daughter recently recognised as possibly aspergers!Racist?

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HI all, I am a mum to a 14 year old girl who has presented with many behaviour problems throughout her life. However, in the last few years she has become anxious and has been unable to function through mainstream due to relationship difficulties, bullying and being unable to sustain friendships. She is suffering from depression and the phychiatrist has now suggested that her inablility to reason and her ridgid thinking and lack of negotiation skills may be down to aspergers. She has presented as a normal child growing up although always moody and always demonstrating tantrum or meltdown when one little thing goes wrong. At times she is very imature and silly and unable to alter her behaviour to suit the situation. Family have always commented on how tolerant I am and I have found myself treading on eggshells throughout her life. Ringing Bells?

Any how that is a brief intro, I am dealing with it and we are waiting for a date for assessment to begin.

Please can you help with this.

She has now become quite racist toward Asian people in particular and is speeling out sentences that are alien to the way she has been brought up to understand and accept diversity and culture. We are all educators, teachers and social workiers in the family and have lived our lives with a diverse attitude.

Is this typical of an Aspie, who is mixing with people who will put up with her as a desparate way to feel normal? If so I can deal with it as her stress levels are already stabalising due to me simplifying the rules and regs of what she can and cant do at the moment. I have stopped taking the things away that she needs when she has hit out , been violent etc and replaced what would be normal behaviour strategies for a teenage girl with smaller targets to achieve these things.

Thats where I am at and feel that she will make her own decisions about people and come back to the strong views of her family as she is less stressed and will develop into an Aspie who can learn to reason and make decisions to reach their own opinions, rather than imitate to feel normal.

This is all new to me! Can someone reassure me and tell me that, Im either completly on the wrong track or Im, step by step making logical sense of my beautiful daughters needs??

Thankyou, to those of you that read and offer info. This has come as a stunning shock, then again so did the happy and violent agressive hateful behaviour towards us as a family. I am whizzing with the details of this possibility and although initially devastated, I am hoping that Aspergers will be present. We were getting close to her being hospitalised and I have had police and paramedics out four times! She is screaming out of herself for help. I dont want her to struggle with mental illness, I want her to be able to celebrate and understand her differences. I dont want Bi Polar or BPD or even Opositional Defiance disorder ( although, I think that was the thoughts initially.

Aspergers makes so much sense and I have done the test on her behalf, she came out a 138 so defo leaning more Aspie than NT. Im almost scared that she will come out NT, then how do I deal with it all ?? But, you know, I will one way or another, how ever much she struggles, I wont tolerate being abused but I will be there aways to love her.

Kind regards

Cloudy x x x

Phew! So sorry things are difficult for you - I hope you get some answers soon!

I have this one (the racism thing I mean!) It was a HUGE concern of mine, and we finally figured it out just recently!

When my son started school, although it is fairly diverse, there were only two African-American boys in his program. One of these boys - well, if he isn't AS, I'll be shocked - and since he was so very like my own son in all the most negative ways, my son wanted nothing to do with him (I am grateful that finally, this year, he is talking about this boy with some compassion, as his reaction was clearly based on self-loathing and always made me sad.) The other boy, who I'll call Joe here, is a fairly typical kid, but for some reason my son reacted the same way you describe.

This young man has turned out to be an exceptional kid: during the time that my son was really struggling, and on a "crisis plan" at school, I guess he accidentally upset my son, who accused him of "looking at" him. I don't know what the teacher did, but she somehow communicated the seriousness of my son's struggle to this boy. For the next several weeks, I got somewhat curt reports from my son about how this boy was checking in to make sure my son was OK, making room for him at lunch, etc. This persisted despite my son's continued rude responses.

Then one day, my son came home and said, angrily "Joe asked me to play soccer with the other kids at recess!" I replied "Wow. That was nice of him - he must have thought you didn't like playing alone." DS responded "He was being mean! He said 'Why don't you come on and show us what you've got!' He knows I don't have anything! He knows I can't play soccer! He was making fun of me!" I knew the situation, so I know the other child had not intended to challenge my son - and, in our area, this is a fairly typical friendly request when framed in that culture. Suddenly, a light went on: my son is really gifted when it comes to picking up scripts from other kids, but he doesn't have access to enough data for the slight difference in African-American speech. He can't understand English when it's not in a familiar cultural context. The effect is the same as racism, but the cause is really a problem with pragmatic speech - we're just starting social skills classes for my son now, and plan to request pragmatic speech therapy at school, so hopefully this will improve.

Sometimes random people can be a real gift. I've thanked the young man, and as soon as I get a chance to do so, I plan on letting his parents know how thoughtful and patient he is being with my son- the largest part of this gift is that it helped me understand just how much my son depends on scripting.

Thank you mumsparkey. I think I am temprarily obsessed with the subject of Aspergers right this min!

whoa, momsparky, lightbulbs just came on LOL. My 13 yo aspie daughter picked up a racist opinion of African American people over the past 2 years as there was a group of girls at her school teasing her. When she would come home and tell me what they had been saying I was always confused and told her I didn't think it was bad, she was just taking things the wrong way and maybe she should toughen up. (MInd you, she did have a real group of tormenters in her so-called friends, so that was my point of reference in comparing the behaviors). We have a very bad year of school that year and I began to homeschool her in desperation and she wants to return to school next year but is afraid of the black kids. Now putting two and two together I can see that she can't decipher the nuances of speech. We have been to the park a couple of times and when she has commented on situations or observed behaviors we have dissected them and talked about them I can see now the basis of the problem. I could never figure it out before. On the flip side she was obsessed with Asians for the longest time because her fixation was on anime/manga and everything about it. Cloudy, I know what you are going through in figuring this out. Although my daughter never gets violent, her behavior is always unpredictable, volatile, and controlling. I could never understand where the behavior comes from because that is absolutely not how I raised her or the relationship I expected to have with my daughter. It has been hard to resolve that my daughter could hurt me so completely in her behavior and mannerisms BUT now that I understand about ASD things make sense to me now and the things she does I don't take so personally now. But, the downside is, I still don't know what to do with her. We are still floundering with the meltdowns and trying to figure out just how much to tolerate of the behavior because the world and everyone in it won't tolerate the behavior. It is a fine line. I look forward to reading more posts from you because we are in a similar journey right now.

I guess I took it the wrong way when I was tripped down a flight of stairs in seventh grade. Or beaten up over a magazine that was left in an empty desk. I should have just realized that those things are just differences in culture. They were only trying to be friendly.

Maybe your kids are having different experiences than you've had.

I am very sorry you had a bad experience - but I think we're talking about two completely different things. My son was reacting negatively to a child being friendly because he misinterpreted the language involved. I observed interactions between this boy and my son, myself; I have good reason to believe that this child is being friendly. We've had equal trouble with my son misinterpreting bullying as friendly behavior this year (with a different kid.)

Sounds like you were actually mistreated. While I'm very sorry this happened, it's not the same. I can understand how adults sometimes don't react appropriately to bullying - it took us a while to figure the bullying out, and even longer to get the school to address it, but that doesn't mean what happened to either him or you was in any way OK. (Nor, frankly, is my son's treatment of this boy OK.)

In addition, I'm a bit confused by the wording of your post. Are you suggesting that all people of a particular culture are mistreating you, even ones you don't know?

Aven, sounds like sheer bullying to me and then as an aspie, will you ever let that go?

Bittersweet, I hope that your daughter does not develop in the same way as mine has. I have just had the quietest week for 18 months although I am very much on tender hooks, careful of what I say and thinking all the time of how to put things to her. I have discovered in the last week, since the dx of possible Aspergers that when I say 'no' she take it as punishment and also that when people she doesnt know smile at her, she is offended by it.

This week has been a success because I have given her her lap top back, I have broken things down and clearly outlined a very simple set of rules.

You come it at 8.30, you keep in touch if anything changes that may make this difficult.
You keep things generally tidy.
The house shuts down at 10pm, no moaching around in the kitchen, cooking showers should all be done in time for this curfew.

If you do those three things, you have your laptop.

It seems to be working. Last night she went downstairs at 10.30 and made a sandwich. I have said that she will not go on the lap top tonight when she comes in but then can have it back in the morning if she hits the three points above today. She has had the lap top during the day today.

Before this, I would have taken the laptop for a day if she had had a meltdown, smashed something etc. Then because she did not have her fix on the internet, she would just keep stressing and meltdown would reoccur which meant she could never get her lap top.

My daughter is not recognising aspergers or that communication is the problem so I am just giving her little tips about thinking about what stresses her and how she can avoid it. Not there yet. I predict that because she is trying to socialise tonght, she will be stressed when she comes in. Melt down tonight is expected and she wont have the computer so I will suggest she listens to music in her room.

This is so exhausting and although, initially I felt she needed her things back and that she needed things to hold her focus. I am not going to allow her to 'rule the roost'. However, she has to have control and comfort to keep her level so I am having to consider that too.

Its all very complex and there are lots of things about my D that do not point to Aspie. I am treating it as it is at the moment.


Its all a bit like retraining thinking, I think! I so hope Im right.

Oh I so hope I am on the right track. We all need to function in out lives and I am hoping to stri[p this back and teacher to stop and reason a little more. She is obviously mild if she is Aspie. However, she is having a really rough time of it and emotionally at times she speaks and acts like a five or six year old. She says the most stupid and silly things. Uses bad language, shows hate and anger. She has never witnessed this at home or in my family so what else could it be apart from undxed Aspie screaming out to fit in with the behaviour of teenagers out there. Difference being, these teenagers know when and how to act in different situ, she is missing the trick somewhere.

Such love is sent to all. x x x xStay strong x x x

When I say mild, it isnt when it has affected her life to a point that she is out of mainstream school at present. Relationships with family are at an all time low and she can not cope when peers change their plans or plans go wrong. So really, its not mild when she is not functioning is it ? The current affect its having in her teenage years is astronomical!

I hope this helps. It sounds like you are learning fast. I learned the most from this free online book written by an Aspie, Tracker, who is on this forum: http://www.asdstuff.com/grats.html

I've only learned my son has asperger's several months ago and the tension in the house is far better. Education and therapy has helped us both to be more calm.

Thank you aann, I have been engrossed in the book for the last hour. So good to read something so positive and helpful. Im very positive about the Asp because it means I can deal with it and I can help. She is an intelligent girl and I know with the right love and attention, acceptance and thus, she will thrive. She is home, just about on time ( not gonna throw a hissy over that) and has accepted that she cant have the comp on. She knows she will have free access tomorrow and that is comforting. So its tv and music that will keep her busy. Im off for a peaceful nights sleep.

A week ago, it was paramedics, police and diazapan. Now I have hope and my little girl still appears to be there. I had no idea, no concrete clue at all. I have worked with Autistic children for 15 years who also had other cognitive difficulties, completly unable to communicate. I thought only a genius could have their lives affected by Autism or Aspergers. I have been so blinded. Alas, I am over that, took a day to process that one!

I think it as lucky that I have a few basic rules I learnt in my job. Those being that, they need to be doing something, sensory overload is so painfully stressful and also that 'it is as it is, so deal with it'

Love to all

Glad to hear you found Trackers book!

Whether or not the professionals decide your daughter has Aspergers, if you have found that dealing with her on the assumption she has Aspergers makes life better for both of you, then stick with the protocol. Labels are only worth what they get for you, and there are many shades in between.

As for one of your first questions, if anything you noted in describing your daughter rang a bell, the answer is "yes."

On the racism, I do tend to think it's coming from some sort of misunderstanding or misinterpretation, but sorting that out can be quite difficult. AS kids derive their positions based on logical analysis and so, to them, their positions are correct. The problem is, facts and logic and actually quite fluid, as you learn fast when you read the debate board on this forum (PPR). Nothing like watching two opposing sides both using complete logic and facts to support totally opposite positions, and no one ever seems to change their mind. But, try telling that to your logic minded child. If your child is like mine, there is no middle ground between being right, and being wrong / stupid / end my life now, please. In other words, tread carefully.

I do want to address the hospitalization thought in your original post. Please note that I have read NO reports on this forum from AS individuals or their parents with positive results (doesn't mean that there haven't been any; just not among the posts I've read). So, as far as I can tell, with an AS child hospitalization pretty much consistently makes things worse. I can understand risking that when there are serious safety issues, but one must be mindful this is not likely to be a path to success for the AS child. Hospitalization cannot treat the AS, it can only treat certain co-morbids, and it takes the child away from everything they know and understand to do so, which is about the worse thing you can to do an AS child already struggling to understand the world and who needs consistency and familiarity just to get through the day. Does that make sense?

Anyway, it sounds like you are already making progress and that is wonderful to read. Best of luck and welcome to Wrong Planet!

Thank you mum

On the hospitalization note. This only came into play when she was so stressed and melting down, violent and aggressive that it seemed a the lesser of the two between a police cell and a hospital. This was before we were given the possible Aspergers thinking and I absolutly agree that it would be the wrong thing. She presented as mentally ill and this has been very confusing for us as a family, wha are not aggressive or violent.

Last night four lads called for her. TakIing in to consideration, she has had a very positve week. She went straight into bad boy mode, even as far as spitting on the floor like they do. I asked them to leave calmly four time as they had arrived on our'shutdown' time at 10 pm at night. They refused to leave, encouraged by my daughter who behaved disrespectfully towards me and so did they. At one point one even walked into my house which is when I lost it big time. I called the police and she was completly rude and arrogant, they did leave on the police request at around 11.30 altering thier behaviour very quickly into reasonable mode. However my D didnt, she threw a fit, rude and disrespectful to the officer and at one point he put cuffs on her, giving her opportunity to sit down, he took them off as she got scared.

She has lost so many freinds over the years and is trying to be normal, I am hoping she will get over this and make safer choices. She is desparate for any social contact and has ended up being the source of their entertainment. They knew she would kick off and they came here deliberatly for that pupose. I have let more friends in to spend time with her, welcomed them into my house and been friendly, so that she gets social contact and is safe. Thats over now and I am going to have to take the lap top away for today.

Its like she is trapped, she is not open to the thought of aspergers and I dont want to go over the top with a semi dx on my back. I want to teache her but she is closed at the moment, she is trying to be normal or that is what I think she is doing.

The police have told them never to set foot near my door again and my instinct is to keep her in and take the violence on the chin. However, I feel she has to come to her own understanding of how these people stress her and that she really does not need to be normal and that being different and keeping your self safe is all she needs.

Im tired, so possibly not being consise. I dont know when she is going to be ready to take the Aspergers idea on bored or when, indeed, I can even get any reaoning from her. I am scared as she is out of school at the moment. I am a singls mum and she will be alone at home tomorrow as I have to work for three days now. I feel like my job is in jeapordy, my life style as I need to move house so that she can have her own room and the space she needs. I have a bed in my living room at the moment to accomodate her.

All that said, I am not going to let the peaceful week go to waste. I know that I am going to have hell as the consequences must be faced. I can not allow her to hurt anyone in the family and have no option but to call the police when she is violent or aggressive. At a loss now, all comeing tumbleing down.

I love her so much and I am understanding the Asp but she isnt there. Going to be a long road.

That COULD be AS! She may have only APPEARED to maintain friendships between say 7 and when she stopped appearing to be so. Friendships before 7 don't really count here, and may be carried forward through her life. It just has to do with the type of interaction, etc... You may simply THINK she is moody, immature, silly, unable to alter behaviour, etc... If someone kept shooting you, for example, would YOU just stand there and take it? SHE may feel the same.

You sometimes can't say or do ANYTHING to make people like you, but a few punches, ridicules, and bad words, and you can QUICKLY make them hate your guts! Maybe she is "racist" because the OTHERS ARE so bad.



You CAN'T teach tolerance. People always seem to think that can be taught. If most of the asian people there mistreat her more than others, she will likely hate them more than others. Would you look for a nice drink down the cleaner aisle of a store? Likely NOT, because YOU believe, rightly or wrongly, that only CLEANERS are there and that none are safe and tasty.



Eventually, she likely WILL seem to be more normal.



You are coloring all you see. Try talking to her.

Thank you.

D is fired up at the moment with feeling that no one understands etc etc, she is also suffering depression and unable to attend school. It has, like I said been a very very confusing time. She now has a family support worker who is trying to get her to reflect and we are talking in short snippets at the moment. She focusses on what she wants at the time. Lap top, to go out, money for clothes etc etc. What ever she wants or needs at that time is her focus and its difficult to get passed.


We are trying to get her to write down her feelings but she seems unable to tell us how she feels. When she is distressed she says her head is spinning. That she cant take anymore.

Does she like to read? This may sound like an odd suggestion but reading sci-fi, fantasy, and history and other books helped me to change my behavior to some degree and also gave me a wider vocabulary to express my own feelings when I was growing up. Video games of the role playing genre, and certain kinds of strategy games also helped me. As for her racism of asians I was treated very badly by several black students and its taken a long time for most of my prejudice to fade. There really isn't much you can do about that beyond exposing her to some of the beautiful aspects of asian culture and hope that helps her to accept them more.

What do you mean by 'Colouring what I see'?