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Why Jews are smarter (as a group) than most groups.

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LKL
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08 Sep 2012, 6:02 pm

^intelligence is also somewhat correlated with atheism... :wink:
If a person has to leave their culture in order for their intelligence to become manifest, it somewhat implies that it's not the culture that's entirely responsible for the intelligence.



Vexcalibur
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08 Sep 2012, 6:05 pm

LKL wrote:
^intelligence is also somewhat correlated with atheism... :wink:
If a person has to leave their culture in order for their intelligence to become manifest, it somewhat implies that it's not the culture that's entirely responsible for the intelligence.
But I would say that cultures that are harder to leave make those who do tougher at it.

And of course they had to leave their culture. They didn't find the Nobel-worthy discoveries in the Torah, I can assure that.


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08 Sep 2012, 6:07 pm

LKL wrote:
If a person has to leave their culture in order for their intelligence to become manifest, it somewhat implies that it's not the culture that's entirely responsible for the intelligence.



True, but that is not what ruveyn was talking about. Nor was it his "theory".



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08 Sep 2012, 6:12 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
LKL wrote:
^intelligence is also somewhat correlated with atheism... :wink:
If a person has to leave their culture in order for their intelligence to become manifest, it somewhat implies that it's not the culture that's entirely responsible for the intelligence.
But I would say that cultures that are harder to leave make those who do tougher at it.

And of course they had to leave their culture. They didn't find the Nobel-worthy discoveries in the Torah, I can assure that.


More so, what if the super closed cultural mindset of the Jewish, acts as a great motivator for the intelligent people to heavily move into science and academics to get scholarships and whatever to leave their culture?

For example, if you are an extremely intelligent American, you have plenty of options, you can be an engineer or a TV producer or whatever you might like. Who knows what would happen to all that potential if they were forced into science... But an open society such as the American one does not motivate such efforts as strongly.

Actually, what if this is the reason American women do so well in Academia? For them at least, the culture is much rougher and closer than for males.


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LKL
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08 Sep 2012, 9:03 pm

AspieRogue wrote:
LKL wrote:
are you suggesting that intelligence is supernatural in origin?




NO.

I'm suggesting that before the 19th century, it was unknown to science where intelligence came from. Psychometrics, which gave rise to the Intelligence Quotient Exam, was invented in the 19th Europe. It's main impetus was the study of the mentally ret*d and mentally ill, who were known in past centuries as village idiots. Heredity was observed and recorded as far back as the middle ages, but it wasn't until Gregor Mendel actually made detailed studies of heredity and was able to infer the basic rules as to how traits are passed on from parent to child. And that my friend, is why I'm cynical that there was ANY sort of "breeding program" among medieval and renaissance Jewry to promote superior intellects! Because nobody back then had any idea of what made certain people good scholars and where that talent came from.

The word 'breeding program' is being used by Ruveyn to describe the results, not the purpose, of how Jews intermarried. Which you would know if you had read his posts with an eye to understanding them.



LKL
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08 Sep 2012, 9:07 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
LKL wrote:
^intelligence is also somewhat correlated with atheism... :wink:
If a person has to leave their culture in order for their intelligence to become manifest, it somewhat implies that it's not the culture that's entirely responsible for the intelligence.
But I would say that cultures that are harder to leave make those who do tougher at it.

And of course they had to leave their culture. They didn't find the Nobel-worthy discoveries in the Torah, I can assure that.


More so, what if the super closed cultural mindset of the Jewish, acts as a great motivator for the intelligent people to heavily move into science and academics to get scholarships and whatever to leave their culture?

For example, if you are an extremely intelligent American, you have plenty of options, you can be an engineer or a TV producer or whatever you might like. Who knows what would happen to all that potential if they were forced into science... But an open society such as the American one does not motivate such efforts as strongly.

Actually, what if this is the reason American women do so well in Academia? For them at least, the culture is much rougher and closer than for males.

Meh. There is still a lot of networking required to excel in academia and science, and there's a profound break in gender between different academic disciplines.
edit: When women started moving into biology, suddenly biology started being described as a 'soft' science; now that women are moving into math, I wonder what people will call it... :D



Last edited by LKL on 08 Sep 2012, 9:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ruveyn
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08 Sep 2012, 9:07 pm

LKL wrote:
The word 'breeding program' is being used by Ruveyn to describe the results, not the purpose, of how Jews intermarried. Which you would know if you had read his posts with an eye to understanding them.


Thank you. I went to some trouble to point out that the match making customs in the traditional Jewish communities was -an accidental- breeding program for producing intelligent offspring. Jews and other people, at that time, did not have the foggiest notion of how characteristics were inherited in a biological manner or even that they were inherited in a biological manner.

The course that Jews followed to breed intelligence was accidental and inadvertent.

ruveyn



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13 Sep 2012, 10:37 am

Probably the notable and genuine intelligence of quite a lot of famous Jews (and sure unknown Jews) come from the fact that they have been a exiled country during centuries. When you are always travelling, trying to fit constantly in new places but trying to be yourself at the same time, you have to be intelligent. Trip is a big teacher. You have to be clever to prosper on foreign lands (where people not always will love your culture) and at the same time you have to be a philosopher (to preserve your culture).

I think they have inherited a kind of melancholy that aligns pretty well with a good development of intelligence. The Jewish philosophy is the reflection of that outer and inner long voyage.


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11 Oct 2012, 8:01 pm

Given the way that slaves were bred

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_bree ... ted_States

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Durin' slavery there were stockmen. They was weighed and tested. A man would rent the stockman and put him in a room with some young women he wanted to raise children from.


I'm assuming that the stockmen were big, strong slaves, used to impregnate female slaves, with the goal of producing more valuable slave children.

Could this breeding program possibly explain the way that Black folks dominate certain sports today?



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12 Oct 2012, 5:51 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
Given the way that slaves were bred

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slave_bree ... ted_States

Quote:
Durin' slavery there were stockmen. They was weighed and tested. A man would rent the stockman and put him in a room with some young women he wanted to raise children from.


I'm assuming that the stockmen were big, strong slaves, used to impregnate female slaves, with the goal of producing more valuable slave children.

Could this breeding program possibly explain the way that Black folks dominate certain sports today?


No, because Africans who were never slaves, dominate many of the same sports. Example: Africans and track and field.



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12 Oct 2012, 7:45 am

Max000 wrote:
No, because Africans who were never slaves, dominate many of the same sports. Example: Africans and track and field.


Well, our breeders wouldn't have wanted to breed slaves who could out-run the slave-catchers.

I suspect that they were selecting for traits that would increase returns on the auction block--particularly the Arnold-esque musculature.

Of course, even in the general economy, guys like Arnold get a whole lot more than their fair share of p****. If a slave in the South, Arnold would have been put to work siring a very large number of children.

How do Africans do in sports like rugby or boxing, compared to Black Americans? (Americans play American football, and I think that the closest international equivalent is rugby).



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12 Oct 2012, 8:12 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
Max000 wrote:
No, because Africans who were never slaves, dominate many of the same sports. Example: Africans and track and field.


Well, our breeders wouldn't have wanted to breed slaves who could out-run the slave-catchers.

I suspect that they were selecting for traits that would increase returns on the auction block--particularly the Arnold-esque musculature.

Of course, even in the general economy, guys like Arnold get a whole lot more than their fair share of p****. If a slave in the South, Arnold would have been put to work siring a very large number of children.

How do Africans do in sports like rugby or boxing, compared to Black Americans? (Americans play American football, and I think that the closest international equivalent is rugby).


Interesting that you brought up this conversation. I have noticed that I have never seen an African origan women with lean muscular body. I assume this is the result of the breeding process. They want women to be as strong as men but with the ability ot give offspring.



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12 Oct 2012, 10:07 am

Aspie_Chav wrote:
Interesting that you brought up this conversation. I have noticed that I have never seen an African origan women with lean muscular body. I assume this is the result of the breeding process. They want women to be as strong as men but with the ability ot give offspring.


When you are using a man with Arnold's physique for stud service, you simply aren't going to get any dainty little daughters.

However, the South also had a huge market for "Fancy Girls", to serve as concubines and prostitutes. Typically, a slave girl was required to breed as soon as she reached puberty. The owner, of course, would have first dibs. Often, the girl would be his own daughter, and sometimes also his own grand-daughter. His prettiest daughters would fetch a very good price at auction.

Some more information: http://multiracial.com/site/content/view/460/27/



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12 Oct 2012, 12:00 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
Aspie_Chav wrote:
Interesting that you brought up this conversation. I have noticed that I have never seen an African origan women with lean muscular body. I assume this is the result of the breeding process. They want women to be as strong as men but with the ability ot give offspring.


When you are using a man with Arnold's physique for stud service, you simply aren't going to get any dainty little daughters.


Not convinced. It is usually the hunk who gets lucky with dainty little beautiful woman. Males can be completely different from there females counterparts in a specific race. For example. Black men are usually much more lean then the woman, but belong to the same race.



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12 Oct 2012, 4:02 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
Aspie_Chav wrote:
Interesting that you brought up this conversation. I have noticed that I have never seen an African origan women with lean muscular body. I assume this is the result of the breeding process. They want women to be as strong as men but with the ability ot give offspring.


When you are using a man with Arnold's physique for stud service, you simply aren't going to get any dainty little daughters.

However, the South also had a huge market for "Fancy Girls", to serve as concubines and prostitutes. Typically, a slave girl was required to breed as soon as she reached puberty. The owner, of course, would have first dibs. Often, the girl would be his own daughter, and sometimes also his own grand-daughter. His prettiest daughters would fetch a very good price at auction.

Some more information: http://multiracial.com/site/content/view/460/27/


I wonder if any of those dirty old cracker slave owners ever took sexual advantage of the men.
That would truly be funny, considering the level of homophobia among white southerners today, and who deify their Confederate ancestors.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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12 Oct 2012, 4:50 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
I wonder if any of those dirty old cracker slave owners ever took sexual advantage of the men.
That would truly be funny, considering the level of homophobia among white southerners today, and who deify their Confederate ancestors.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer


Oh, I'm sure that it happened, but would not have been talked about. In the South, White men with money still like Black homosexual prostitutes:

http://yoloakili.com/2011/11/old-white- ... enn-state/

Here is an excerpt of a book by Harriet Jacobs, a former slave

http://www.pagebypagebooks.com/Harriet_ ... aw_p2.html

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Luke was appointed to wait upon his bed-ridden master, whose despotic habits were greatly increased by exasperation at his own helplessness. He kept a cowhide beside him, and, for the most trivial occurrence, he would order his attendant to bare his back, and kneel beside the couch, while he whipped him till his strength was exhausted. Some days he was not allowed to wear any thing but his shirt, in order to be in readiness to be flogged. A day seldom passed without his receiving more or less blows. If the slightest resistance was offered, the town constable was sent for to execute the punishment, and Luke learned from experience how much more the constable's strong arm was to be dreaded than the comparatively feeble one of his master. The arm of his tyrant grew weaker, and was finally palsied; and then the constable's services were in constant requisition. The fact that he was entirely dependent on Luke's care, and was obliged to be tended like an infant, instead of inspiring any gratitude or compassion towards his poor slave, seemed only to increase his irritability and cruelty. As he lay there on his bed, a mere degraded wreck of manhood, he took into his head the strangest freaks of despotism; and if Luke hesitated to submit to his orders, the constable was immediately sent for. Some of these freaks were of a nature too filthy to be repeated. When I fled from the house of bondage, I left poor Luke still chained to the bedside of this cruel and disgusting wretch.