Column: Larry Elder is the Black face of white supremacy.

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Mr Reynholm
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10 Sep 2021, 8:33 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
National Review has a story up doing a pretty good summary of my feelings on the egg throwing gorilla incident:

https://www.nationalreview.com/2021/09/ ... n-america/

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D o a search for “Larry Elder” and gorilla on the CNN website and nothing comes up. Washington Post? Zilch. Nothing comes up on the New York Times site either, although if you make it to the 15th paragraph of a story entitled “The Vice President pushed back against the effort to recall Newsom in the Bay Area,” you will find a bland passing reference to Wednesday’s disgusting incident. According to our nation’s media leaders, it’s not a story that a white person wearing a gorilla mask attacked Larry Elder, a black man seeking to become the first non-white governor of California, by hurling an egg that touched his head.

If Elder were a Democrat, the attack would have been instantly and with good reason dubbed racist. It would not only be front-page news, it would be just about the only news you were hearing about today on CNN and MSNBC. Charles Blow, Perry Bacon, and Jamelle Bouie would each be writing the first in a series of angry columns about it. So would Gail Collins, Jonathan Capehart, Jennifer Rubin, Michelle Goldberg, Paul Krugman, Maureen Dowd, Dana Milbank, and Ezra Klein. We would be treated to multiple news analyses about the history of the usage of gorilla tropes against blacks. Joy-Ann Reid, Rachel Maddow, and Don Lemon would be doing hour-long broadcasts on the attack, convening panels discussing just how the attack pulls the scab off racism in America, and proves we have so much work left to do in dealing with the problem. Vox would commission a series about California’s grim history of racism dating back to the Chinese Exclusion Act, and Asian-American and Latino writers would hasten to explain that California’s historic hostility to all sorts of persons of color is as traditional as its Tournament of Roses parade. Three-thousand-word essays about the brutal, unknown history of lynchings in the Golden State would be published in The Atlantic and/or The New Yorker. Al Sharpton, exhibiting a combination of exhaustion and despondency, would be a guest on half a dozen cable TV shows.

The woman who threw the egg at Elder would find her picture, her name, and everything she’d ever said on social media scrutinized at great length and on the home pages of the leading news sites. Her appearance would be mocked by late-night comedians. Dozens of reporters would be sent out to learn this woman’s story, to check out where she lived, where she worked, and where she went to school.

Remember what happened when a white woman in Central Park told a black man she would mention his race in the course of reporting his threat to her dog on a 911 call? That was a huge nationwide news story, despite having happened the same day as the murder of George Floyd, and even though the people involved were just ordinary New Yorkers — neither of them an important candidate a step away from one of the highest offices in the country. If Elder were a Democrat we’d be told there is a vast and wide-ranging racist plot to stop California from electing its first black governor. The stakes are a bit higher than “white dog lady calls cops on black bird-watcher.” Isn’t our democracy itself imperiled when a white person in a gorilla mask tries to leverage racism against a popular black candidate?


If a white woman in a gorilla mask threw an egg at Barack Obama or Stacy Abrams, does anyone really doubt it would be front page news coast to coast?


That’s the thing, I really don’t think it would be. Do you remember any such news stories? I don’t. I am aware that multiple attacks have occurred because of more generalized research I found later, but I can’t recall any single racist protestor ever getting national coverage when either were campaigning.

Racist or homophobic protest groups get coverage, but not single individuals. Show me my memory is wrong.

The Central Park incident I think is distinguished by the involvement of social media. The news didn’t turn a camera on her, the other private citizen involved did. He blasted the video, not a news agency. Social media made it viral, and it was only picked up by major news because it already was a story. That whole social-media-to-news thing is out of hand and damaging. A fickle click bait populace shouldn’t decide what is news.

Nicklaus Sandman?



MaxE
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10 Sep 2021, 8:40 am

Mr Reynholm wrote:
Nicklaus Sandman?

I think you mean Nicholas Sandmann. That little twit deserves whatever he gets. If I were headmaster of any school at which he was a pupil, I would have expelled him immediately for besmirching the school's good name. Unfortunately, the school he attends has far lower standards and no sense of shame.


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Mr Reynholm
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10 Sep 2021, 8:44 am

MaxE wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Nicklaus Sandman?

I think you mean Nicholas Sandmann. That little twit deserves whatever he gets. If I were headmaster of any school at which he was a pupil, I would have expelled him immediately for besmirching the school's good name. Unfortunately, the school he attends has far lower standards and no sense of shame.

Sandmann didn't do anything but stand there while Mr Philips got up in his face. What exactly was Sandmann supposed to do?



DW_a_mom
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10 Sep 2021, 4:29 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
MaxE wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Nicklaus Sandman?

I think you mean Nicholas Sandmann. That little twit deserves whatever he gets. If I were headmaster of any school at which he was a pupil, I would have expelled him immediately for besmirching the school's good name. Unfortunately, the school he attends has far lower standards and no sense of shame.

Sandmann didn't do anything but stand there while Mr Philips got up in his face. What exactly was Sandmann supposed to do?


I don't agree with Mr Reynholm often, but I think he gave a perfect example in response to my observation that
DW_a_mom wrote:
social media made it viral, and it was only picked up by major news because it already was a story. That whole social-media-to-news thing is out of hand and damaging. A fickle click bait populace shouldn’t decide what is news.


I originally, like many people, saw the video and, at first impulse, accepted the context within which it was shown to me. I didn't share it for multiple reasons, but from the start the idea of blasting a private citizen who was a teenager across the web for a facial expression upset me. More to the point, however, is that, as it turned out, anyone who ran with that first impulse was making a mistake. Whether or not the whole of Nicholas Sandmann is a twit is besides the point; what we saw and were judging him on was a rare and complex moment from which we lacked the context to reach any conclusions, much less broadcast them. That any news organizations picked it up as first broadcast is shameful. A lot of good articles on exactly why we can't trust our own eyes and gut reactions followed that incident, and a lot of retractions were published.


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cyberdad
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10 Sep 2021, 8:01 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
MaxE wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Nicklaus Sandman?

I think you mean Nicholas Sandmann. That little twit deserves whatever he gets. If I were headmaster of any school at which he was a pupil, I would have expelled him immediately for besmirching the school's good name. Unfortunately, the school he attends has far lower standards and no sense of shame.

Sandmann didn't do anything but stand there while Mr Philips got up in his face. What exactly was Sandmann supposed to do?


Why are you resurrecting the spectre of that teen brat? The Covington kids got away with bad behaviour and got paid.



DW_a_mom
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10 Sep 2021, 8:06 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
MaxE wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
Nicklaus Sandman?

I think you mean Nicholas Sandmann. That little twit deserves whatever he gets. If I were headmaster of any school at which he was a pupil, I would have expelled him immediately for besmirching the school's good name. Unfortunately, the school he attends has far lower standards and no sense of shame.

Sandmann didn't do anything but stand there while Mr Philips got up in his face. What exactly was Sandmann supposed to do?


Why are you resurrecting the spectre of that teen brat? The Covington kids got away with bad behaviour and got paid.


While the context was cut from MaxE's quote of Mr Reynholm's name drop, I am pretty certain Mr Reynholm was responding with an example to something I wrote. An appropriate example, I might add. Read back.

Twice I'm defending a poster I never agree with.


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Last edited by DW_a_mom on 10 Sep 2021, 8:10 pm, edited 3 times in total.

cyberdad
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10 Sep 2021, 8:07 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Oddly, I don't recall a lot of monkey stuff aimed at Obama,


Selective amnesia is a wonderful thing
https://news.yahoo.com/5-times-republic ... 42092.html
https://www.wibw.com/content/news/GOP-h ... 25741.html

In addition to GOP politicians there was literally thousands of photoshopped monkey images shared by republicans during Obama's presidency.



King0fSpades
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10 Sep 2021, 8:13 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Oddly, I don't recall a lot of monkey stuff aimed at Obama,


Selective amnesia is a wonderful thing
https://news.yahoo.com/5-times-republic ... 42092.html
https://www.wibw.com/content/news/GOP-h ... 25741.html

In addition to GOP politicians there was literally thousands of photoshopped monkey images shared by republicans during Obama's presidency.


I seem to remember when I was in high school my senior year around the time he was elected there were things written on the bathroom walls like "Keep the White House WHITE!" and the running joke among my fellow Georgia classmates was "I want to see him get shot on live TV when he gives his inauguration speech."

:|


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cyberdad
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10 Sep 2021, 10:12 pm

King0fSpades wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
Oddly, I don't recall a lot of monkey stuff aimed at Obama,


Selective amnesia is a wonderful thing
https://news.yahoo.com/5-times-republic ... 42092.html
https://www.wibw.com/content/news/GOP-h ... 25741.html

In addition to GOP politicians there was literally thousands of photoshopped monkey images shared by republicans during Obama's presidency.


I seem to remember when I was in high school my senior year around the time he was elected there were things written on the bathroom walls like "Keep the White House WHITE!" and the running joke among my fellow Georgia classmates was "I want to see him get shot on live TV when he gives his inauguration speech."
:|


I have a ample evidence from literally hundreds of news stories from the time of his inauguration onward that a huge amount of the opposition to Obama's presidency was to do with his skin colour and not his character/competency/aptitude.

Since the early days of his 2008 campaign, signs at early protests spoke volumes: “Obama’s Plan: White Slavery” and “The American Taxpayers Are the Jews for Obama’s Ovens.” Some played on racist stereotypes: “Obama: What You Talkin’ About, Willis? Spend My Money.” Others tagged him “Traitor to the Constitution” and “Sambo,” or played on his ancestral homeland: “Ken-ya Trust Obama?” it's all there on the record. you can google the placards at every republican march between 2008-2016.

This last message was, of course, a hallmark of the birthers, who formalized racist attacks into a movement by claiming that Obama, despite his Hawaiian birth certificate, was born in Kenya—or that he was really a citizen of Indonesia, or that he had dual British and American citizenship at birth. The sick attempt to paint Obama as un-American—a closet socialist, a secret Muslim and a hater of democracy, no less—didn’t stop there, echoing over the years in the feverish rantings of figures like Dinesh D’Souza, who claimed Obama was motivated by “an inherited rage” against American wealth and power from his anti-colonialist Kenyan father. On TV, Glenn Beck asserted that Obama had “a deep-seated hatred for white people,” while Rush Limbaugh spewed a steady stream of invective on his radio show, from playing a song dubbed “Barack the Magic Negro” to claiming that Obama wanted Americans to get Ebola as payback for slavery. The most infamous birther, Donald Trump, questioned, without basis, not just Obama’s birth certificate, but his college transcript and whether he had truly deserved a spot at Harvard Law School.

I don't doubt for a minute that many of the GOP used Obama's race to scare white Americans on the fence on Obama. It was all very plainly dirty politics.



Dox47
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10 Sep 2021, 10:15 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Selective amnesia is a wonderful thing
https://news.yahoo.com/5-times-republic ... 42092.html
https://www.wibw.com/content/news/GOP-h ... 25741.html

In addition to GOP politicians there was literally thousands of photoshopped monkey images shared by republicans during Obama's presidency.


You know what I can and cannot recall? Isn't thinking you can read minds a sign of mental illness? Better turn yourself in to the state so they can strip your civil rights away, wouldn't want to be a hypocrite.


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10 Sep 2021, 10:26 pm

Uncle Tom
/ˌəNGkəl ˈtäm/
noun - OFFENSIVE•NORTH AMERICAN
Definition: a black man considered to be excessively obedient or servile to white people; a person regarded as betraying their cultural or social allegiance. E.G., "he called moderates Uncle Toms."

by the above definition, HOW is that Elder piece of work NOT an "uncle tom"? HOW is he NOT selling his POC brethren down the river 18 ways past sunday? i gots to know. :scratch:



cyberdad
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10 Sep 2021, 10:32 pm

auntblabby wrote:
Uncle Tom
/ˌəNGkəl ˈtäm/
noun - OFFENSIVE•NORTH AMERICAN
Definition: a black man considered to be excessively obedient or servile to white people; a person regarded as betraying their cultural or social allegiance. E.G., "he called moderates Uncle Toms."

by the above definition, HOW is that Elder piece of work NOT an "uncle tom"? HOW is he NOT selling his POC brethren down the river 18 ways past sunday? i gots to know. :scratch:


Apparently accusations of reverse racism is the new black :lol:

Back in the 1990s people knew who he was
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm ... story.html



Dox47
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10 Sep 2021, 10:54 pm

auntblabby wrote:
Uncle Tom
/ˌəNGkəl ˈtäm/
noun - OFFENSIVE•NORTH AMERICAN
Definition: a black man considered to be excessively obedient or servile to white people; a person regarded as betraying their cultural or social allegiance. E.G., "he called moderates Uncle Toms."

by the above definition, HOW is that Elder piece of work NOT an "uncle tom"? HOW is he NOT selling his POC brethren down the river 18 ways past sunday? i gots to know. :scratch:


The problem is that it's a racial insult, that you're insulting a black man for having politics that are completely unremarkable, and would not be remarked upon if held by a white man. Calling educated black people Oreos, or assimilated Asians bananas or coconuts is similar, it's best not to try to police people's beliefs based on their race. As far as being "accurate", a generally agreed to be beyond the pale slur for black people literally means "ignorant" in it's original definition, but I wouldn't try to argue that the term is okay to use if the person you're using it on actually is ignorant, it's best to simply avoid racial slurs, including Uncle Tom.


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cyberdad
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10 Sep 2021, 10:59 pm

Dox47 wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
Uncle Tom
/ˌəNGkəl ˈtäm/
noun - OFFENSIVE•NORTH AMERICAN
Definition: a black man considered to be excessively obedient or servile to white people; a person regarded as betraying their cultural or social allegiance. E.G., "he called moderates Uncle Toms."

by the above definition, HOW is that Elder piece of work NOT an "uncle tom"? HOW is he NOT selling his POC brethren down the river 18 ways past sunday? i gots to know. :scratch:


The problem is that it's a racial insult, that you're insulting a black man for having politics that are completely unremarkable, and would not be remarked upon if held by a white man. Calling educated black people Oreos, or assimilated Asians bananas or coconuts is similar, it's best not to try to police people's beliefs based on their race. As far as being "accurate", a generally agreed to be beyond the pale slur for black people literally means "ignorant" in it's original definition, but I wouldn't try to argue that the term is okay to use if the person you're using it on actually is ignorant, it's best to simply avoid racial slurs, including Uncle Tom.


Except when black people call him the term.



DW_a_mom
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10 Sep 2021, 11:08 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
Uncle Tom
/ˌəNGkəl ˈtäm/
noun - OFFENSIVE•NORTH AMERICAN
Definition: a black man considered to be excessively obedient or servile to white people; a person regarded as betraying their cultural or social allegiance. E.G., "he called moderates Uncle Toms."

by the above definition, HOW is that Elder piece of work NOT an "uncle tom"? HOW is he NOT selling his POC brethren down the river 18 ways past sunday? i gots to know. :scratch:


The problem is that it's a racial insult, that you're insulting a black man for having politics that are completely unremarkable, and would not be remarked upon if held by a white man. Calling educated black people Oreos, or assimilated Asians bananas or coconuts is similar, it's best not to try to police people's beliefs based on their race. As far as being "accurate", a generally agreed to be beyond the pale slur for black people literally means "ignorant" in it's original definition, but I wouldn't try to argue that the term is okay to use if the person you're using it on actually is ignorant, it's best to simply avoid racial slurs, including Uncle Tom.


Except when black people call him the term.


The thought leaders in the black community that I listen to don’t like or use the term. They might say someone’s ideas or behavior are “concerning” or “regrettable.” The only person allowed to use a term like that would be someone who sees themselves as fitting it. I don’t think anyone does.


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cyberdad
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10 Sep 2021, 11:11 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
Uncle Tom
/ˌəNGkəl ˈtäm/
noun - OFFENSIVE•NORTH AMERICAN
Definition: a black man considered to be excessively obedient or servile to white people; a person regarded as betraying their cultural or social allegiance. E.G., "he called moderates Uncle Toms."

by the above definition, HOW is that Elder piece of work NOT an "uncle tom"? HOW is he NOT selling his POC brethren down the river 18 ways past sunday? i gots to know. :scratch:


The problem is that it's a racial insult, that you're insulting a black man for having politics that are completely unremarkable, and would not be remarked upon if held by a white man. Calling educated black people Oreos, or assimilated Asians bananas or coconuts is similar, it's best not to try to police people's beliefs based on their race. As far as being "accurate", a generally agreed to be beyond the pale slur for black people literally means "ignorant" in it's original definition, but I wouldn't try to argue that the term is okay to use if the person you're using it on actually is ignorant, it's best to simply avoid racial slurs, including Uncle Tom.


Except when black people call him the term.


The thought leaders in the black community that I listen to don’t like or use the term. They might say someone’s ideas or behavior are “concerning” or “regrettable.” The only person allowed to use a term like that would be someone who sees themselves as fitting it. I don’t think anyone does.


Somewhat ironic given the book that gave rise to the caricature was actually an anti-slavery novel. I'm also not sure whether you, I or Dox can dictate how black people should speak to (or about) people in their own community?