwing with me. I think they had a big meeting with everyone but the CSE chair to push outside counseling which my child will never generalize to use at school. And then toward the end said they could have just said nothing but they saw her struggling and wanted to help with an implicit threat not to communicate with me anymore since I am difficult, resistant to their advice and suggested the CSE could look at doing more.
I am heartbroken.
And I can't believe the threat at the end of not telling me things
How do they do this to people? Can they just stop telling me there's a problem? Two of the teachers I think maybe were embarrassed? I did not understand at the time I think now the meeting was to bully me? I was supposed to go along not cry and say I feel she gets upset as a direct result of issues about her learning disability? I am so mixed up by this behavior and so sad right now.
They do not want to ask for anything more from CSE. They did not refuse I could have insisted but I feel there is no point, CSE will not do anything the teachers say is not needed. And that's their position. They say nothing is needed get her outside counseling. Her grades are reportedly good. They are just informing me she shuts down because they care and I can get her the help they think she needs or do nothing. It's up to me.
What do I do??
I am really confused.
You had a meeting with the mainstream staff ? Were any special education personnel - such as the RSP teacher, school psychologist or CSE programme supervisor - present ?
And, BTW, you DO NOT need the mainstream teacher to make a referral to special education. You can write to the special education department director (send certified with return receipt) asking for "an assessment in all suspected areas of suspected disability", and calling an IEP meeting to discuss the findings of the assessment.
I will post the letter I composed demanding an IEE for my daughter - use it after modifying it with your daughter's info / data.
BTW, I am assuming that you are in the US. If you are in Canada, then I don't think any of our feedback will apply to you as your laws may be very different than ours.
Hang in there - cry if you want, and let your emotions out, but get ready for the fight of your life. We're here.
First things first, though. Email a "minutes" of today's disastrous meeting to all the team members of today's meeting (cc CSE director). You are starting a paper trial of all that went down / will go down from this point forward.
This is going to be fun, old girl. Hang in there.
_________________
O villain, villain, smiling, damnèd villain!
My tables—meet it is I set it down
That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain.
At least I'm sure it may be so in "Denmark".
-- Hamlet, 1.5.113-116
I am in the US and the sped teacher did come but no other special Ed people. I think I am too tired to fight I can look for an advocate I am not up to being played with anymore. I trusted them to behave, not just care about her but follow the rules.
I have no energy anymore to do this. I know they will be upset if I being an advocate and angry and say they thought we had a good relationship and can anyone here tell me: how is it that these people ignore me and then they will be shocked and disappointed angry and hurt if I ask for help outside. That's not a lie, is it? I mean, I get that many times, they lie to me. But when they see me cry, as they say no, and then I ask for help and then they say how surprised they are......does it seem like that could be truthful? I feel very confused by all their manipulations.
I have no energy anymore to do this. I know they will be upset if I being an advocate and angry and say they thought we had a good relationship and can anyone here tell me: how is it that these people ignore me and then they will be shocked and disappointed angry and hurt if I ask for help outside. That's not a lie, is it? I mean, I get that many times, they lie to me. But when they see me cry, as they say no, and then I ask for help and then they say how surprised they are......does it seem like that could be truthful? I feel very confused by all their manipulations.
Wait, what ? This was an IEP meeting ? Did they give you a copy of the procedural safeguards ?
Did you email them all (with cc to special education director and yourself) a copy of the minutes of this meeting, as I suggested ? Did they give you any document to sign or review ?
Listen, old girl, these people are *not* your friends. They are not even acquaintances. They are actually adversaries, whose job is to cut costs and deny your daughter the services she needs. I don't care if they will hate your guts -- you just get out there and hire an advocate first thing tomorrow, and take it from there. I can understand your desire to preserve a halfway decent relationship with them, but if they are threatening you, then you already don't have a good relationship with them.
Also, TBH, I don't really get the whole picture - there are too many unanswered questions, and while I would love to get my hands on that IEP of yours, I cannot. I strongly recommend that you hire an advocate immediately.
If you are unable to fight this yourself, you are going to need paid help. This is no longer a DIY, unfortunately.
Good luck !
_________________
O villain, villain, smiling, damnèd villain!
My tables—meet it is I set it down
That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain.
At least I'm sure it may be so in "Denmark".
-- Hamlet, 1.5.113-116
Thank you Hismom. I think you are right, I will look for an advocate for her to help me with this, it is too hard to word things and know afterwards they were not communicating as they said, anything beyond "we want, do it".
I made a mistake listening as if they were. I wish people meant what they said. I know they mean well. I wish that I could trust what they would do.
Slightly divergent perceptions. I tend to think like Waterfalls in practice, but rational analysis tells me HisMom is correct.
An advocate sounds like a great idea.
I wish you everything well, Waterfalls. You've been very kind to me and to others, you really deserve some support.
Advocate or no advocate, I think you should not go alone to these meetings. It seems from your posts that you are simply outnumbered. When these people are professionals in their field, with their lingo and culture, this gets even worse.
Any supportive and calm person would be helpful in these circumstances. You can be totally upfront about this, you can tell them that you get really scared and confused at these meetings, and that you really need some emotional support.
It's in the nature of the teaching profession to be pulled in all directions by one's employer, various parents, different children's different needs and the need to have a private life separate from one's job. I wouldn't regard them as opponents, just very conflicted people. If you can make their job easier in some way, they may reward you with a bit more cooperation. That said, there will always be some boy who makes a big mess and gets all the resources. I think HisMom is right that you will have to make this a long campaign.
Waterfalls, I also think an advocate is going to be what you need right now. I think they are doing there best to confuse you or at least not explain things well, which is why you are having so much trouble explaining it to us and explaining it to us. It is not a matter of NT/Spectrum stuff either so much as they have their own language/jargon and based on personal experience talk in Double Speak. The last IEP meeting I had and I swear I was in Bizzarro World -- where words meant entirely different things.
Underwater: It is not necessarily that someone else is gobbling up the resources, either. They make everyone feel like -you- are the one taking, taking, taking from everyone else, even when you get very little. We have a boy that was making a mess of things, and I am assuming people assumed we got a ton of services. We didn't---and they were constantly trying to drop amounts of our paltry amount of services to even lower levels, even as our son was having increasing amounts of difficulties.
Could there have been some other child gobbling all the resources up? I doubt it--- I think they pulled this nonsense with everyone. I know for a fact they used some of the SPED budget for things that were available for all the students ---as they told me that is how they got their smart boards ---and they used it for inclusion aides that teachers used in multiple ways--not just for the SPED kids. If anything, where I live, they were raiding SPED's budget for general expenses.
Could there have been some other child gobbling all the resources up? I doubt it--- I think they pulled this nonsense with everyone. I know for a fact they used some of the SPED budget for things that were available for all the students ---as they told me that is how they got their smart boards ---and they used it for inclusion aides that teachers used in multiple ways--not just for the SPED kids. If anything, where I live, they were raiding SPED's budget for general expenses.
Thank you for your input, you know this better than me. I don't have a kid with special needs, so I don't see it from this point of view. What I should have said is, it's not so much a question of budgets as of who gets most attention.
I've just been working in schools and have observed that some kids who obviously need help are easy to ignore because they are nice and quiet. This is also the experience of teachers I've talked to. I was horrified about one boy who was allowed to sit in the classroom like a vegetable and learn nothing. No attempt was made to teach him anything, and the teachers knew that he was not able to keep up with the other children; he had no idea what the teacher was talking about. His family was not resourceful, so he had nobody to speak up for him.
That's why it's so important that families speak up on behalf of their nice and quiet kids.
Could there have been some other child gobbling all the resources up? I doubt it--- I think they pulled this nonsense with everyone. I know for a fact they used some of the SPED budget for things that were available for all the students ---as they told me that is how they got their smart boards ---and they used it for inclusion aides that teachers used in multiple ways--not just for the SPED kids. If anything, where I live, they were raiding SPED's budget for general expenses.
Thank you for your input, you know this better than me. I don't have a kid with special needs, so I don't see it from this point of view. What I should have said is, it's not so much a question of budgets as of who gets most attention.
I've just been working in schools and have observed that some kids who obviously need help are easy to ignore because they are nice and quiet. This is also the experience of teachers I've talked to. I was horrified about one boy who was allowed to sit in the classroom like a vegetable and learn nothing. No attempt was made to teach him anything, and the teachers knew that he was not able to keep up with the other children; he had no idea what the teacher was talking about. His family was not resourceful, so he had nobody to speak up for him.
That's why it's so important that families speak up on behalf of their nice and quiet kids.
Could there have been some other child gobbling all the resources up? I doubt it--- I think they pulled this nonsense with everyone. I know for a fact they used some of the SPED budget for things that were available for all the students ---as they told me that is how they got their smart boards ---and they used it for inclusion aides that teachers used in multiple ways--not just for the SPED kids. If anything, where I live, they were raiding SPED's budget for general expenses.
Thank you for your input, you know this better than me. I don't have a kid with special needs, so I don't see it from this point of view. What I should have said is, it's not so much a question of budgets as of who gets most attention.
I've just been working in schools and have observed that some kids who obviously need help are easy to ignore because they are nice and quiet. This is also the experience of teachers I've talked to. I was horrified about one boy who was allowed to sit in the classroom like a vegetable and learn nothing. No attempt was made to teach him anything, and the teachers knew that he was not able to keep up with the other children; he had no idea what the teacher was talking about. His family was not resourceful, so he had nobody to speak up for him.
That's why it's so important that families speak up on behalf of their nice and quiet kids.
I agree with this also. Everyone is under-served. They do the least they can get away with, more often than not. If the problem does not affect them (serious classroom disruptions or standardized test scores that are an issue for them) they don't want to pay. it doesn't mean the teachers do not care ---but anything that costs money or is too out-of-the-box even when free, is usually an issue.
Just wanted to wish you luck with all of this and "hugs"! ! It's hard to go through. I had such a hard time with my daughter's school.
She is 19 now and graduated last year, but the memories of the struggle for services are still fresh!
Probably like your daughter, she was never disruptive and a smart, sweet, quiet girl...but she still struggled mightily in certain areas!
I would really, really, recommend an advocate as others have. I found one through our local Learning Disability Assoc. and she was well worth the price! I feel like I'm fairly well educated, but the IEP process, meetings, etc...really were over my head as far as knowing the right questions to ask and pressing them on the right issues. The advocate was awesome with all that stuff as that was her job! I felt we were really supported.
So don't feel bad, you're not the only one that this is difficult for!! Best of luck!
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