Papa John's and Obamacare

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Inuyasha
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23 Nov 2012, 3:29 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

Had Barrack Obama ever written or been recorded as saying he wants to throw live babies into the garbage? I ask, because I strongly suspect the answer is no.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

He is on record fillabustering the bill that would have made it a felony offense in the state of Illinois and pulling other shannigans to prevent it from being put up for a vote.

I understand your skepticism on this Kraichgauer, I was about the only person in my family that wasn't under the impression that Sean Hannity had lost it, concerning all the stuff he dug up about Obama. I had done some digging of my own, since I'm well aware of how people on the spectrum have a hard time telling when someone is lieing to them, so I actually had dug up stuff on my own which backed up what Sean Hannity said. I also knew from reading one of Sean Hannity's books, that he is a pretty meticulous researcher.

Fact of the matter is that my family ended up with the more scary scenario that Sean hadn't lost his mind, and Obama really did have all those skeletons in the closet.

Actual Text of Bill 1:
SB1095 Engrossed LRB9206290REdv

1 AN ACT concerning infants who are born alive.

2 Be it enacted by the People of the State of Illinois,
3 represented in the General Assembly:

4 Section 5. The Statute on Statutes is amended by adding
5 Section 1.36 as follows:

6 (5 ILCS 70/1.36 new)
7 Sec. 1.36. Born-alive infant.
8 (a) In determining the meaning of any statute or of any
9 rule, regulation, or interpretation of the various
10 administrative agencies of this State, the words "person",
11 "human being", "child", and "individual" include every infant
12 member of the species homo sapiens who is born alive at any
13 stage of development.
14 (b) As used in this Section, the term "born alive", with
15 respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the
16 complete expulsion or extraction from its mother of that
17 member, at any stage of development, who after that expulsion
18 or extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of
19 the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary
20 muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been
21 cut and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction
22 occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean
23 section, or induced abortion.
24 (c) A live child born as a result of an abortion shall be
25 fully recognized as a human person and accorded immediate
26 protection under the law.

27 Section 99. Effective date. This Act takes effect upon
28 becoming law.

http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/legisne ... 095LV.html

Then we have Text of Bill 2 that he Opposed a year later:
92_SB1662eng

SB1662 Engrossed LRB9215510REdv

1 AN ACT concerning infants who are born alive.

2 Be it enacted by the People of the State of Illinois,
3 represented in the General Assembly:

4 Section 5. The Statute on Statutes is amended by adding
5 Section 1.36 as follows:

6 (5 ILCS 70/1.36 new)
7 Sec. 1.36. Born-alive infant.
8 (a) In determining the meaning of any statute or of any
9 rule, regulation, or interpretation of the various
10 administrative agencies of this State, the words "person",
11 "human being", "child", and "individual" include every infant
12 member of the species homo sapiens who is born alive at any
13 stage of development.
14 (b) As used in this Section, the term "born alive", with
15 respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the
16 complete expulsion or extraction from its mother of that
17 member, at any stage of development, who after that expulsion
18 or extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of
19 the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary
20 muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been
21 cut and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction
22 occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean
23 section, or induced abortion.
24 (c) A live child born as a result of an abortion shall
25 be fully recognized as a human person and accorded immediate
26 protection under the law.

27 Section 99. Effective date. This Act takes effect upon
28 becoming law.
http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/legisne ... 662LV.html

You may think this source is biased, but that doesn't change the fact what they are saying is accurate and can actually back it up with sources.
http://www.jillstanek.com/2008/02/links ... ction-act/

He also voted against the third bill in 2003, after amending to change some small bit of wording... He lied about what was in the bill during the Presidential Election until he finally was forced to admit he lied.

But whether or not one accepts those arguments, it is not the reason Obama had been giving for his 2003 opposition. He told Brody that the federal bill "was not the bill that was presented at the state level." That's technically true; though the "neutrality clause" was identical in the federal and state bills, there were other minor wording differences elsewhere. But the Obama campaign statement says that "Illinois And Federal Born Alive Infant Protection Acts Did Not Include Exactly The Same Language." That's true for the earlier versions that Obama voted against. In the case of SB 1082, as it was amended just before being killed, it’s false.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008 ... icide.html

Kraichgauer
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23 Nov 2012, 4:56 pm

I wouldn't trust Sean Hannity as far as I could throw him, so I question any research he claims to have done.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

ArrantPariah
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23 Nov 2012, 9:50 pm

Standard drive-by right-wing nutjob media smears

http://mediamatters.org/research/2009/0 ... bor/150407

Quote:

her May 20 column, Ann Coulter asserted that "[a]s an Illinois state senator in 2002-2003, [President] Obama repeatedly blocked and voted against the 'Born Alive Act,' which would have allowed doctors to give medical care to babies who somehow survived abortions and remained alive, wholly apart from their mothers." However, the suggestion that at the time Illinois law did not already "allow doctors to give medical care to babies who somehow survived abortions" without the "Born Alive Act" is false. In fact, as Media Matters for America has repeatedly noted, Obama and other opponents said the bill posed a threat to abortion rights and was unnecessary because, they said, Illinois law already required doctors to provide medical care for "babies who somehow survived abortions."

As Media Matters noted, when tasked by the Illinois attorney general's office with investigating allegations that fetuses born alive at an Illinois hospital were abandoned without treatment -- the alleged incident that inspired the "Born Alive Act" -- the Illinois Department of Public Health reportedly said that it was unable to substantiate the allegations but said that if the allegations had proved true, the conduct alleged would have been a violation of then-existing Illinois law. Obama himself has cited specific provisions of the Illinois Compiled Statutes in stating that the "born alive principle was already the law in Illinois."

Coulter, nationally syndicated radio host Rush Limbaugh, Fox News host Sean Hannity, and several other conservative commentators have previously claimed that Obama's votes against this legislation mean that, in Limbaugh's words, Obama "believes it is proper to kill a baby that has survived an abortion."

Praise God for Media Matters! :hail:

Inuyasha
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23 Nov 2012, 11:56 pm

So you're saying that the actual text of the bills from the State of Illinois's own government website has less credibility than mediamatters? Do you really think anyone here is stupid enough to believe mediamatters when Factcheck.org and the Government of Illinois own transcripts concerning the bills in question contradict mediamatters?

Cornflake
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24 Nov 2012, 7:54 am

[Moved from News and Current Events to PPR]

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ArrantPariah
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24 Nov 2012, 9:02 am

Inuyasha wrote:

So you're saying that the actual text of the bills from the State of Illinois's own government website has less credibility than mediamatters?

I said no such thing.

Inuyasha wrote:

Do you really think anyone here is stupid enough to believe mediamatters when Factcheck.org and the Government of Illinois own transcripts concerning the bills in question contradict mediamatters?

androbot2084
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24 Nov 2012, 9:52 am

The religious right says that health care is not an entitlement.

ruveyn
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24 Nov 2012, 9:54 am

androbot2084 wrote:

The religious right says that health care is not an entitlement.

It most certain is: The guns of the government guarantee that it is an entitlement which you will pay for whether you like it or not.

ruveyn

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24 Nov 2012, 10:52 am

ruveyn wrote:

androbot2084 wrote:

The religious right says that health care is not an entitlement.

It most certain is: The guns of the government guarantee that it is an entitlement which you will pay for whether you like it or not.

ruveyn

It'll eventually bankrupt us is what it'll do,

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ruveyn
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24 Nov 2012, 11:06 am

Raptor wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

androbot2084 wrote:

The religious right says that health care is not an entitlement.

It most certain is: The guns of the government guarantee that it is an entitlement which you will pay for whether you like it or not.

ruveyn

It'll eventually bankrupt us is what it'll do,

That it will.

ruveyn

ArrantPariah
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24 Nov 2012, 11:41 am

That is what the clowns at Fox want everyone to believe.

Raptor
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24 Nov 2012, 11:57 am

ArrantPariah wrote:

That is what the clowns at Fox want everyone to believe.

In the eyes of the right you are promoting Fox.

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ArrantPariah
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24 Nov 2012, 12:00 pm

Raptor wrote:

ArrantPariah wrote:

That is what the clowns at Fox want everyone to believe.

In the eyes of the right you are promoting Fox.

Yes, because the right enjoys watching clowns at work.

Raptor
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24 Nov 2012, 1:08 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:

Raptor wrote:

ArrantPariah wrote:

That is what the clowns at Fox want everyone to believe.

In the eyes of the right you are promoting Fox.

Yes, because the right enjoys watching clowns at work.

No because if you, being a liberal, don't like it then it must be good.

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Kraichgauer
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24 Nov 2012, 2:13 pm

Raptor wrote:

ArrantPariah wrote:

Raptor wrote:

ArrantPariah wrote:

That is what the clowns at Fox want everyone to believe.

In the eyes of the right you are promoting Fox.

Yes, because the right enjoys watching clowns at work.

No because if you, being a liberal, don't like it then it must be good.

So, by your reasoning, as liberals would hate having the atmosphere ripped away from the earth, leaving us all to die in the cold, airless void of space, that makes it a good thing? :lol:

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

Raptor
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24 Nov 2012, 3:41 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

Raptor wrote:

ArrantPariah wrote:

Raptor wrote:

ArrantPariah wrote:

That is what the clowns at Fox want everyone to believe.

In the eyes of the right you are promoting Fox.

Yes, because the right enjoys watching clowns at work.

No because if you, being a liberal, don't like it then it must be good.

So, by your reasoning, as liberals would hate having the atmosphere ripped away from the earth, leaving us all to die in the cold, airless void of space, that makes it a good thing? :lol:

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

You learn fast, Grasshopper....

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