Sudden rudeness & insolence

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Hello,

( First off: I'm Dutch, my English is ok but not perfect. )

My soon to be 7 year old son has suddenly turned from a 'normal' aspie kid into a horrible terror, to me, and only me. He's doing OK in school, has a counselor there, gets differentiated curriculum, I meet with his teacher once a week, we all do what we can and after a not so easy startof the school year, I think we're doing good now. Less fights in the playground, more clarity about what he needs to do.
At home, I follow his therapist's directions: clear language, short sentences, no suprises, calendar on the wall. I give him his time he needs on the iPad, but we also build stuff, play outdoors, have playdates.

Since a day or 10, he has suddenly become a total .
He talks back at me after every sentence, calls me names, demands stuff, hits, throws stuff, tells me he wants to kill me.
I'm baffled. He has had anger fits before, but those were clearly asperger-related, because of sensory overload, unclarity, surprises.
This behaviour seems to be nothing but rudeness, disrespect and insolence. He's perfectly nice when there's other people around, and when we're alone, he can be nice too. But as soon as one little thing bugs him -like me saying he needs to finish his OJ for example-, mayhem starts.

His therapist thinks he might think that 'I know something and is holding this information from him'. We haven't told him he has Asperger, but kept it more general. We told him we went to the psychiatrist because he got angry a lot and we didn't know what to do to help him. We were adviced not to share his diagnosis with him, but day things like 'wow, there's a lot of people here, and they all want to say hello to you, this is hard!', or 'I can see this is confusing', in order to give him the feeling it's ok to have a hard time with some situations.

So his therapist suggested we might have to have the talk after all, since she thinks this behaviour might be caused by a suspicion. I have to add he's incredibly smart, reads like a 10-year old and instinctively understands math, but has poor emotional intelligence. .
I'm having doubts about all this. He's never asked me anything about 'being different'.

Any input would be massively appreciated. I'm so tired of being yelled at, kicked, hit...

(clicky)how to deal with a violent incorrigible child

Is it possible that the stress of "behaving himself" in school is leaving him with no outlet for his frustration and stress? He has to control himself all day at school, has people watching him and is doing different stuff from the other kids and is overwhelmed, then comes home and you are "safe". He feels like he can unleash on you, which is not acceptable, but understandable. My son had serious anger issues at the new school he attended for a year. When he was rational, I explained to him that anger is like having a bunch of marbles on a shelf. If you put too many on there, they roll everywhere. Then I told him that he has to imagine he has a little drawstring bag in his head that can stretch as big as he needs it to, and to put all the anger marbles in there. Whenever he gets more marbles than he feels like the bag can hold, we will go to the park and let him run it out or give him some time alone to relax or whatever he needs. It seemed to help a lot. I used to pick him up from school after a bad day, he would start crying and say his bag was full. I would ask him what he needed, and we would go do whatever it was and he would be okay again.

Eventually, it got to be too much, and I pulled him out to homeschool, but it worked for a while. It wasn't his fault we had to leave that school, I blame the administration. My son was doing ok, but even for a tiny private school, they refused to do anything about the bully situation. Of course, the principal's son always has a free pass...

While I couldn't guess specifically whether it's a trust issue over a suspicion, I can tell you that the therapist might very well be onto something. The fact that he hasn't voiced such suspicion to you doesn't mean it isn't there - we tend not to be very good with confrontation and will often stew over things rather than disclose them.

OTOH, I'm not sure how you go about explaining High Functioning Autism to a 7 year old.

Last edited by Willard on 12 Oct 2013, 6:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I think if I were a parent, in the service of sparing any child of mine the disillusionment of discovering there is no such thing as santa claus, I would explain it all to him in the first place, thusly-

"honey, let's go outside, walk down the street with me, ok? [walking up to a stop sign] ok honey, you see this stop sign? tell me what it means, won't you? yes, you are right, it is there to tell people they have to stop, look both ways before crossing the street. it is a SYMBOL for that. a SYMBOL is a thing that means something bigger or greater. the stop sign means something more complicated and SANTA CLAUS is ALSO a symbol, for something bigger and greater! you know how at holidaytime, people are nicer and things are happy and pretty and there's all this pretty paper and decorations and colorful lights and gifts of the season and pretty music and such? well, santa claus is a big fat SYMBOL of all that goodness. so YES! the symbol santa claus exists! santa (and all the big fat white-bearded people dressed in red) is a REAL symbol for all the happiness and goodness you see in this and every holiday season."

granted, this does not compare to what beautiful prose that newsman Francis Pharcellus Church wrote to Virginia O'Hanlon in 1897 when she wrote the New York Sun with the question, "Is there a Santa Claus?" - but it is far more concise and tailored to the mind of a typical child.

and IMHO, if the therapist has not yet found a way to stop the violence the OP's child is inflicting upon the OP, it might be time to find a new therapist.

thanks for your feedback. Auntblabby, thanks for you Christmas story , I'll think about that.

EMTkid, the first weeks of school were like that. I could really sense his frustration being built up at school and being unleashed at home. But this behaviour is different. He's just plain rude, trying to either evoke a response (which is why I'm thinking to just ignore it, like you would with a toddler acting out) or trying to hurt me because of some kind of personal anger, or more exactly, hurt us - he's doing it to his dad too, which is a new thing.

We went to dinner last night, which is usually a breeze with him, 'cause he like to eat out, and it went horrible. He used everything he could to make it horrible. He picked out a dish I'm sure he didn't really want, only to not eat it. He was rude to his dad, shouted in the restaurant (NEVER did that before), and ended under the table where he growled at us. This clearly didn't have anything to do with school.

Willard, it might be a trust issue. When we walked back to the car, he and his dad got into a small fight over wearing his jacket. All of a sudden, he said 'there's nothing wrong with me. It's dad's fault. He's annoying'.

So I kneeled down and said 'You're right, there's nothing wrong with you. But dad is not annoying, he's asking you to put your jacket on because it's cold.'
I told his dad he should ask him what he meant by that. To me, it sounded like 'I know you guys think there's something wrong with me, and I hate you for that.' It's weird, because I've never heard him use that expression. What do you guys think about that?

Willard, I don't know how to explain Asperger to a kid either, and I would like to avoid words like 'disorder', 'autism', 'impairment' and the lot. His therapist told me she thinks it's better that she does it - I don't know about that either.
I repeatedly read it's time to tell your kid about his DX when he or she starts asking questions. That's why I'm not sure about all this.

There is a cartoon book made by a member here that is very positive yet explains pretty well many of the issues. Check it out here :

http://www.dudeimanaspie.com/2012/04/dude-im-aspie-kids-edition.html

I wouldn't be so quick to jump to this conclusion. While it may not be school per se, someone there may have said something/done something to him that has him upset.

He may very well be ready for you to talk about his diagnosis with him. The parenting index has a listing of threads on "Disclosure" http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt166142.html
There are several books mentioned in these threads directed towards helping families through this issue, hopefully some are printed in your native language. It's hard for a lot of Aspies to identify their feelings to themselves much less talk about them with someone else.

Ross Greene's suggestions come to mind as a way to start a conversation with him about why he is treating you the way he is:
"I've noticed that you have been using angry words with me lately. What's up with that?" Then see if he can verbalize anything about his feelings and why he is acting the way he is. You may have to try this several times before you get any response. If he does respond, be sure to validate his feelings or probe for more information. Try not to negate his feelings or disagree with him as that is likely to shutdown any conversation. If he says something like "You and Dad hate me!" Your typical reaction might be to say "No we don't". Instead try to understand that even if it's not true, it is how he FEELS and that needs to be acknowledged. So you could say "It must feel awful for you to think that Dad and I hate you. Can you tell me why you feel that way?".

Thanks for the feedback.

It might sounds strange, but I wish he would say something like 'you and dad hate me'; because it would give me an opening to validate his feelings and get a peek inside his emotional life. But he never shares anything that might make me understand why he's acting this way.
He'll say things like 'I'm going to cut off your head' or 'I'll throw you out the window', which is disturbing, to say the least - but even if I manage to stay calm and ask 'why?', the only response I get is 'because you're annoying and I want you to stop, and I'll keep screaming until you do'. Note that the annoying part is me asking him to put on his shoes, or finish his juice for example.

I explained - just now, actually - again, that I decide about when he needs to wear his jacket or what he needs to eat (although I only make stuff he likes), and that he gets to decide t which shirt he wants to wear, which games we play and which activities we do (if possible). I do it by the book, but it doesn't register.
It's like it's hardwired in his brain: mom or dad ask me something I don't want to do > I shout, kick and scream. Not that he gets anything out of this. I just don't understand why he does these things when the only result is that I get angry. And I do give him positive feedback and attention when he's nice.

Just now, I put on Star Wars for him, and he says he couldn't read the subtitles because they were too small. So I respond 'that's right, you should put your glasses on, I forgot'. He refuses, and I tell him again 'you need to put your glasses on when you watch TV'. (He really needs to, because otherwise it's too tiring for him and he risks getting exhausted and meltdowns are around the corner when that happens'. He starts yelling 'NO! NEVER!'; so I say 'glasses on, or no TV'. He yells again, and I turn of the TV. He pushes me over to get to the TV, I stop him, and he starts kicking. I push him away (gently) so he doesn't reach me, and then... he gives me a headbutt in the knees. I lost it. I just don't understand this any more. I got so angry - too angry, probably, but I'm human, and also slightly ASD so loud screaming really is unbearable for me. I'm tired, and scared he really is going to stab me with a kitchen knife one day.

I'm thinking about the Dx talk, but I'm also scared it will make things worse in terms of lower self esteem. No 7 year old wants to be told he's different, even if it's brought in a nice and validating way.

I remember when I was a kid, what made me angry were not rules, but rules that were not consistent across the board. And you might very well be consistent in your rules, but your rules might not be consistent with what he sees in school or in other places, even on TV shows and cartoons. He might see other kids not having to finish their juice, or put on their sneakers right away, or whatever it may be, and he may simply see you as adding too much pressure on him (being "mean") and he wants you to be "nice like everyone else." I know these inconsistencies were big problems for me as a kid, and they made me angry. They made me feel like these discrepancies were the cause of my unhappiness, and if only my parents were to be like all those other parents/teachers, then I would be happy. So I was very angry at my parents, especially my mother, who was the disciplinarian. I didn't understand her demonstration of love, only what *I* believed that love should look like from a mother, and I was angry at her for not showing me what I wanted from her. Every time she didn't act "loving" it was proof that she didn't love me! What I didn't realize, however, and have only really begun to realize, is that much of my unhappiness had to do with other factors (getting teased in school, not understanding why people didn't like me, etc.) and I wished my parents could fix all of that and be nicer to me (go easier on me) to compensate for it to just make my life a little bit easier. I also could not put two and two together that my behavior could cause them to be stressed and angry. Whenever I got the look of frustration, stress or anger, I thought, "See! She hates me!" There is obviously more going on, but unfortunately you have to do some real investigating what is going on in his head, and that might be like walking into a deep dark cave on a different planet.

Thank you so much, mikassyna, your post have brought tears to my eyes. I think you stroke a chord. It makes perfect sense.
Do you have any suggestions for the investigating what's going on in his head?
All my attempts have proven very unsuccessful. My hypothesis is that he's close to unable to understand emotions (e.g. when his psychiatrist asked him to draw emoticons -happy, sad, angry- this proved to be extremely difficult for him) and that he might be ashamed about his anger fits, knowing it's not OK to shout and kick, but not being able to stop them. He told me once 'shouting is all I can do'.

Mikassyna - your commentary is so very telling. It is like reading a scenario with dd10! You have opened my eyes and helped me understand more about my very special girl and for that I am eternally grateful. Thank you.

My dd10 knows we believe she is HFA. I told her in a very matter of fact way, along with explaining that everyones brains work differently and as such she can learn how to best use HER brain and be anything she wants, learn all she wants etc. I thought it was going to be an issue but it actually helped. She finally has a reason behind some of her feelings and behaviours. She is learning what regular triggers she has and she is learning to pre-empt them. We still get huge anger, mostly aimed at me, but we also get moments where she can acknowledge when she is being unfair (after cooling off). It is a work in progress.

Good luck, keep on trucking, the answers will come, one way or another..

Roadee, how old was she when you told her?

My goodness, I don't know what words would work to penetrate your child's walls. But I do think that if my mother did try to explain the reasons behind her actions and not just "because (she) said so", I may have been more accepting, especially if she explained how it translated into her loving me, and showed consistency in that message. I think more smiles and less stressed-out responses could have made me less anxious too. And I think being consistent in her discipline between children would have been much more effective. I was always hyperaware of what other kids were allowed to do in comparison to me. And every time I got into trouble for something my sister didn't, I immediately thought, "It's because she loves her more, and hates me."

With my son, sometimes I tell him, "I know you're mad, and you have a right to be mad, and in fact when I was a kid I would have been mad too, but you can still be mad at me AND put on your coat/eat your vegetables/etc. and I will still love you. I want you to be healthy/warm/strong/have friends and this is why I as your mommy have to insist you do this. It would be easy for me to let you do everything that could get you hurt and sick just because you want to, but then I won't be doing a very good job as your mommy. It makes me see you happy being healthy/strong/warm. Let's try this again. And you can still be angry at me later if you need to." And say it in the tone as if I'm talking about the weather.

And that's on the good days when I'm not stressed out and bouncing off the walls in reaction to him LOL

He definitely wants to feel like he's in control of his world. LOL who doesn't? But for some kids, it's like a matter of life and death.
I would start out by making suggestions, instead of saying what he needs to do.
"DS, you know I think putting your glasses on would help you see the subtitles and make it more fun for you to watch."
"How about we pause the movie and try the glasses on for one minute and if you still don't want to wear them you can take them off. But please try it just for one minute. I promise you don't have to continue if it makes it worse." And let him. I bet he will either leave them on or take them off, then put them back on later.

Thank you so much for that last sentence. I do exactly the same, but I didn't think about the tone, which is ironic, because the importance of tone is one of things I try to teach him.
What a valuable lesson that is.

Same for the glasses. I could see how suggestions would be better received than orders. I feel a bit silly for not seeing that myself.
Thank you so much for the advice!