Stepmom to possible aspie - help!

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^^^ I know you know more about this than me. Much more!

But don't you believe a parent should encourage a kid to have a modicum of respect for people? She's 16 years old. She has no cognitive limitations. I feel like, amid all her problems and concerns, that she should have a minimal amount of respect for people---not because they are parents/authority figures/family members--but because they are PEOPLE.

PEOPLE are entitled to be treated with at least a modicum of decency, I believe.

PEOPLE shouldn't treat other PEOPLE (even total strangers) like she treats PEOPLE sometimes, in my opinion.

I'm not speaking of a "disciplinary" approach. I'm just speaking about an "appeal to decency." How would the 16-year old feel if she were treated like she sometimes treats people?

I really get the feeling that SHE (the 16-year-old) would be happier should she begin to take a different approach to life.

By the way, I do believe in what you believe. And I respect you experience very much.

I remember my mom telling me in 6th grade if her special ed students can give her respect despite their cognitive limitations, I can too.

Hi Kraftiekortie:

Thanks for your message. I appreciate your comments a lot. I hope the following clarifies my thinking. Feel free to continue questioning.

Bottom line: I wholeheartedly agree that SD16 needs to learn how to show respect to others. Not only because it makes the world a better place, but also those skills could help her get what she wants out of life. But it won't be easy and will take a very long time for SD16 to show progress.

In my opinion, SD16 may succeed in academic environments, as did her mom. But that doesn't mean she doesn't have other 'cognitive limitations.' It's great that Stepmom doesn't have to address academic problems with SD16, on top of the things she is facing.

But first, I'm concerned about Stepmom. She's in a really tough position and is worn out. I admire that she took the time to find this forum and express her frustrations and insights. So many parents attribute their children or step children's problems to inherent character issues, and therefore dismiss any responsibility to teach skills or hope for improvement. She's not doing that, she is looking for answers and helpful suggestions. Kudos to her!

If she can get in a better place emotionally she will have more energy to take action. It will likely take time for that to happen as she has evidence and thinking that it isn't worth it to even try.

I do believe that parents are in the best position to teach their kids how to show another person 'respect' once they figure out how. It's not easy as "showing respect" is a social skill and requires a lot of if/then thinking and reading of the other person and lots of other skills that are notoriously difficult for those with atypical brains.

Professionals may have insights but finding a good book to read or video to watch that really addresses this topic well is difficult. Social skills classes are hard to find and SD16 may not want to join them. Therapy is expensive and may not be helpful. So parents do have to be self-reliant and very patient.

There's no magic method either. What works for one child may not work for another.

The best news is that moms are in the best position to be able to reinforce their child's helpful behaviors better than any one else in their child's life.

Also, I believe that SD16 will sense right away if Stepmom is frustrated, angry, impatient or any other 'negative' emotion and probably shut down. So that's why I believe being in a loving place is the first step.

Step parenting is full of landmines, too. That's another topic!

I absolutely agree that the communication lines should be open between stepparent and stepchild. And that the stepmom should provide conditions where this open communication is possible. All this while teaching the girl, in a gentle manner, how to be respectful to people. I know how it feels to not be able to communicate. I had lots of trouble with that for various reasons.

And I agree the stepmom is exhausted and frazzled. I would feel the same way. I would feel frustrated. I might not react in a virtuous manner. I might express myself in the wrong way, and turn off the girl. I might, mistakenly, use a purely "disciplinary" approach.

It's true that the stepmom reaching out positively, and not assuming that the girl has "character problems." I wouldn't assume that, either. I would assume that she is unhappy about something, and that the mother/father situation has much to do with it.

But I still don't believe in maintaining the "status quo." All too often, people make concessions to whatever "disorder" a youngster might have, and attribute disrespectful behaviors to that disorder. I believe, in order for both to be happy, that progress must be made-----both on the part of the stepmother, and the part of the stepchild. It's not anybody's "fault," it should be noted.

Action should be taken; otherwise, it becomes more difficult to change the situation.

You have a very patronizing view that autistic children don't know what to do. They are smart. You, or anybody else, really ought to stop taking a "these-kids-are-defective-and-need-to-be-taught" point of view. You are confusing autistic children with neurotypical children. You want to apply the way how we raise neurotypical children to raising autistic children. That's the whole point of why most parents out there make a hell out of their autistic children's lives and their own lives.

You can perfectly choose the route of having self-esteem and be a role model for autistic children. Yet you choose the opposite way. I just don't understand you. Instead of defending children, you choose to attack them. Why?


Are you talking about the stepmom or the stepdaughter? Don't you realize the stepmom has shown ZERO respect for her stepdaughter by posting her family problems in the open to strangers, and fully expecting her stepdaughter to read it? What kind of parent is that?


Absolutely. So, the stepmom has made a mistake. She has made tons of mistakes in disrespecting her stepdaughter. She has not shown a modicum of decency.

Parents are the ones initiating actions. Children are the ones responding with reactions. Perpetrators don't have the right to claim victimhood.

Stepmom said: "I treated both girls the exact same way from the start." Oops, sorry, she started with the wrong foot from day one. How can you ever raise an autistic child the same way you raise a neurotypical child? Don't you see the very root cause of all the problems that the stepmom has caused? That is precisely why schools also give hell to autistic students, because they insist on using the neurotypical methods on autistic children. Stepmom has made a horrible mistake, from day one.


Show me one single case of success story in your approach. The problem with you, and so many parents and teachers, and ABA therapists out there, is that you don't have any success stories. You see your method failing, from one autistic child to another, yet you think that if only you try harder, you'll succeed.

The day I see one single success story from the traditional approach, I'll believe it. So far, I have seen zero.

- - -

I found out about this illusion recently. The thing is, humans have biases. When you adopt the neurotypical view, you see only what you want to see. You believe you are right... but you are wrong. What you see is only an illusion.

^ I think kraftiekortie was being more realistic as to these specific circumstances. She is the step mum not the mother, and doesn't live with her. She doesn't even know whether the child is on the spectrum, how can she know the right way to deal with someone who is autistic when she doesn't really know anything about it and is unlikely to invest an enormous amount of time and energy into adjusting to something that the child's own parents don't see.

Her behaviour hasn't been all good, but I think she is really struggling to cope (NT's do struggle) where else was she going to go for advice. Help with dealing with her own feelings of resentment was good advice too. And clear rules on the minimum level of respect to show others are important, I mean you don't need to understand or accept a rule to obey it, though it's better if you do. What's not reasonable is to expect the step daughter to see things differently, she's not going to suddenly want to bond during a shopping trip, if that disappoints the OP then the fault was in her expectations.

OK_ I scrolled back to see how the disrespectful behavior of the step daughter was described to see how bad it is -- and it does not seem too bad to me. Tell me if I am missing anything from the posts.

1) Going on and on with her own favored topic of conversation. (If you understand autism, and if the girl is autistic, this is not meant to be disrespectful, and has to do with learning reciprocity, impulse control, and learning the reciprocity of allowing others to speak.

2) Interrupting people (see number one)

3)Being honest about what dinner tastes like (This is an etiquette/politeness) issue not necessarily a respect issue - but maybe I am taking respect literally here. She could be trained to word this more politely and ask for different food (maybe she has aversions/sensitivities) but from an NT lens this would also be interpreted as disrespectful as well, for not being grateful for the food prepared for you)

4)Hygiene: This is likely a sensory/depression issue not one of respect.

5)Non-compliance: Also through an authoritative lens this looks like disrespect -- but there are many possible reasons for non-compliance that have nothing to do with respect.

OK--I could go on, but to me none of these are actually disrespect. Even if she gets snippy sometimes -- as NT kids will too, depending on temperament -- I don't think disrespect is close to a main issue.

The step mom may be frustrated, hurt etc but I don't see insulted by disrespect as really the right emotion. The girl may indeed not respect her, but this is not the same as showing disrespect. You often cannot help who you respect and who you don't -- they key is controlling how you act about it and I don't even know how well the girl can control that or how much that is the relevant issue..

Parents who grow up with an infant, give a child reason to like them because they take care of their needs and build trust over time. A step starts at either zero or maybe negative if the child considers the step a disruption or an obstacle to their parents getting back together or what have you. That is just the way it is.

Steps often feel like they deserve insta-respect/affection by mere virtue of the fact that they are married to one of the bio-parents and are adults living in the home. That may work for people who accept authoritarian approaches readily and NTs of course can often fake this.

They are encouraged to fake this because they are supposed to unselfishly want their parents to be happy regardless of how it affects them or whether the bioparent was selfish in bringing the person into the household without bothering to make sure the kids would get along with this person. By the way, this is not respectful of the child and it is normal to expect a new adult person in your life to earn your respect.

The step mom apparently tried but on her terms, and I think that is the main problem. For example, suggesting a spa day for a child who hates basic grooming might seem like a great idea to encourage it -- but if the kid thinks it is shallow/vain/boring/a sensory nightmare, all it does is make the child feel worse to suggest it. And a new adult in the home is not going to get the benefit of the doubt if something seems like shade. (Think of it as buying a diet book for someone who knows he is fat)

In any event, there were errors made very early on -- not the step mom's fault, b/c she seems to have meant well, but at this point the child and step mom probably have mutual contempt for one another and it is going to be very hard to repair this. Mutual dislike seems to be the main thing.

If you know me, you would know that I'm not "authoritarian." I'm the victim of an "authoritarian" approach. I don't have an "authoritarian" bone in my body.

I'm not talking about Emily Post-type etiquette here. I'm talking about "basic respect."

And I just gave my impression. It's not "set in stone." I didn't present it as something which is definite I'm no expert on kids. I was just reacting based upon the unhappiness of kids I've seen who are constantly seeking to take the "negative" approach, rather than trying another approach. I find it a vicious cycle. I find it leads to much trouble. If a kid runs away in defiance, the kid faces lots of potential trouble in the streets.

It's okay.....in life, one has to be open to be criticized. I have to be open to it, too. We can't keep on shrinking from being criticized, and discussing things.

Kraftie--I think I miscommunicated. Yikes! I did not mean I thought you were authoritarian--I mean I think the step mom probably has an authoritarian ideology/expectations or at least I am gleaning that from her posts.

My post was really meant to say that I think what she calls respect is not what I think basic respect is.

IMO it is hard to just take something like stepdaughter shows me disrespect as a given without asking specific questions about what that entails b/c not everyone has the same definition if disrespect -- and especially with kids on the spectrum, what appears to be disrespect is actually something quite different that has to be addressed it a completely different way than actual disrespect.

For example, I live where a lot of adults have an approach to children where kids are expected to speak when spoken to. My son is typically in his own world, and not even tuned into if someone might talk to him. Speech from unknown people is tuned out as background noise and always has been.

He knows from experience that at a restaurant the waitstaff will speak to him to ask his order and that sort of thing. So, his ears and brain are tuned in becasue he expects it. His observational skills are not turned on all the time and it will not even register if some random person talks to him. When it is a kid who talks to him the kid just thinks it is weird. When it is an adult - the adult usually assumes disrespect.

So, anyway, What I am trying to say is that I tend not to take someone who has little to no experience with autism (Ie. Not you, Kraftie)at face value if they say a person who is or might be autistic is acting disrespectfully because i mostly think that they would not know.

Thanks very much. I appreciate it.

It's good that we can communicate without risking offense.

You're a very indispensable member of the Parents' Forum. I seek your well-reasoned posts whenever something comes up pertaining to autistic children.

Open communication is essential for kids vis-a-vis parents. A dialogue should always be encouraged---on the basis of basic respect. I feel the kid should hold up his/her part of the bargain. I believe there are times when kids will "test" us in that regard. I believe we have to make sure that "basic respect" remains part of the dialogue.

I grew up in a "seen--not heard" sort of environment---and my parents weren't bad at all. It was just the norm at the time.

I don't feel kids should be forced to experience this state of things. It's a terrible state, indeed.

So you weren't heard until you were 5
Sorry, couldn't resist it.

AspieMom, the example you gave made me realise why some adults got so angry at me when I couldn't notice meaningful glances :/ So the NTs see disrespect there. Sorry, I'm blind to meaningful glances

The daughter isn't even diagnosed so we don't even know for sure if she is autistic.

Also it's all kids that are taught respect. Parents and other adults must model it for them and kids pick up on it by seeing it in others and copying it.

Magz: I was "heard" all right---especially at night in my toddler years, when I would cry all night.

I was a handful!

Does it matter?

This is what happened this Halloween when I took my son to a friend's home and everyone went out for trick-o-treating together. My son liked to run around and check out things in the neighborhood, so he would give his bag to me. The mom of the other boy would come over to me, yank the bag from me, and give it to my son. She said, kids needed to learn about responsibility. My son would carry the bag for a moment, then would give the bag back to me. The lady would come over, yank the bag from me again and give it to my son again. And then the same cycle would repeat. I found the whole thing to be rather hysterical... really funny. Even after 6 cycles, the lady still hasn't learned that I did not agree with her position.

I mean, neurotypical parents waste time in all these things. They create problems where there were none, and agonize from those problems. Neurotypical parents spend their whole lifetime in chasing after irrelevant issues, and wreak havoc in autistic children's lives. Meanwhile, the same parents don't spend time in developing their children visual-manually. So, it is no surprise that their children don't develop well.

The point is, after failing for a few times, neurotypical parents/teachers/therapists/researchers, are totally unable to wake up and see that what they are doing is not working. They further have this mentality that everybody can be approached with the same way. And if some children don't respond well, then it's time to turn up the knob and increase the intensity of their approaches.

Does it matter whether a child has a certain condition or not? It doesn't. When some approaches are not working, you are supposed to learn, re-adjust, and ultimately develop a true understanding about your child. If you start with a bias, you will never be able to get out of your trap... just like you'll never to tell that the square A has exactly the same shade as the square B. Truly, even after showing the video and my personal version of removing the neighboring squares to some friends, I was dismayed at how one guy still told me, the isolated version was tampered, and the square A is darker. Oh boy. Some people learn things in 5 minutes, some other people are just totally incapable of learning. They prefer conspiracy theories, fringe therapies, and some even still blame on vaccines. And that is the root cause of why autistic children don't develop in our society: parents can't learn.

It was none of the other parent's business.

If your kid wanted to give you the bag to hold, that's his privilege.

Absolutely! I mostly only know NT's and none of them would have done this. They might have thought you were wrong to let your child do this (I'm not agreeing) but overruling a parent repeatedly in dealing with their own child is a big no to them. You clearly found this funny so that's good.