Is God Santa Claus for adults?

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Everyone can define their own values. But what does this have to do with fact? And why do you keep conflating the two?

I was addressing values to see what Atheist fight to prove. It wasn't a question of religion or morality. It exploded again. I actually enjoyed myself talking to others. The common line is miscommunication.

Best Regards,

Jake

Because I really want to know what you as a Atheist believe and fight hard to prove! Tell me why you are an Atheist? Is it out of some under-lying causes?

Last edited by NAKnight on 03 Dec 2012, 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

i didnt touch on morals as such, morals are values just like anything else, miscomunication indeed.

asnwer me this: what is your actual point?
what would it mean if a single atheist or even a group fought to prove something?(which by the way isnt what is happening here, people are simply correcting fallacies)

now my point is as follows and only as follows;
-you cannot compare values and fact,
-values are inherently subjective and as such not something inherently shared if no distinct connection has been created.

**edit**

why is he obviously agitated?

also the whole point people here are trying to make is that there is no common atheist thing that people fight to prove,
there are some things some peope fight to prove and some other things other people fight to prove thats it.

Last edited by Oodain on 03 Dec 2012, 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yes. Despite numerous communication problems between us (seems to be an issue you have with other members too ). Anyway; I don't have time to debate this evening, but communication foul ups aside I'm quite enjoying the debate.

Lets make a deal, then:

If you answer (and I mean *answer*, not just straw-man the beliefs of the person you are debating with) these two questions:

Why do you continue to conflate the concepts of value and fact?
Why do you continue to describe atheism as a value system when it is only an absence of belief?

... Then I will answer what I as an atheist believe and fight hard to prove.

My point is this; You debate me as a Atheist I respect that I believe there is more to that though. I was asking about your values. Because if I know what you value, I could probably find some common ground or help you understand your belief better by engaging your values. My point is this, Atheists have values. They base their decisions upon those values. Those values were created either by choice or by circumstance. I am trying to get to the root cause.

This turned out to be another unnecessary session of senseless arguments and failures of communication.
I don't mind though, after all I may not know your story personally and I should not have a right to know.
Let's just be civilized and agree to disagree?


Best Regards,

Jake

why are you trying to get to the root cause and do you think that it is a common cause?

who says he is debating you as an atheist, again i tink you fix a value to atheism that isnt there, it is a lack of another value that is atheism, not a distinct value in itself.

Predicting inevitable decline into Thread-Lock: Have you ever considered staying on-topic?

Oh, and are you pulling a "trolling is a art" on me by continuously using the term "a Atheist"?

I'm trying to get to the root cause because maybe I would like to help! People don't just wake up and say "Gee I'm going to be an Atheist today" I know that for certain. There is an underlying cause. If they don't want to say then I don't mind.

Best Regards,

Jake

Atheists tend to separate their values from the fact that they're atheists. This goes back to the "Atheism is a negative position" statement I made a few pages ago; atheism itself doesn't provide any values or beliefs. Generally, and in no way speaking for All Atheists Ever, I've found that your average atheist chooses to take up values either because they feel they're demonstrably positive, because they were raised with those values, or because the belief 'feels right' to them. Not every atheist rigorously tests their beliefs, and we're just as prone to being reactionary a**holes as anyone else is. Others, like Tallyman, tend to subject anything they believe in to rigorous scrutiny.

Essentially, being an atheist doesn't make you a scientist, a democrat, a conservative. It doesn't mean you're pro-anything or anti-anything. Each atheist has individual reasons for the remainder of their beliefs, and those beliefs tend to be very personal, since each of us has a different reason for taking up those beliefs.

Dude, this is a forum. I'm leaving my point and resting my case.
I really don't know who you are. You debate the side of an Atheist so I thought you were one. I mean, you sound pretty frustrated honestly. So I must've hit some truth there.
I'm not going to lose sleep over this. What's wrong with me challenging your value system? Does it make it right just because in your mind it is right?

On that note, I appreciate it but I'm leaving.

Best Regards,

Jake

that is where i think you make a dangerous assumption when dealing with people.

cultures are different as is personal experience, there doesnt have to an underlying personal cause any more than there has to be an absence of one for any given value, there is a cultural and counter cultural causes that can wheigh the odds in a certain direction but how connected this is to actual neurology is impossible to say at the moment, without data of that caliber any such discussion is senseless.

You're leaving already? Does this mean I get to pass the bridge for free?

Trolling, trolling, trolling, get those discussions going

Take a deep breath breath


Best Regards,

Jake

And finally, the troll shows its true colours.

Now the good posters on WP actually providing content can safely ignore you permanently without feeling guilty.