You may be a Communist if . . .

Post Reply New Topic

You know you've been brainwashed when you just handwave all the ways an economic model doesn't work in order to declare that it's been actually working just swell the entire time.

I don't think Fnord will recover from that one.

This is one of the more smug things about Strawman capitalists.

If it seems like capitalism isn't working, then actually capitalism IS working. Capitalism can "work" or "not work" as much as it wants, because it is (supposedly) the natural order of things. To the capitalist, capitalism is the natural state of things and always has been. Nevermind that this very specific economic model has only existed a few hundred years in only a select few places on Earth.

To this kind of capitalist, criticizing capitalism is like criticizing the fact that rivers flow downstream, or the fact that my head gets wet when it rains. Lol it's like the capitalist experiences almost no rain in their life, and acts like people who suggest building roofs are naïve opponents of the natural order of things.

This makes arguing whether capitalism has "worked" meaningless. To this sort of capitalist, capitalism couldn't fail except by ceasing to be capitalism.

Yet for all the claims the system is "natural", the capitalist rarely explains why people are so naturally drawn to egalitarianism and why capitalism is dependent on state enforcement of property laws to continue existing. Extensive effort by the state and businesses is necessary to convince the population that capitalism is good and socialism is bad. Capitalism does not do well in the marketplace of ideas without the state and businesses putting their thumb on the scale.

What, you seriously think capitalism would be as popular as it is without the capitalist state looming overhead threatening ostracism and violence on those who question it? Here I thought I was supposed to be the head-in-the-sand idealist.

Capitalism as it exists is a sort of economic Calvinism. "The distribution of wealth is this, therefore it should be this." "If this has happened, it is because of natural law. Going against natural law is foolish if not perverse."
Just replace "natural law" or "the hand of the market" with "the will of God" and you have the same puritanical theology that people used and still use to say "That beggar is poor because God wants him to be poor". The issue is we live in a secular society, and capitalism began to be intellectually formulated in the Enlightenment against a backdrop of increasing atheism in academic thought. So where once they would put "divine will" they now put "natural law".

The capitalist has replaced his God with Πλοῦτος--Wealth. Wealth hath ordained that you enjoy His blessing less than that man in the large house on the hill. Who are you to question the Lord, our God: Wealth? Work harder and Lord Wealth will bestow His divine Providence upon thee. Just as the Puritan looked on the sinful--so too does the capitalist look on the impoverished. Poverty to the capitalist then is a necessary result of the Sin of Sloth. If you are poor, you must Deserve It, because you are a Sinner.

Still eagerly awaiting the capitalist rebuttal to this line of argument that I have been waiting decades to hear addressed. I don't even think it's a perfect argument, but then capitalists always fail to reply.

Yeah, Communists are like that.

While Capitalism, as an economic system, may not work "just swell" all the time (Re: 1929-11-24), it has been demonstrated to be much more robust than any economic system based on one man's fantasy of a command-based economy (Re: 1992-04-27).

There is nothing to 'recover' from.  As stated...

Check the dates, especially that last one; it designates a fall from which the principals never recovered.

Any time one person (or a small group of people) own the means of production, and puts other people to work on that "production line", there is Capitalism.

Fields of grain are the means of production.  So are slaves.  If one person 'owns' the fields and slaves, it is Capitalism.

And slavery goes back thousands of years.

Again, Capitalism may not be THE most perfect economic system there is, but it is the most persistent, thus the most successful.

"The most successful"...until it isn't. Capitalism can create problems that itself cannot solve.

I know we're stereotyped as lacking self-awareness, but jeesh. Of course it's the other people who do that. You didn't literally follow-up with a bunch of handwaving or anything.

Fnord didn't see my reply, sad.

Again -- and I cannot emphasize this enough -- Capitalism is an economic system.  It is not a system of charity, education, governance, justice, law, or warfare.  It serves only to enrich those who own the means of production, without requiring them to take part in that production.

You want solutions to problems?  Put the philosophers to the task.  That's what they earn those degrees for.

Sure, and I am stereotyping Communists.  So what?  It's easy to do, in light of their history.  Keep in mind that there are easily only three broad forms of Communist:

• "True" Communists as proposed by Marx and Engels cannot exist due to human nature (e.g., envy, gluttony, greed, lust, pride, sloth, and wrath).

• "Real" Communists are actually State Socialists currently living in Feudal Empires (e.g., China, Cuba, Laos, North Korea, and Vietnam).

• "Faux" Communists (a.k.a., "Hypocrites", "Poseurs", and "Tankies") are those who preach Communism while enjoying all the benefits of living in Capitalist societies.  Encountered anyone like that lately?

!	Cornflake wrote:
	Thread truncated and locked by request of the OP.