The "not being able to lie" problem

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Omerik
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29 Jan 2010, 2:31 pm

Just wondering - how do you parents deal with it?

Till this day, I can't lie. I'm proud of it, actually. I learned that not all people are as honest as I am, but I can't lie. I remember the reason I didn't pass the "gifted children" test - when I wasn't sure, I didn't circle any possible answer, I was sure that's cheating :oops:

So now I'm perhaps less naive - but still, I'm proud of my honesty.
For example, when my favourite teacher in high-school asked me if I've done my homework, I could just say "yes" and she would move on. But I said "no". Her policy was something like "no homework - get out of class", but she decided to call back the ones that she got out of the classroom, instead of getting me out with them. I just couldn't lie to her, and she knew I cared about her class...

How do you parents deal with it?
Do you just teach them that not everyone is honest as them, or do you actually teach them it's okay to lie? Just wondering...



DW_a_mom
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29 Jan 2010, 7:25 pm

I would like to say my son never lies, be that wouldn't be 100% accurate. When it serves his interests or he has some contorted logic to justify it, he does seem to be able to do it. But, it is really rare, and he doesn't seem to be able to contort his logic when we really need him to.

He knows perfectly well how to play his words if we ask, "did you brush your teeth?" for that can, in theory, be answered "yes" if one has ever brushed their teeth, when of course what we mean is "did you brush your teeth in the last 10 minutes?" (we have learned to phrase it that way). What he does not know how to do is to avoid the truth (without lying) when he needs to do so to guard someone's feelings. If his sister asks, "do you like my picture, isn't it great?" he'll answer, "no, it's lame" and she'll be in tears. His defense is that saying otherwise would be lying, but what about finding something you like about the picture? Or keeping your mouth shut? There are plenty of ways to withhold the complete and unburnished truth without lying.

So. What I've told him is that I don't want him to lie, but in the interest of following certain social conventions sometimes one might withhold the truth or beat around the question. The idea there is that if someone is truly paying attention, they have a fighting chance to get the more correct answer, if they really want it, while you have preserved your honesty by not lying.


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MorbidMiss
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29 Jan 2010, 9:39 pm

Because of my X's abuse my son tries to lie almost constantly. Any time that he feels he will get into trouble, even a tiny bit, he will lie. The problem with this (other than it is wrong) is that he is really terrible at it.

And it does not seem to matter to him how many times we tell him that he would be in less trouble if he just told us the truth from the beginning. He just cannot seem to get it.

We try to teach him that it is not OK to lie, but that there are times where he will need to... not be so blunt. For example if some head case of a woman actually asks him if something makes her look fat... then he should say, "That other outfit is more flattering on you." instead of, "Yes." (Seriously does anyone ever ask that anymore? I wouldn't!) Or if someone asks if he likes what they cooked and he does not then he could say, "I do prefer ...." instead of "OMG This sucks!"



MommyJones
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30 Jan 2010, 9:18 am

My son doesn't lie, but he will deceive. If I ask a straight question, "did you brush your teeth" I will get no answer at all, or I don't know if it's something a little more vague. If he says yes, I know I can believe him.

deception? That's different. One day he refused to do any of his school work so he teachers sent all of his books home. After school he goes to daycare and he NEVER does his homework there, always when he gets home. I picked him up one day and the provider said he did all of his homework. I praised him up and down. I got home and checked it, and there were 15 pages of work, and notes on all of the books that he refused to do his work and he was disrespectful to his teacher. He did his homework at daycare so I wouldn't find out.

It was hilarious :)



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30 Jan 2010, 10:55 am

I also have absolutely no ability to lie either and others notice. This has stood me in good stead over the years. For example I worked in a bakery for a while. Someone did something they shouldn't, which caused the huge industrial walkin freezer to malfunction, leading to the loss of the entire contents. Throughout the day everyone who went in to fetch something must have seen the problem but been too lazy to do anything about it. The boss was understandably furious. He wanted to know who had done it and why no one had reported it. Everyone denied it and claimed to have not seen the problem. I told him I hadn't been near the freezer that day too. He instantly believed me and believed everyone else was lying. They all lost their end of year bonus. I kept mine.

Then I accidentally broke the giant deep fat fryer. I was mortified and went and found him and told him straight away. He told me not to worry about it and had it repaired. A few weeks later it was broken again by a colleague, he got his pay docked. Why? Because he tried to hide it and only owned up when he knew the game was up.



MommyJones
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30 Jan 2010, 2:40 pm

MotherKnowsBest wrote:
I also have absolutely no ability to lie either and others notice. This has stood me in good stead over the years. For example I worked in a bakery for a while. Someone did something they shouldn't, which caused the huge industrial walkin freezer to malfunction, leading to the loss of the entire contents. Throughout the day everyone who went in to fetch something must have seen the problem but been too lazy to do anything about it. The boss was understandably furious. He wanted to know who had done it and why no one had reported it. Everyone denied it and claimed to have not seen the problem. I told him I hadn't been near the freezer that day too. He instantly believed me and believed everyone else was lying. They all lost their end of year bonus. I kept mine.

Then I accidentally broke the giant deep fat fryer. I was mortified and went and found him and told him straight away. He told me not to worry about it and had it repaired. A few weeks later it was broken again by a colleague, he got his pay docked. Why? Because he tried to hide it and only owned up when he knew the game was up.


It's refreshing to know there are people out there like you 8)



DW_a_mom
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30 Jan 2010, 8:06 pm

MommyJones wrote:
MotherKnowsBest wrote:
I also have absolutely no ability to lie either and others notice. This has stood me in good stead over the years. For example I worked in a bakery for a while. Someone did something they shouldn't, which caused the huge industrial walkin freezer to malfunction, leading to the loss of the entire contents. Throughout the day everyone who went in to fetch something must have seen the problem but been too lazy to do anything about it. The boss was understandably furious. He wanted to know who had done it and why no one had reported it. Everyone denied it and claimed to have not seen the problem. I told him I hadn't been near the freezer that day too. He instantly believed me and believed everyone else was lying. They all lost their end of year bonus. I kept mine.

Then I accidentally broke the giant deep fat fryer. I was mortified and went and found him and told him straight away. He told me not to worry about it and had it repaired. A few weeks later it was broken again by a colleague, he got his pay docked. Why? Because he tried to hide it and only owned up when he knew the game was up.


It's refreshing to know there are people out there like you 8)


I long ago decided that the best road at work, when you make a mistake, is to take it straight up and promptly. Otherwise it all snowballs. One boss told me he thought of me as the moral compass for the department. I did use to lie as a child, and I was horrible at it. No idea if this is one of my AS-like traits or not.

I told my son when he was young about the tangled web one weaves when they first endeavor to deceive, and this was why one should never start down the road of lying. Well, one day he told a white lie to a friend. And it grew. And it grew. By the time he told me about it, because he was so tangled he had no idea how to get out of it, I had a hard time suppressing outright laughter. So, thankfully, he learned about the tangled web with something harmless, and he definitely learned it.


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Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).