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Occupiers are achieving NOTHING

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Asp-Z
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08 Nov 2011, 5:15 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
That's exactly what these Capitalists are doing. They are foreclosing on people's houses and they refuse to return the property on the Jubilee year. No wonder our liberty bell is cracked.


That's because the person in the house ain't paying their mortgage, which is more like a bailiff towing your car because you got it on credit and stopped paying the installments.


why aren't they paying their morgage.....could it have anything to do with the job shortage or insulting wages people are hired for?


If you take out a mortgage you know you can't afford, you can't be surprised if you end up getting kicked out your house. Common sense should tell people not to live above their means. If you want a bigger house and a better car, go and make more money instead of borrowing more than you can afford.



JWC
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08 Nov 2011, 5:17 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
JWC wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
peebo wrote:
JWC wrote:
JakobVirgil wrote:
Let me interpret a bit before this gets angry.
JWC was just kidding about your whining -only funny if you got it- I don't think anyone meant any harm.
My NT wife just got into one of these with an NT facebook friend.
My strategy if someone says something I don't understand is to assume it was some kinda joke.
does not always work but it is better than getting mad.


No, I wasn't completely kidding about the whining; but I meant it in more of a tough love way. Sometimes you just gotta 'man up' and live your life. The world can be a f**ked up place. There is no 'solution' to murder, starvation or poverty; these things will always happen to some degree. There will always be winners and there will always be losers. Competition is a good thing. Eliminating competition can't make everyone winners, in fact, it makes everyone losers. Without competition everyone loses the benefit of the products created by the competitively inspired mind. More than, money or power; the greatest men among us are motivated by glory. Remove competition and you remove winners. So, my kind suggestion to you is to not focus on what we humans do as a species; instead focus on what you do and can do as an individual to win as much as you can and not be one more loser who just quit playing the game.



are you saying here that in capitalist societies the losers benefit from the innovations of the winners? i don't think that really makes sense.


Yeah where are my benifits from the winners of society? huh....lol


Your ability to access and participate on this forum would be one.


Well it all depends on who you see as winners and who you see as losers now doesn't it.



Who do you see as a winner?



Sweetleaf
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08 Nov 2011, 5:18 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
That's exactly what these Capitalists are doing. They are foreclosing on people's houses and they refuse to return the property on the Jubilee year. No wonder our liberty bell is cracked.


That's because the person in the house ain't paying their mortgage, which is more like a bailiff towing your car because you got it on credit and stopped paying the installments.


why aren't they paying their morgage.....could it have anything to do with the job shortage or insulting wages people are hired for?


If you take out a mortgage you know you can't afford, you can't be surprised if you end up getting kicked out your house. Common sense should tell people not to live above their means. If you want a bigger house and a better car, go and make more money instead of borrowing more than you can afford.


What makes you think everyone who ends up getting kicked out of their house..knew they could not afford the morgage? you do realise with the worsening state of the economy there are lots of unpredictable factors that could make someone unable to keep up on payments.........these sort of things should be taken into consideration.

But I guess it is easier to just assume anyone who loses their house or is struggling just to survive....put themself there and thus deserves it. Its this sort of thinking that bothers me because as someone below the middle class I have seen lots of good people even in my family getting f*cked by the system not because they 'deserve' it or 'put themself there but because lets face it this society is not very kind to the lower class.



LKL
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08 Nov 2011, 5:21 pm

Part of the problem is that a lot of these people were naive and trusted the word of mortgage brokers who assured them, 'don't worry, everything will be fine, even if you can't make the payments you'll be able to sell at a profit in a couple of months, go ahead and go for the house you really liked instead of settling for the one that was just ok...' without disclosing that they made a commission, or that there were other types of mortgages that were safer for the buyer (but which didn't provide as much of a commission).

Non-bankers trust bankers or mortgage people to know what they're talking about when the subject is banking and mortgages that are 40 pages of legalese, just like non-plumbers trust plumbers when their basement is full of water, and non-doctors trust physicians when they suddenly have a rash all over their body.



Asp-Z
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08 Nov 2011, 5:21 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
That's exactly what these Capitalists are doing. They are foreclosing on people's houses and they refuse to return the property on the Jubilee year. No wonder our liberty bell is cracked.


That's because the person in the house ain't paying their mortgage, which is more like a bailiff towing your car because you got it on credit and stopped paying the installments.


why aren't they paying their morgage.....could it have anything to do with the job shortage or insulting wages people are hired for?


If you take out a mortgage you know you can't afford, you can't be surprised if you end up getting kicked out your house. Common sense should tell people not to live above their means. If you want a bigger house and a better car, go and make more money instead of borrowing more than you can afford.


What makes you think everyone who ends up getting kicked out of their house..knew they could not afford the morgage? you do realise with the worsening state of the economy there are lots of unpredictable factors that could make someone unable to keep up on payments.........these sort of things should be taken into consideration.

But I guess it is easier to just assume anyone who loses their house or is struggling just to survive....put themself there and thus deserves it. Its this sort of thinking that bothers me because as someone below the middle class I have seen lots of good people even in my family getting f*cked by the system not because they 'deserve' it or 'put themself there but because lets face it this society is not very kind to the lower class.


If you know the economy's bad, save for a rainy day. Plus, if you're made redundant, you'll get a redundancy package. You could then sell up and move to a smaller place that's cheaper, if things for you are that bad.

I never said anyone deserves anything, but the main reason the latest recession started is because people who no assets borrowed more than they could afford.



Last edited by Asp-Z on 08 Nov 2011, 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sweetleaf
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08 Nov 2011, 5:21 pm

JWC wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
JWC wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
peebo wrote:
JWC wrote:
JakobVirgil wrote:
Let me interpret a bit before this gets angry.
JWC was just kidding about your whining -only funny if you got it- I don't think anyone meant any harm.
My NT wife just got into one of these with an NT facebook friend.
My strategy if someone says something I don't understand is to assume it was some kinda joke.
does not always work but it is better than getting mad.


No, I wasn't completely kidding about the whining; but I meant it in more of a tough love way. Sometimes you just gotta 'man up' and live your life. The world can be a f**ked up place. There is no 'solution' to murder, starvation or poverty; these things will always happen to some degree. There will always be winners and there will always be losers. Competition is a good thing. Eliminating competition can't make everyone winners, in fact, it makes everyone losers. Without competition everyone loses the benefit of the products created by the competitively inspired mind. More than, money or power; the greatest men among us are motivated by glory. Remove competition and you remove winners. So, my kind suggestion to you is to not focus on what we humans do as a species; instead focus on what you do and can do as an individual to win as much as you can and not be one more loser who just quit playing the game.



are you saying here that in capitalist societies the losers benefit from the innovations of the winners? i don't think that really makes sense.


Yeah where are my benifits from the winners of society? huh....lol


Your ability to access and participate on this forum would be one.


Well it all depends on who you see as winners and who you see as losers now doesn't it.



Who do you see as a winner?


I see it as irrelevent actually........winning and losing is for playing insignificant games for entertainment. I don't think once financial status makes them a winner or loser. I care more about what type of person someone is so I guess if I have to use the terms winners and losers I would see people who care about others and want to make things better as 'winners' and people who want to get to the top no matter who they step on for personal gain as 'losers.'



Sweetleaf
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08 Nov 2011, 5:24 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
That's exactly what these Capitalists are doing. They are foreclosing on people's houses and they refuse to return the property on the Jubilee year. No wonder our liberty bell is cracked.


That's because the person in the house ain't paying their mortgage, which is more like a bailiff towing your car because you got it on credit and stopped paying the installments.


why aren't they paying their morgage.....could it have anything to do with the job shortage or insulting wages people are hired for?


If you take out a mortgage you know you can't afford, you can't be surprised if you end up getting kicked out your house. Common sense should tell people not to live above their means. If you want a bigger house and a better car, go and make more money instead of borrowing more than you can afford.


What makes you think everyone who ends up getting kicked out of their house..knew they could not afford the morgage? you do realise with the worsening state of the economy there are lots of unpredictable factors that could make someone unable to keep up on payments.........these sort of things should be taken into consideration.

But I guess it is easier to just assume anyone who loses their house or is struggling just to survive....put themself there and thus deserves it. Its this sort of thinking that bothers me because as someone below the middle class I have seen lots of good people even in my family getting f*cked by the system not because they 'deserve' it or 'put themself there but because lets face it this society is not very kind to the lower class.


If you know the economy's bad, save for a rainy day. Plus, if you're made redundant, you'll get a redundancy package. You could then sell up and move to a smaller place that's cheaper, if things for you are that bad.

I never said anyone deserves anything, but the main reason the latest recession started is because people who no assets borrowed more than they could afford.


Well that was irresponsible on their part I guess.........I've never been in a position to buy a house and probably never will be so I don't have a lot of experiance there. But I doubt the main reason the economy is going to crap is because some home owners borrowed more than they could afford. But in general that sort of thing probably has contributed....but our government also likes to borrow more than it can afford.



JWC
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08 Nov 2011, 5:29 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
JWC wrote:


Who do you see as a winner?


I see it as irrelevent actually........winning and losing is for playing insignificant games for entertainment. I don't think once financial status makes them a winner or loser. I care more about what type of person someone is so I guess if I have to use the terms winners and losers I would see people who care about others and want to make things better as 'winners' and people who want to get to the top no matter who they step on for personal gain as 'losers.'


So, let me get this straight, someone who manufactures a product that makes millions of lives more comfortable (or in some cases even livable at all) is a loser because the sell that product for a profit. But someone who hands out a few cans of perishable food at the homeless shelter is a winner.



Asp-Z
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08 Nov 2011, 5:30 pm

JWC wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
JWC wrote:


Who do you see as a winner?


I see it as irrelevent actually........winning and losing is for playing insignificant games for entertainment. I don't think once financial status makes them a winner or loser. I care more about what type of person someone is so I guess if I have to use the terms winners and losers I would see people who care about others and want to make things better as 'winners' and people who want to get to the top no matter who they step on for personal gain as 'losers.'


So, let me get this straight, someone who manufactures a product that makes millions of lives more comfortable (or in some cases even livable at all) is a loser because the sell that product for a profit. But someone who hands out a few cans of perishable food at the homeless shelter is a winner.


That's socialism for ya :roll:



Sweetleaf
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08 Nov 2011, 5:34 pm

JWC wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
JWC wrote:


Who do you see as a winner?


I see it as irrelevent actually........winning and losing is for playing insignificant games for entertainment. I don't think once financial status makes them a winner or loser. I care more about what type of person someone is so I guess if I have to use the terms winners and losers I would see people who care about others and want to make things better as 'winners' and people who want to get to the top no matter who they step on for personal gain as 'losers.'


So, let me get this straight, someone who manufactures a product that makes millions of lives more comfortable (or in some cases even livable at all) is a loser because the sell that product for a profit. But someone who hands out a few cans of perishable food at the homeless shelter is a winner.


No I was more suggesting someone who is willing to step on others to get what they want is a loser, and that is exactly what our disgusting society encourages all to do.......they want us to all be losers you could say.

And winners would be people who are willing to look at the bigger picture that contains other people and how what you do might affect them and choosing to do things that help rather than hinder others.

but I don't usually catagorize people as winners or losers......and I often refer to myself as a loser because, according to society that is exactly what I am and I kind of have a 'f*ck you! society!' attitude. They want a loser.....well they've got one.



Sweetleaf
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08 Nov 2011, 5:35 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
JWC wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
JWC wrote:


Who do you see as a winner?


I see it as irrelevent actually........winning and losing is for playing insignificant games for entertainment. I don't think once financial status makes them a winner or loser. I care more about what type of person someone is so I guess if I have to use the terms winners and losers I would see people who care about others and want to make things better as 'winners' and people who want to get to the top no matter who they step on for personal gain as 'losers.'


So, let me get this straight, someone who manufactures a product that makes millions of lives more comfortable (or in some cases even livable at all) is a loser because the sell that product for a profit. But someone who hands out a few cans of perishable food at the homeless shelter is a winner.


That's socialism for ya :roll:


its hard being a socialist in a capitalist world...though I don't know that I am a proper socialist either.



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08 Nov 2011, 5:41 pm

You know it really amazes me that these bankers get their trillion dollar bailouts and then pay society back by foreclosing and bulldozing as many houses as they can.

It reminds me of the story of a man who owed millions of dollars and was about to be sent to debtors prison but he got a pardon from the King who forgave his debt. Then as soon as his debt was forgiven this same man went around beating up people who owed him petty amounts.



Asp-Z
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08 Nov 2011, 5:42 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
You know it really amazes me that these bankers get their trillion dollar bailouts and then pay society back by foreclosing and bulldozing as many houses as they can.

It reminds me of the story of a man who owed millions of dollars and was about to be sent to debtors prison but he got a pardon from the King who forgave his debt. Then as soon as his debt was forgiven this same man went around beating up people who owed him petty amounts.


They not charities. They're businesses.

Besides, if the whole banking system collapsed, we'd all be utterly screwed.



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08 Nov 2011, 5:46 pm

If these businesses are not charities why should they be bailed out?



Asp-Z
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08 Nov 2011, 5:50 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
If these businesses are not charities why should they be bailed out?


Read the second paragraph of my last post.



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08 Nov 2011, 5:53 pm

Actually, they did accomplish something - they had shamed Bank of America into dropping that Goddamn five dollar monthly fee. Plus, they've helped convince people to pull their money out of the big banks, and going to credit unions. That was certainly a primary reason why my wife and I did.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer.