29 Aug 2008, 5:57 pm
burnse22 wrote:
Is Atheism Satanism?
Post, flame, discuss, debate and shout about to your heart's content.
Post, flame, discuss, debate and shout about to your heart's content.
Satanists believe in both God and Satan. They choose to worship Satan. Mostly a rebellion thing.
Atheists believe in neither God nor Satan.
You must believe in Satan to be a Satanist.
Atheists do not believe in Satan
Therefore, Atheists are not Satanists.
It's really very simple
29 Aug 2008, 6:02 pm
29 Aug 2008, 6:09 pm
29 Aug 2008, 6:38 pm
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
The fact is that Satanism is a subset of Atheism, and that is true whether you like it or not.
The above statement shows that you have no f_cking idea what Satanism or Atheism actually is. Read what Misspickwickian wrote 2 posts above, she's pretty much got it down, buddy.
29 Aug 2008, 6:40 pm
Haliphron wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Well, to a Christian, it is completely understandable to think that. However, to somebody other than that person, it is completely incorrect.
The issue is merely one of categorization of worldly phenomena, and so if we have a Christian working within a Christian framework, then the categorization of atheism as satanism does not seem particularly invalid, as in order to not believe in God you would have to turn your back on him and reject him as Satan did(God's existence being considered an obvious thing based upon Romans 1:20), thus, following Satan's path. This, of course, is not to be accepted by most people, but then again, would a thorough Biblical morality necessarily be accepted by most people as a valid interpretation of right and wrong? No. It is somewhat logically coherent though.
The issue is merely one of categorization of worldly phenomena, and so if we have a Christian working within a Christian framework, then the categorization of atheism as satanism does not seem particularly invalid, as in order to not believe in God you would have to turn your back on him and reject him as Satan did(God's existence being considered an obvious thing based upon Romans 1:20), thus, following Satan's path. This, of course, is not to be accepted by most people, but then again, would a thorough Biblical morality necessarily be accepted by most people as a valid interpretation of right and wrong? No. It is somewhat logically coherent though.
NOT.TRUE.
Satanists believe in God, however they do not follow God because they reject him and embrace his rival Satan.
Atheists do not believe Neither God NOT Satan are anything other than imaginary beings.
Umm..... I understand that.
However, if you are a Christian, then following Rom 1:20 "For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. ", which basically says "Hey y'all, it is self-evident that God exists", means that one is willfully rejecting God, and given the notion that the world is divided into sin and grace which is found in Romans 7. So, basically, it is understandable to hold to this notion as if you think that all people inherently know that God exists(no atheists only liars, which is the position of Tillian presuppositional apologetics) and that those who reject God cannot be neutral to him, but rather must be under the sway of the devil, this idea makes sense. It could also be correct to say that same thing about any non-Christian group too under this set of presuppositions. However, as I already admitted, this notion is pretty much based upon a conservative Christian worldview, not upon secular definitions, where the latter is what most people are using.
29 Aug 2008, 6:43 pm
Haliphron wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
The fact is that Satanism is a subset of Atheism, and that is true whether you like it or not.
The above statement shows that you have no f_cking idea what Satanism or Atheism actually is. Read what Misspickwickian wrote 2 posts above, she's pretty much got it down, buddy.
Not necessarily, do you have the firmest grasp on Christian theology and the ways that Christians can look at the world given that perspective? MissPickWickian's point isn't stupid, but it does not attempt to attack Christian theology, which is really the matter to be questioned.
29 Aug 2008, 6:45 pm
Trouble is, all people Do not inherently know God exists! I have not seen a shred of evidence of Gods existance nor have I had any personal contact with God(despite repeatedly asking). So that particular bible verse is just plain Wrong. If God
where as obvious as the Sun than you might actually have a point, but the REALITY is that he sure as bloody hell AINT.
Hence the saying: Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Since God existance is ANYTHING BUT obvious, the claim that he exists is quite extraordinary.
Furthermore, since Satanism is the worship of Satan than it follows that Satanists believe that Satan exists. Since atheists do not believe in Satans existance, Satanism cannot be a subset of Atheism. Thats just plain old logic. 
29 Aug 2008, 6:49 pm
MissPickwickian wrote:
burnse22 wrote:
Is Atheism Satanism?
Post, flame, discuss, debate and shout about to your heart's content.
Post, flame, discuss, debate and shout about to your heart's content.
Satanists believe in both God and Satan. They choose to worship Satan. Mostly a rebellion thing.
Atheists believe in neither God nor Satan.
You must believe in Satan to be a Satanist.
Atheists do not believe in Satan
Therefore, Atheists are not Satanists.
It's really very simple
Ok, let's then argue that there are no atheists based upon Romans 1:18-21, something that as I argued earlier, has been done by prominent Calvinist theologian Cornelius Van Til in his presuppositional apologetics. If so, then atheists do necessarily believe in God, but reject him to choose evil, and being that Satan is the lord of all evil, so by rejecting God one *necessarily* must serve Satan.
MissPickwickian wrote:
Can I haz explanation? How does one implicitly worship Satan?
By rejecting God. No middle ground.
29 Aug 2008, 6:50 pm
29 Aug 2008, 6:53 pm
29 Aug 2008, 6:56 pm
Haliphron wrote:
Trouble is, all people Do not inherently know God exists! I have not seen a shred of evidence of Gods existance nor have I had any personal contact with God(despite repeatedly asking). So that particular bible verse is just plain Wrong. If God
Sure they do, they're just lying to say they don't. The Bible verse isn't wrong, as the Bible is inerrant, duh! But, in all seriousness, the issue isn't whether an atheist, agnostic, or any brand of non-Christian will agree with the saying, but rather whether or not it is consistent with Christianity.
Quote:
where as obvious as the Sun than you might actually have a point, but the REALITY is that he sure as bloody hell AINT.
Ok.... you aren't a Christian. I stated in my first post that only Christians could accept the argument that atheists are satanists, simply because it demands Christian presuppositions, if you don't hold to them, then you will disagree. The issue is really self-consistency rather than the agreement of all possible beings.
Quote:
Hence the saying: Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Since God existance is ANYTHING BUT obvious, the claim that he exists is quite extraordinary.
I know, claim by David Hume. Still, not in the bible.
Quote:
Furthermore, since Satanism is the worship of Satan than it follows that Satanists believe that Satan exists. Since atheists do not believe in Satans existance, Satanism cannot be a subset of Atheism. Thats just plain old logic.
Atheists don't exist according to the Bible because of Romans 1:20, there is only the law of God or the law of sin, Romans 7, so on and so forth. If these verses are true then atheists must be satanists, if I am a Christian then those verses are true, therefore Christians are internally consistent when saying that atheists are satanists. Now, does it matter if Christianity is correct for this argument? No, because that is a separate issue, it only needs to be seen that the Christian is potentially internally consistent(we hold theology relatively constant), not that he/she is correct.
29 Aug 2008, 6:57 pm
29 Aug 2008, 6:59 pm
29 Aug 2008, 7:00 pm
29 Aug 2008, 7:03 pm
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Haliphron wrote:
Trouble is, all people Do not inherently know God exists! I have not seen a shred of evidence of Gods existance nor have I had any personal contact with God(despite repeatedly asking). So that particular bible verse is just plain Wrong. If God
Sure they do, they're just lying to say they don't. The Bible verse isn't wrong, as the Bible is inerrant, duh! But, in all seriousness, the issue isn't whether an atheist, agnostic, or any brand of non-Christian will agree with the saying, but rather whether or not it is consistent with Christianity.
Quote:
where as obvious as the Sun than you might actually have a point, but the REALITY is that he sure as bloody hell AINT.
Ok.... you aren't a Christian. I stated in my first post that only Christians could accept the argument that atheists are satanists, simply because it demands Christian presuppositions, if you don't hold to them, then you will disagree. The issue is really self-consistency rather than the agreement of all possible beings.
Quote:
Hence the saying: Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Since God existance is ANYTHING BUT obvious, the claim that he exists is quite extraordinary.
I know, claim by David Hume. Still, not in the bible.
Quote:
Furthermore, since Satanism is the worship of Satan than it follows that Satanists believe that Satan exists. Since atheists do not believe in Satans existance, Satanism cannot be a subset of Atheism. Thats just plain old logic.
Atheists don't exist according to the Bible because of Romans 1:20, there is only the law of God or the law of sin, Romans 7, so on and so forth. If these verses are true then atheists must be satanists, if I am a Christian then those verses are true, therefore Christians are internally consistent when saying that atheists are satanists. Now, does it matter if Christianity is correct for this argument? No, because that is a separate issue, it only needs to be seen that the Christian is potentially internally consistent(we hold theology relatively constant), not that he/she is correct.
Do you realize that Fnord pointed out in another post that according to the Holy Bible the ration of the circumfrence of a circular object to its diameter is 3.0 instead of pi??? That has been shown to be mathematically FALSE! So I guess the bible actually IS NOT inerrant after all
. The bible says there are no atheists, and yet there Are! Sure christians say they *know* God exists, but HOW do You know that they're being totally honest and not Lying??? Furthermore, I'd like to know just exactly where the bible even talks about the actual worship of Satan....
But dont you see my point? Fundamentalist Christianity is Not consistent! That is what makes the whole premise of this thread totally absurd! 
29 Aug 2008, 7:12 pm
