Truth about Israel-Palestine conflict

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ruveyn
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04 Dec 2012, 8:00 am

thomas81 wrote:

and that is coming from one of the irgun thugs who ruveyn admires so much.

.

The "Irgun Thug" was speaking the truth. And any American will tell you he is not giving it back to the Indians.

White-eyes come in great canoe with wings. White eyes screw the people over. That is American history in a nutshell.

Eventually you will get used to the plain fact that might often makes right.

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Tequila
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04 Dec 2012, 9:56 am

ruveyn wrote:

thomas81 wrote:

and that is coming from one of the irgun thugs who ruveyn admires so much.

.

Just as the descendants of European colonists aren't about to give South America back to the original natives (who they often massacred and in some cases complstely wiped out), nor will the Australians hand over the country to the native Aboriginals, nor will the Muslim invaders hand back the lands they have conquered, nor will the Russians hand back old Königsberg or Karelia. Times (and people) simply move on.

visagrunt
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04 Dec 2012, 12:44 pm

thomas81 wrote:

If at the time it had no army or militia of any quantity, it was hardly in a position to engage in conflict. It was pacifist by default.

That is, without question, one of the least credible statements I have ever heard about the conflict in Gaza.

If Hamas had no army or militia of any quantity, then where were the rockets coming from? Or do you deny the existence of the rockets? Palestinians' capacity to cause destruction may be significantly less than the Israelis, but no where in that power imbalance can the Palestinians remotely be called pacifist.

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I would recommend watching the entire video, before you leap to that conclusion.

It is no leap, I assure you. And never forget that the blockade of Gaza is not a unilateral Israeli action. Egypt maintains the blockade, as well, and she does so with the support of most of the Arab League who are far more interested in seeing Fatah successfully accomplish Palestinian statehood rather than Hamas.

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Tequila
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04 Dec 2012, 1:13 pm

Exactly. The Arab countries aren't really genuinely interested in the welfare of the 'Palestinians'. They're just a stick to bash Israel with, that's all. Look at how neithet Egypt nor Jordan wants the headache of having to put up with them, their self-destructive behaviour, their general criminality or their violence. Anyway, t'Egypt has problems of its own, what with the fascistic Muslim Brotherhood paying gangs of thugs to rape women and kick the living crap out of the growing number of protesters wanting a secular, civilised country.

Honestly, the Poor Palestinians could have a state by 8am tomorrow morning if they stop killling Jews and calling for an end to Israel/Jewry in the Middle East.

visagrunt
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04 Dec 2012, 1:41 pm

Tequila wrote:

Well, in fairness, they would have to settle for the loss of East Jerusalem and half-a-loaf as far as the agricultural land on the West Bank is concerned. But Fatah and Israel were very close on a land package when negotiations broke off the last time, and there's no reason to believe that they couldn't pick that up again.

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04 Dec 2012, 5:51 pm

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6b_0tru1DY[/youtube]If Israel gave their land to palistine they would just use it to attack Israel.[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWJFC98jPrQ[/youtube]

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thomas81
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04 Dec 2012, 6:56 pm

visagrunt wrote:

thomas81 wrote:

If at the time it had no army or militia of any quantity, it was hardly in a position to engage in conflict. It was pacifist by default.

I can deduce from that you didnt bother to watch the video. Im referring specifically to Palestine circa 1946-1948 when Ruveyn's heros took it upon themselves to attack an unarmed population.

The rockets came later after decades of Israeli antagonism.

visagrunt wrote:

Egypt does what it is told, lest it face the wrath of US/Israel.

thomas81
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04 Dec 2012, 7:00 pm

Tequila wrote:

Honestly, the Poor Palestinians could have a state by 8am tomorrow morning if they stop killling Jews and calling for an end to Israel/Jewry in the Middle East.

They could probably have a labour camp completely subjucated and complicit to the interest of Israeli economics and state interests, yes. A fully functional geographically contiguous country with a gaza-west bank landbridge with equal and fair access to arable farmland, utilities and seaports, well that I am less convinced about.

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04 Dec 2012, 9:24 pm

John_Browning wrote:

You overlook that Israel does not react that way every single time a rocket is fired at them. Unless the religion of peace is launching massive volleys, like they were doing recently, Israel tends to put up with it a little before taking action...far more so than the US if rockets got fired into our borders.

Some of the Palestinians are Christian.

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Inuyasha
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04 Dec 2012, 10:55 pm

thomas81 wrote:

Tequila wrote:

Honestly, the Poor Palestinians could have a state by 8am tomorrow morning if they stop killling Jews and calling for an end to Israel/Jewry in the Middle East.

You seriously need to stop believing the anti-Israel propaganda... The Israelis have no interest in creating labour camps and never have had an interest in them. Quite frankly, if the Palestinians would stop with their attacks, they would actually end up with a state. I don't think a land bridge between Gaza and West Bank would happen. I honestly think Egypt and Jordan should be the ones giving up a small stretch of land for that, would take longer but it wouldn't split Israel in two.

Let's be realistic here folks, the Israelis could have wiped out the Palestinians at any time, if they didn't care how many Palestinians they killed they actually would be spending a lot less money on munitions instead of on the significantly more expensive guided munitions. The Israelis have practiced more restraint than just about any other country in the world.

xenon13
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05 Dec 2012, 1:45 am

Inuyasha wrote:

thomas81 wrote:

Tequila wrote:

Honestly, the Poor Palestinians could have a state by 8am tomorrow morning if they stop killling Jews and calling for an end to Israel/Jewry in the Middle East.

Here we go again, the old "We could have wiped you all out years ago, therefore we are Good and Pure, and Love us!" The hard core Israel worshippers always use that one and supporters of the US empire also. By the way, how often has the "we could have killed you all if we wanted to" line been used by alien invaders in movies about such.

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05 Dec 2012, 1:48 pm

xenon13 wrote:

Israel became a country in 1948 out of guilt and shame, the international community felt horrified about the holocaust and Europeans felt guilty for their country's complicity in the holocaust and couldn't stand looking at Jews because they were a constant reminder of the crime of the holocaust. To be perfectly blunt, the Jewish people whom were victims of the holocaust didn't want anything to do with Europeans or even the United States after what all they had gone through.

One could argue the international community sent the Jewish people to what is now Israel in order to try to deal with their own guilty conscious...

DarthMetaKnight
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05 Dec 2012, 1:51 pm

There will always be a few Palestinians who will want all of Israel back, even if a two-state solution is achieved.

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Tequila
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05 Dec 2012, 7:22 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

There will always be a few Palestinians who will want all of Israel back, even if a two-state solution is achieved.

By "a few Palestinians" you mean most of them don't you.

thomas81
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05 Dec 2012, 7:52 pm

In my view the only solution is a single state solution with dual sovereignty, 'Israstine' as Gadaffi called it.

I have even designed a flag.

AspieOtaku
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05 Dec 2012, 8:10 pm

thomas81 wrote:

In my view the only solution is a single state solution with dual sovereignty, 'Israstine' as Gadaffi called it.

I have even designed a flag.

I know it may sound stupid but in my opinion it should be like 1 nation 2 systems like how Hong Kong is with Mainland China.

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