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leejosepho
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16 Apr 2011, 8:39 am

Bethie wrote:
No, you don't make up your own doctrine.

You follow a doctrine someone ELSE made up.

That is true, all-white ...

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Doctrine (Latin: doctrina) is a codification of beliefs or a body of teachings or instructions, taught principles or positions, as the body of teachings in a branch of knowledge or belief system. The Greek analogy is the etymology of catechism.

Often doctrine specifically connotes a corpus of religious dogma as it is promulgated by a church, but not necessarily:
doctrine is also used to refer to a principle of law, in the common law traditions, established through a history of past decisions, such as the doctrine of self-defense, or the principle of fair use, or the more narrowly applicable first-sale doctrine. In some organizations, doctrine is simply defined as "that which is taught", in other words the basis for institutional teaching of its personnel internal ways of doing business.

You may agree with things you have been taught, and some of them might be correct ... yet they all came from men.


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all_white
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16 Apr 2011, 8:49 am

MCalavera, I have studied my Christian faith extensively, and, though I by no means have a perfect knowledge, it is most amusing to hear such comments coming from people who need to heed their own advice. ;)

How could he have been perfect in Christ? Christ had not yet died nor risen nor been revealed to his people as the Messiah nor had his Holy Spirit been shed abroad to make perfect the hearts of his elect via the new birth. The means of forgiveness under the old covenant was burnt offerings, as a foreshadowing of the sacrifice that was yet to come: Jesus. :)



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16 Apr 2011, 8:52 am

all_white wrote:
MCalavera, I have studied my Christian faith extensively, and, though I by no means have a perfect knowledge, it is most amusing to hear such comments coming from people who need to heed their own advice. ;)

How could he have been perfect in Christ? Christ had not yet died nor risen nor been revealed to his people as the Messiah nor had his Holy Spirit been shed abroad to make perfect the hearts of his elect via the new birth. The means of forgiveness under the old covenant was burnt offerings, as a foreshadowing of the sacrifice that was yet to come: Jesus. :)


Obviously, you didn't read the part in the Epistles where it says that the OT saints looked forward to Christ. 8)

Consult your Calvinist apologists or something. :lol:



leejosepho
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16 Apr 2011, 8:53 am

all_white wrote:
I wasn't being smug. I was laughing at how you're so eager to storm in and lay into me ...

You have grossly mis-perceived on both counts.


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leejosepho
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16 Apr 2011, 9:11 am

Fuzzy wrote:
The more that [people] disagree what god is, what he wants, what faith is, the less likely that any one person is correct, or that any person at all can be correct about it.

Not true. Where one or more could be getting further away from actual truth, one or more others could be getting closer.


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16 Apr 2011, 9:16 am

leejosepho wrote:
You may agree with things you have been taught, and some of them might be correct ... yet they all came from men.


I do not agree with catechisms and I am not a member of any form of organised religion and I do not profess to be a Calvinist. I do believe that Calvin summarised key biblical doctrine that the church had sadly drifted away from, but it was already there staring people in the face in the first place - from out of the bible. Believing the doctrine that Calvin pointed out that Christ had taught does not make one a "Calvinist" any more than it makes one a Paulian. It just makes one a Christian, because the doctrine originated from Christ, and he was the one who taught it to Paul and Calvin, and he was also the one who taught it to me. ;)

I am the only one who knows who has or hasn't taught me so I don't think you are in any position to judge where my belief system came from. I am not a member of any cult. I am merely a Christian, and as such, I am taught by God.

This may sound like a great claim to make, but it is in fact the norm for every Christian. It is the privilege of every child of God as soon as he takes them under his care to have the Author of the bible itself explain what lies therein:

"But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him."

MCalavera, I assure you I did read the Epistles, and remember the verse of which you speak. It does not, however, state that they looked forward to Christ knowingly. It was not revealed to the Jews in what form Christ was going to come and redeem them, until he actually came. In the Espistles Paul frequently refers to it as a "mystery" that he had been entrusted with to preach, and that, until that time, none had known about. :wink:

And now, since I don't have time to patiently explain the bible to you verse by verse, and I am sure you are about to tear apart each sentence on this post (as you have done with all my others) and start throwing nonsense at God's word (as you have done with all the others) I think I will bow out and leave you to jabber away amongst yourselves about what the bible doesn't say, and wait for your next victim.

Have a nice day! :D



JakobVirgil
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16 Apr 2011, 9:21 am

all_white wrote:
leejosepho wrote:
You may agree with things you have been taught, and some of them might be correct ... yet they all came from men.


I do not agree with catechisms and I am not a member of any form of organised religion and I do not profess to be a Calvinist. I do believe that Calvin summarised key biblical doctrine that the church had sadly drifted away from, but it was already there staring people in the face in the first place - from out of the bible. Believing the doctrine that Calvin pointed out that Christ had taught does not make one a "Calvinist" any more than it makes one a Paulian. It just makes one a Christian, because the doctrine originated from Christ, and he was the one who taught it to Paul and Calvin, and he was also the one who taught it to me. ;)

I am the only one who knows who has or hasn't taught me so I don't think you are in any position to judge where my belief system came from. I am not a member of any cult. I am merely a Christian, and as such, I am taught by God.

This may sound like a great claim to make, but it is in fact the norm for every Christian. It is the privilege of every child of God as soon as he takes them under his care to have the Author of the bible itself explain what lies therein:

"But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him."

MCalavera, I assure you I did read the Epistles, and remember the verse of which you speak. It does not, however, state that they looked forward to Christ knowingly. It was not revealed to the Jews in what form Christ was going to come and redeem them, until he actually came. In the Espistles Paul frequently refers to it as a "mystery" that he had been entrusted with to preach, and that, until that time, none had known about. :wink:

And now, since I don't have time to patiently explain the bible to you verse by verse, and I am sure you are about to tear apart each sentence on this post (as you have done with all my others) and start throwing nonsense at God's word (as you have done with all the others) I think I will bow out and leave you to jabber away amongst yourselves about what the bible doesn't say, and wait for your next victim.

Have a nice day! :D


to be questioned = to be victimized?


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leejosepho
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16 Apr 2011, 9:23 am

all_white wrote:
I am the only one who knows who has or hasn't taught me so I don't think you are in any position to judge where my belief system came from.

Who has taught you is/was not the question, and I am not judging anything. Like you say in whatever words, I am merely reporting: Calvin or anyone else either might or might not be correct, but the teachings of men are still teachings of men.


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16 Apr 2011, 9:24 am

Fuzzy wrote:
You shouldnt see Branch Davidians splitting off, nor Mormonism.


There are divisions of groups that have split off from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints since 1830. I know a good dealt about the Church's history as I am an less active member of the church.



leejosepho
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16 Apr 2011, 9:31 am

all_white wrote:
This may sound like a great claim to make, but it is in fact the norm for every Christian. It is the privilege of every child of God as soon as he takes them under his care to have the Author of the bible itself explain what lies therein:

"But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him."

That is where Fuzzy makes a great point: The more that is practiced within Christianity, the more sects or denominizations there are ... kind of like each man doing what seems right in his own mind.

Paul addressed that matter: "... be transformed by the renewing of your [one body] mind, so that you [all collectively-as-one] prove what is that [unified] good and well-pleasing and perfect desire of Elohim."
(Romans 12:2, ISR)


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18 Apr 2011, 12:42 am

Jesus' sacrifice memorialized by Jehovah's Witnesses tonight. A review.

If you were able to attend I hope the service helped you understand a little more about Witnesses and why this event is so important for us.

And in other news, The Mercury News asks Why is there an Easter Bunny? "People say 'pagan' as if it were pejorative but it's not. That's the beauty of Catholicism. In the long trajectory of history, we pick up a little of this and a little of that," says Janet Giddings, professor of theology at Santa Clara University. "We go to church, and the celebration of Christ's resurrection is at the center of our holiday, and then we go home and hunt for chocolate eggs. There's no conflict there. It's all about the wonder of spring, life is a gift, and all of it points to God."

John 4:24 reads "God is a Spirit, and those worshiping him must worship with spirit and truth." For our worship to be acceptable to God, it must conform to the truth revealed in the pages of the Bible and it must be guided by the holy spirit. Picking up Pagan customs and presenting it as a scriptural doctrine is not truthful.


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18 Apr 2011, 7:01 am

kxmode wrote:
Jesus' sacrifice memorialized by Jehovah's Witnesses tonight. A review.

If you were able to attend I hope the service helped you understand a little more about Witnesses and why this event is so important for us.

And in other news, The Mercury News asks Why is there an Easter Bunny? "People say 'pagan' as if it were pejorative but it's not. That's the beauty of Catholicism. In the long trajectory of history, we pick up a little of this and a little of that," says Janet Giddings, professor of theology at Santa Clara University. "We go to church, and the celebration of Christ's resurrection is at the center of our holiday, and then we go home and hunt for chocolate eggs. There's no conflict there. It's all about the wonder of spring, life is a gift, and all of it points to God."

John 4:24 reads "God is a Spirit, and those worshiping him must worship with spirit and truth." For our worship to be acceptable to God, it must conform to the truth revealed in the pages of the Bible and it must be guided by the holy spirit. Picking up Pagan customs and presenting it as a scriptural doctrine is not truthful.


There is nothing wrong with celebrating Easter, mate.

Look what religion is doing to you. It's making you demonize practices that are really basically harmless (except to some people's personal beliefs) and giving you license to be arrogant and feel superior to other people.

Are you happy being like that, kxmode?



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18 Apr 2011, 7:40 am

Truth has nothing to do with what's on the bible anyway.

I guess Jehova Witnesses are the boring Christian sect. They don't celebrate easter, they don't celebrate Christmas, ...

Worse, they have to spend those holidays trying to get people to stop having fun.


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Last edited by Vexcalibur on 18 Apr 2011, 7:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

leejosepho
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18 Apr 2011, 7:44 am

MCalavera wrote:
Look what religion is doing ... giving you license to be arrogant and feel superior to other people.

I think you guys are being a bit unfair. There is nothing arrogant about doing what one believes is right, and a sense of superiority would not lead to inviting others to join in.


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18 Apr 2011, 7:58 am

leejosepho wrote:
MCalavera wrote:
Look what religion is doing ... giving you license to be arrogant and feel superior to other people.

I think you guys are being a bit unfair. There is nothing arrogant about doing what one believes is right, and a sense of superiority would not lead to inviting others to join in.


Sorry, Lee. Telling others not to celebrate Easter because it's from the Devil is pure arrogance (especially when they have nothing but silly faiths to "back up" what they say).



leejosepho
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18 Apr 2011, 8:07 am

MCalavera wrote:
Telling others not to celebrate Easter because it's from the Devil is pure arrogance ...

Where has anyone here told anyone else what to do?


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