Feels like he is existing in a fantasy world...

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ellemenope
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26 Mar 2015, 5:01 am

As my son gets older, more and more, I feel like he is mainly existing in a fantasy world and only visiting the rest of us in reality. His fantasy world is a mash-up of things- mostly from his favourite books, some TV, some characters from games, and some things he has imagined and held on to for a long time. It's concerning sometimes, and other times I feel like it isn't that "abnormal".
I remember how as a kid, I would become extremely absorbed in books and book series. Sometimes everything felt like an interruption of the stories I was reading- I would be completely immersed in the worlds in my books. Things like school, family obligations/interactions like dinner time etc. were like breaks from that reality. I would even dream about the books I was reading instead of dreaming about things based on my real life. I can still get like that now occasionally with books- but obviously with a family and other adult obligations, it's not nearly the same.

I see this happening with my son, but maybe to a greater degree and extent. Should I be concerned?

We've seen so much improvement in his communication with us- when he chooses (and when we need him to or push him to) to he can really interact with us in a pretty normal way. I'm not sure we are as interesting and compelling as whatever exists in his imaginary/fantasy world though. Actually, I'm sure we are NOT. He prefers to talk about all these characters and happenings in this other reality...and I guess I can understand that it's all a lot more interesting to him. It really is like he exists in this other realm.
I'm not sure what typical or NT 4 year olds talk about most of the time with their parents or friends. I have interacted with some on the playground and other situations and they are pretty different - LOL. Not so dreamy or off in space. But what do 4 year olds really have to talk about? I don't know...
Sometimes I get really worried about this, then other times I think it's not a problem and I can see so many good things about it. He is growing into a really great artist and he has great compassion for animals and such a unique take on things. And we do really well in involving ourselves in his current interests and fantasies and keep up to date with it all and it's obvious that this is one reason why we have always maintained a great relationship with him. I don't want to force him away from what makes him happy. But I do worry...

Sorry if I'm rambling. We had a rough night with sleep (or no sleep).
But has anyone had experience with this kind of thing?



MjrMajorMajor
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26 Mar 2015, 6:00 am

I don't have any proper recommendations for you, but my son was similar. His world was Pokemon and dinosaurs for a decade or so.

He has learned more balance as he matured. He slowly learned to focus on chores/schoolwork etc. That doesn't mean he didn't incorporate his interests into them, but it was okay if it was in the boundaries of what he needed to do. He now still enjoys his interests, but they don't completely monopolize him like when he was little.

Good luck to you! I guess I wouldn't push "normal" behavior, but introduce balance slowly through social interactions, small daily chores, and other ways you feel are age appropriate. :)



Ettina
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26 Mar 2015, 8:12 am

Maybe I'm missing something, but I'm not exactly sure what you're worried about. Can you give us some specifics of what concerns you about his fantasy life?



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26 Mar 2015, 9:00 am

From infanthood to about 3, I would have phrased it not so much living in a fantasy world, as living in his own world. To me these things are very different. A fantasy world in my mind implies not being able to tell the difference between reality and fantasy when you are in a range of developmental ages where that distinction should be clear.

Living in ones own world (in the autistic sense) is more like having a bubble around you where your thoughts/wants/needs matter and other people's mostly don't. It felt like I was visiting that bubble-world when i would interact with him.

At 3, it started to feel like he would also visit the larger world, and the percentages of time in our world increased over time. I don't know what the percentage was at your son's age because I do not remember that precisely, but maybe it was half and half, maybe lower.

Today, it feels like he is in our world, but goes off on tangents onto his own stuff fairly often.

I don't know if this is relevant/helpful to you or not but I thought I would put it out there.



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26 Mar 2015, 9:19 am

6-12, I chose to spend my time either in imaginary worlds of my own design or from books or films, or in science.

The deep patterns of the universe were beautiful to me and their reliability and duration was soothing in the face of the chaos of the human world.

The stories I loved to escape into, Tolkein's Middle Earth or Larry Niven's Known Space, for example--had aspects of the chaos of the human world, but in a much safer way.

If I had not let my imagination pour through those stories and spent a lot of time imaginatively inhabiting those worlds, I don't think I would have been able to make an attempt to break out of my isolation and join life. Those sanctuaries were really good for me.



ASDMommyASDKid
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26 Mar 2015, 9:32 am

Adamantium wrote:
6-12, I chose to spend my time either in imaginary worlds of my own design or from books or films, or in science.

The deep patterns of the universe were beautiful to me and their reliability and duration was soothing in the face of the chaos of the human world.

The stories I loved to escape into, Tolkein's Middle Earth or Larry Niven's Known Space, for example--had aspects of the chaos of the human world, but in a much safer way.

If I had not let my imagination pour through those stories and spent a lot of time imaginatively inhabiting those worlds, I don't think I would have been able to make an attempt to break out of my isolation and join life. Those sanctuaries were really good for me.


I did similar things, but I kept most of it in my head. My son does not have that filter partially because his social skills are not good enough to know he "ought to" and honestly because we don't tell him he needs to filter it.

I think because of similar reasons, a lot of autistic kids look more unusual than they are because parents and others of autistic kids see the proverbial sausage being made. Most parents don't deal with a lot of this because solitary, imaginary time is more private.

I bet NT kids do this a lot, too. Also when they pretend play with each other, as super heroes, or whatever, NT kids do these days, no one thinks it is weird because it is social. Then it is positive imaginary play. Things done in solitude are looked upon much differently, I think.

This is not a commentary on the OP's concerns, so I hope it is not construed this way. It is more of a comment on what society views as normal, if that makes sense.



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26 Mar 2015, 11:35 am

ASDMommyASDKid wrote:
Things done in solitude are looked upon much differently, I think.

This is not a commentary on the OP's concerns, so I hope it is not construed this way. It is more of a comment on what society views as normal, if that makes sense.


Yes to all that. But if you have no friends, things are going to be done in solitude! I certainly didn't mean that as a commentary on the OPs concerns either, but just wanted to put in a good word for the value of living in fantasy worlds.

If you do it well enough for long enough that you can describe what you see to others, you might have a future as a writer.

Also, am I correct in thinking the OP's son is 4 years old? If so, spending a lot of time in fantasy would not be unusual would it? Or is it question of knowing the difference between fantasy and reality? I was never remotely confused about that.



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26 Mar 2015, 1:07 pm

I am gathering that the OP is concerned that the fantasy world is taking precedence over social interaction, to the point that the child doesn't interact with other people unless prompted to do so. (Is that right?) Imaginary friends and a fantasy world are normal at this age, but generally as a substitute when friends aren't available (or, I suppose, when there's conflict,) not as a preferred option.

I think it's cause for concern in one way: typically develping four-year-olds want to play with other kids. It's also a time when nobody has good social skills, so there's also a way in which an atypically developing child may have an easier time picking up social interaction with a lot of scaffolding.

That said, I was this kid, and I am mostly OK. For me, girls were too mean, boys were too rough and it was just easier to populate an inner world with people I could understand. For DS, his imaginary friends are kind of a "social laboratory" where he can work stuff out in sort of third-person.

DS was pretty social at this age and mostly successful at it (or I should say was either very successful or not successful at all depending on the circumstances,) so I don't have good advice for a toddler. However, as a teen we are now seeing this behavior again because it is exhausting for him to navigate conflict with his friend. We try to troubleshoot problems and gently nudge him...but I also recognize some of the isolation is just a way of gathering his "social energy" for when he really needs it.



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26 Mar 2015, 1:24 pm

His behavior is completely typical of an autistic child and you cannot fundamentally change it. He will always be more content with his own company and find socializing awkward and taxing. That's the way his brain is wired and trying to push him to be something he isn't will only make both of you frustrated and unhappy. What's puzzling is, you indicate that you were pretty much the same way as a child (probably more so than you remember), so what's to get alarmed about?

Sounds like the boy has a healthy creative imagination. That's something to be encouraged.


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ellemenope
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27 Mar 2015, 7:20 am

will@rd wrote:
His behavior is completely typical of an autistic child and you cannot fundamentally change it. He will always be more content with his own company and find socializing awkward and taxing. That's the way his brain is wired and trying to push him to be something he isn't will only make both of you frustrated and unhappy. What's puzzling is, you indicate that you were pretty much the same way as a child (probably more so than you remember), so what's to get alarmed about?

Sounds like the boy has a healthy creative imagination. That's something to be encouraged.


I wouldn't say I'm "alarmed"- occasionally concerned and unsure. I'm not looking to fundamentally change him or his behaviour. I don't actually know that his behaviour is completely typical of an autistic child- that's why I'm asking about it here. There is so much information and guidance out there for parents of NT children but not so for parents of children with ASD- as a first-time parent of a child with ASD (and having little support as I do), it's actually really difficult to know what's typical and healthy for my child and when to worry and when not to.

I do understand his behaviour somewhat, and I was similar as a child. But not quite the same to the extent and degree of aloofness and dreaminess as my son.
I do everything I can to encourage his creativity and imagination.



ellemenope
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27 Mar 2015, 7:29 am

ASDMommyASDKid wrote:

I did similar things, but I kept most of it in my head. My son does not have that filter partially because his social skills are not good enough to know he "ought to" and honestly because we don't tell him he needs to filter it.

I think because of similar reasons, a lot of autistic kids look more unusual than they are because parents and others of autistic kids see the proverbial sausage being made. Most parents don't deal with a lot of this because solitary, imaginary time is more private.

I bet NT kids do this a lot, too. Also when they pretend play with each other, as super heroes, or whatever, NT kids do these days, no one thinks it is weird because it is social. Then it is positive imaginary play. Things done in solitude are looked upon much differently, I think.

This is not a commentary on the OP's concerns, so I hope it is not construed this way. It is more of a comment on what society views as normal, if that makes sense.


Thanks. This is making sense to me. I think we are seeing a big lack of the filter you speak of. And now that I am thinking more about it, perhaps also he doesn't understand that we are also not sharing his same experience in his fantasy world.
I think this is a big part of it.

I don't think he doesn't know the difference between fantasy and reality, I think he might think that we understand and think about it and experience it along WITH him (and to some extent we do understand what he's talking about because we try really hard to). So when he talks to us, everything is kind of all mixed together as if we understand it too- his stories and characters are mixed with things in our real life when he is interacting and communicating with us... Does that make sense?
I guess it's the way he jumbles it all up when he's talking to us that is concerning... but I don't think he cannot differentiate fantasy from reality.

His play is mostly solitary imaginary play, although he does involve his sister occasionally and will join in simple playground games with other kids without communicating much with them (chase/tag, hide and seek).



ellemenope
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27 Mar 2015, 7:32 am

momsparky wrote:
I am gathering that the OP is concerned that the fantasy world is taking precedence over social interaction, to the point that the child doesn't interact with other people unless prompted to do so. (Is that right?) Imaginary friends and a fantasy world are normal at this age, but generally as a substitute when friends aren't available (or, I suppose, when there's conflict,) not as a preferred option.

I think it's cause for concern in one way: typically develping four-year-olds want to play with other kids. It's also a time when nobody has good social skills, so there's also a way in which an atypically developing child may have an easier time picking up social interaction with a lot of scaffolding.
I have noticed this too. I think DS is having an easier time interacting/playing with 2-4 yr olds than he will have with kids as he grows older. It's nice because his sister is almost 3 yrs younger- in some ways, they are the perfect playmates.

That said, I was this kid, and I am mostly OK. For me, girls were too mean, boys were too rough and it was just easier to populate an inner world with people I could understand. For DS, his imaginary friends are kind of a "social laboratory" where he can work stuff out in sort of third-person.
Mostly ok is what we are aiming for. LOL.

DS was pretty social at this age and mostly successful at it (or I should say was either very successful or not successful at all depending on the circumstances,) so I don't have good advice for a toddler. However, as a teen we are now seeing this behavior again because it is exhausting for him to navigate conflict with his friend. We try to troubleshoot problems and gently nudge him...but I also recognize some of the isolation is just a way of gathering his "social energy" for when he really needs it.


Thanks for your input.



ellemenope
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27 Mar 2015, 7:35 am

Adamantium wrote:
6-12, I chose to spend my time either in imaginary worlds of my own design or from books or films, or in science.

The deep patterns of the universe were beautiful to me and their reliability and duration was soothing in the face of the chaos of the human world.
I see my son appreciating things in this way- art and science, books are his safe place. It makes me happy that it makes him happy.

The stories I loved to escape into, Tolkein's Middle Earth or Larry Niven's Known Space, for example--had aspects of the chaos of the human world, but in a much safer way.
We really, really, REALLY, cannot wait for him to read Tolkien...

If I had not let my imagination pour through those stories and spent a lot of time imaginatively inhabiting those worlds, I don't think I would have been able to make an attempt to break out of my isolation and join life. Those sanctuaries were really good for me.


Thanks, this is informative and comforting to know.



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27 Mar 2015, 7:55 pm

ellemenope wrote:
I have noticed this too. I think DS is having an easier time interacting/playing with 2-4 yr olds than he will have with kids as he grows older. It's nice because his sister is almost 3 yrs younger- in some ways, they are the perfect playmates.

This is actually a real intervention: unfortunately it doesn't work for DS, but several social workers have asked us if we can pair him with a kid a couple years younger. Good for you for fostering it! The key with social skills is that they need to learn them, but they have a different pace - not respecting their pace and rhythm of learning is where a lot of the stress kids on the spectrum comes from.



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28 Mar 2015, 1:10 am

Read Parenting Your Aspergers Child by Alan Sohn. He has a whole section about kids who are mainly in fantasy land, though the book is mainly about school age children so the suggestions won't be helpful for a few years. Aspergers and Young Children is a good one for the preschool years.

My son had very little interest in other kids at age 4. It has slowly developed over the last 5 years, and now he has real friends and play dates and even plays with the neighborhood kids. I tried very hard to set up play dates in the early years, but all efforts flopped. If I could have seen then how he would grow socially on his own schedule, I would have worried a lot less.



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28 Mar 2015, 2:24 am

ellemenope wrote:
ASDMommyASDKid wrote:

I did similar things, but I kept most of it in my head. My son does not have that filter partially because his social skills are not good enough to know he "ought to" and honestly because we don't tell him he needs to filter it.

I think because of similar reasons, a lot of autistic kids look more unusual than they are because parents and others of autistic kids see the proverbial sausage being made. Most parents don't deal with a lot of this because solitary, imaginary time is more private.

I bet NT kids do this a lot, too. Also when they pretend play with each other, as super heroes, or whatever, NT kids do these days, no one thinks it is weird because it is social. Then it is positive imaginary play. Things done in solitude are looked upon much differently, I think.

I will say this, when I was a child I tended to play the same weird thing for awhile, where my son does flit between things more than I did. Back when he was you son's age this was more pronounced. I think in the case of my son it is because he has ADD characteristics (though not a diagnosis.) Also, I have noticed that his organizational flow in his fictional work, as a nine year old, reflects this disjointed imagination. I don't think it is a bad thing per se, but if a regular teacher were grading his work, I don't think she would agree with this writing style.

I work on it in that context---what the reader expects vs. interfering with his play style excessively. I experiment with trying to keep him in one play mode at a time, when he is interacting -- with me-- to teach what others expect, but his solitary play is his, and I leave it alone.




This is not a commentary on the OP's concerns, so I hope it is not construed this way. It is more of a comment on what society views as normal, if that makes sense.


Thanks. This is making sense to me. I think we are seeing a big lack of the filter you speak of. And now that I am thinking more about it, perhaps also he doesn't understand that we are also not sharing his same experience in his fantasy world.
I think this is a big part of it.

I don't think he doesn't know the difference between fantasy and reality, I think he might think that we understand and think about it and experience it along WITH him (and to some extent we do understand what he's talking about because we try really hard to). So when he talks to us, everything is kind of all mixed together as if we understand it too- his stories and characters are mixed with things in our real life when he is interacting and communicating with us... Does that make sense?
I guess it's the way he jumbles it all up when he's talking to us that is concerning... but I don't think he cannot differentiate fantasy from reality.

His play is mostly solitary imaginary play, although he does involve his sister occasionally and will join in simple playground games with other kids without communicating much with them (chase/tag, hide and seek).