Income Inequality in America

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Can it not be genuine anger?

How is it right that some people can graft and work hard all their lives for a pittance while some freeloaders like Paris Hilton and the Kardashian sisters get to coast on easy street their whole lives?

Of course; but feeling anger toward someone else for their success is jealousy.


The Hilton family gained their wealth through their hotel chain, and Paris Hilton was born into a wealthy family. There is nothing wrong with that.

As for the Kardashians, there is This Wikipedia Article, an excerpt of which appears below.


So, the Kardashians have not exactly been "Freeloading"; they seem to have put for at least some effort to get where they are today, and there is nothing wrong with that, either.

Of course, it helped both of these families that there was a first generation that managed to acquire wealth on its own.

I think you're mis-using the word "graft" here. It means "the unscrupulous use of a politician's authority for personal gain"; is this what you meant?

If you work hard at a job that requires no skills, then you are likely to be paid minimum wages. If your job requires specialized skills, or skills that require four years of college or law school to learn, then you will be paid a lot more; and if you've invented or you own something that everybody can't seem to live without, then you deserve to receive whatever your customers are willing to pay.

Stop obsessing about what other people have, and develop the skills it takes to get what you want instead.

I think your interlocutor will resent anyone getting seconds until everyone gets firsts. Some people are like that.

They do not comprehend that life is unfair and sh*t happens.

ruveyn

Still, it is a truism that needs to be repeated, and repeated often.

I don't feel envy for what the rich have, or anger because I lack it. Rather, I feel anger when I see those who control the engines of capitalism move industries overseas in order to save what is the equivalent a a few dollars for them, thereby placing the hoarding of a little money over a sense of country and the well being of their fellow Americans. I feel anger when the rich are given huge tax breaks when they hardly need it, causing social services those in need depend on to be cut. And I feel anger when the rich pour millions of dollars into campaigns that seek to disenfranchise fellow Americans who are the most vulnerable. So no, it's no always about being covetous.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer

ointment

Clarify please?

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/fly- ... tment.html

It is a running gag me and someone has. I couldn't resist. Laughing What you said reminded me of it and I was laughing my butt off.


Seriously, why do both you and Fnord keep focusing on our emotional state? Why does it matter to you if any of us obsess over what other people have or not? What do the properties of life have to do with knowing what one is supposed to do to succeed in America whatsoever. For me, all of this is irrelevant.

Why does my attitude keep getting focused more then the actual ability to do something? Why is my attitude focused on so much by American society?

What exactly is the extent of control one has over his circumstances? It is treated as though that one's attitude is the building blocks of time and space itself, why is this? What does my attitude have to do with my ability and the knowledge of how to do something.

Will you read what I have written here. http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt206352.html

For me, it doesn't matter what my disposition is or what I believe or not. For me, it is irrelevant whether I believe I can or can't do x. It matters if I can truthfully do x or not. There is an objective reality outside of ourselves. If I believe I can't do x then either I lack a prerequisite skill, I'm seeing it wrong, or it is something else altogether. Instead of attempting to help investigate or at least saying they do not know they focus on my attitude and positive affirmations. You and Fnord do the same thing.

Why? What is the underlying reasoning? If I am wrong about how society works and anything else I just want to know where I am wrong and why and what the correct way is and why?

I do not oppose what people have nor am I envious by the way. I don't even know how you Rueven and Fnord come to this logic. My issue with America and the culture is the underlying beliefs that do not have any basis in reasoning I can grasp.

Here is another thing I do not grasp either. Why is it considered taboo to blame society whatsoever for any reason? What is the basis for this? This implies to me that the standards that the Americans today have are never wrong? I do not agree with this whatsoever. This is a fallacy of the appeal to the masses. The majority can be wrong about something.

For whatever reason most people including you two keeps focusing on the tenets. Why?

In detail and specifics what are the inherent requirements to making it in America whatsoever?

The thing is Ruven and Fnord, I do not understand what you two are trying to convey and what people are trying to convey with attitude. Would you two clarify further if you two do not mind?

I notice the ad hominem "you're just jealous" is something that comes out when people are too block headed and/or intellectually dishonest to argue with reason.

Money is power, power is a zero sum game, if most of the population stagnates whilst say 5% make out like bandits and double and triple their wealth and income, they also capture power, and that power is taken from the rest of us, they may say that the people who stagnate still live well, but they lose ground in the power department and that is not a question of jealousy, this is a question of defending what one has... for those who take more power get to rewrite the rules further to permit them to accumulate even more power at the expense of everyone else, a process that will cause a declining standard of living for the rest of us and perhaps, if the tendency continues, complete enslavement. To prevent that, anything is justified. It's survival, not jealousy.

I think some people do not understand the difference between reason and rationalization. The former is about looking for truth and finding solutions. The latter is about trying to manipulate people into thinking a certain way.

Did you get my pm?

I think it is more likely a personality type. Some personality types think in what do I have to deal in now and what is now? Others deal in possibilities and what may be in the future.

http://www.personalitypathways.com/type_inventory.html

Last edited by cubedemon6073 on 16 Mar 2013, 11:30 am, edited 2 times in total.

As I've said, "If anyone can point to a current political and economic system that has completely eliminated poverty, yet still allows for its citizens to become wealthy without exploiting others, I'd like to know about it." What could be more reasonable than that?

Feeling anger toward someone just because they have earned something that you didn't earn for yourself is jealousy, plain and simple. If that is not jealousy, then what else could it be?

I've been poor and homeless, and during that time, I also blamed others for my poverty and felt anger toward them for their wealth. Then I stopped whining, grew up, enlisted in the Navy, and made something of myself. So, I know what I'm talking about.

No one gains respect by pointing fingers and crying "Unfair!" when someone else earns success; admiration is not the reward for those who accuse ambitious, determined, and hard-working people of doing nothing to earn their wealth; and nobody will ever be considered anything but a loser for never having tried to be a success.

There will be none because the problem isn't political or economic. The problem is human nature. The solution is that others would have to decide to help those who need it. The solution is within each of us and can't come from outside.



All you are stating is what. This has been said many times by others as well. What I lack is the underlying rationale and essence to these beliefs. Why is it ignoble to blame others or any other external entities no matter what situation they're in? What about those in the concentration camps? Why would those in the concentration camps be wrong for blaming the Nazis for what they did to them? I do not follow your thought process whatsoever?

How do you derive that any of us is jealous whatsoever of anyone's success? How do you derive this conclusion? All I want to know is the reasoning behind your belief of this extreme internal locus that you have. Why is any belief whatsoever in external locus of control fallacious?

There is a quote that says that my attitude is more important than the facts. How is this so? How is this derived? What is Charles charles swindoll's reasoning behind this? Why is confidence required for success in America? Why do I have to believe in myself in order to have success? Why does my attitude matter so much in American society?

The problem is a cultural one. Americans will never see "redistribution" as a necessary check to prevent social and economic crisis in a system with a systemic flaw. They can't ever see the forest for the trees. When Americans hear the word "redistribution" they think in terms of transfer payments only, i.e. "welfare checks". In American thinking "redistribution" is by definition "unearned income". A certain segment of the population just can't wrap their heads around anything beyond that notion.

They don't think in terms of research investment or infrastructure spending which both puts more money in people's pockets and improves standard of living through the needed work that gets done. The problem is wealthy investors see no point in giving their money to repair a crumbling bridge. It's not seen as worth fixing until the bridge falls into the water killing 50 people and inconveniencing the shipment of their goods. They'd rather give their money to a museum or theater or some charitable foundation they can put their name on. There's nothing wrong "redistribution" going to arts or culture, but the wealthy class misses less glamorous things that actually have to be done to keep society running smoothly, which includes both infrastructure development and making sure there's enough employment and income to keep people reasonably happy and not living on the streets stealing from each other and killing each other to survive.


Well, it seems like we've lost the middle ground possibility. With the tax and income distribution the way it is here in the US it's no longer possible to fuel economic growth without also fueling debt growth. A lot of our cities are starting to look like the third world.

Again, this is like arguing with a toaster oven. You just don't f***ing get it.


And you wouldn't have been able to enlist in the Navy without government paying for that. Where do you think that money comes from? Right now our military is going to get hit with cuts leaving less for future people like you. All because certain people I am supposedly jealous of refuse to pay a dime more in taxes. We are now also less safe from being attacked and it's not a good time to be unprepared if you're following current world events.


This is not just about "unfair". It's about our survival as a nation. Seriously, get over yourself.