Iran's Getting Ugly

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timeisdead
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23 Jun 2009, 3:06 am

pakled wrote:

yup...all those who backed the Shah originally, wound up over here and other places.
Who wants to destroy Iran? Most of us just want them to leave us alone, and we'll leave them alone. Now if we can just get our respective governments to agree...

Indeed. Much of the Iran's brightest and best left after the ousting of the Shah. I am in full support of the Iranian protesters. I'm cheering for them as they bravely stand up against their repressive theocratic government.

Oggleleus
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23 Jun 2009, 10:19 am

Anyone remember the embassy takeover in 1979? I do. The U.S. has enemies, but not like this regime in Iran. It is a tough trick for the Mullahs to balance their hate for America and their own people.

The regime in Iran is like a couple of thieves sneaking up behind an old lady, mugging her, killing her and then stealing her keys to go live in her apartment for the next 30 years, all while looking out the windows every 20 minutes to make sure no one has figured it out yet. The regime is still so caught up in covering up their "crime" that the regime has little time to actually make life better for its citizens. Nuclear power is not going to fix the issues with "vice" squads and "thought" police.

monty
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23 Jun 2009, 10:37 am

Wombat wrote:

"Afghanistan was behind 9/11 so lets invade them.

Whoops they weren't.

Actually, Al Qaeda in Afghanistan was behind 9/11, and the Taleban government refused to turn them over to the US. So the government of Afghanistan wasn't the prime culprit, but they were (at minimum) accessories after the fact.

Which is very different from the situation in Iraq, where the Bush government sought a flimsy pretext to do what they had long wanted to do.

MDD123
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23 Jun 2009, 10:58 am

ruveyn wrote:

Master_Pedant wrote:

Tehran braces for crackdown as protesters vow to defy Khamenei

All I can hope is that nobody (be it the conservative elite in Iran or the Hawks in America and Israel) try anything stupid. This situation could easily escalate into catastrophe.

Let us apply some logic. Clearly if Iran disappeared tomorrow it would be good for America. Right? So whenever Iranian A kills Iranian B it is a step in the right direction. No matter how this turns out, good will come of it. Dead Iranians are better Iranians than live Iranians.

Rejoice!

ruveyn

That's a terrible thing to say. Most of those Iranians don't deserve to die, hell you don't even deserve to die even though you lack some basic compassion. Half the country just wants to live their life free of an overbearing government and the other half seems to be more than happy to spill some blood. I just hope that the reasonable ones are allowed to leave Iran for a more tolerant country, it has to be hard to lose a country you were raised to love though.

Oggleleus
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23 Jun 2009, 12:44 pm

MDD123 wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

Master_Pedant wrote:

ruveyn is being a realist.

There are plenty of anti-american people in this country that we could exchange for some freedom loving Iranians. Heck, I'd even be up for a 2 for 1 special. 2 liberals for 1 Iranian. The liberals would not even have to go through American Flag Burning training upon their arrival in Iran and could show them a thing or two about effigy construction.

monty
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23 Jun 2009, 3:31 pm

Quote:

Clearly if Iran disappeared tomorrow it would be good for America. Right?

Clearly, you think that other nations should exist only if it pleases you.

Oggleleus wrote:

So whenever Iranian A kills Iranian B it is a step in the right direction. No matter how this turns out, good will come of it. Dead Iranians are better Iranians than live Iranians.

Oh, I see ... we first established a desired end, and now we can justify murder as the means to get there.

Quote:

There are plenty of anti-american people in this country that we could exchange for some freedom loving Iranians. Heck, I'd even be up for a 2 for 1 special. 2 liberals for 1 Iranian. The liberals would not even have to go through American Flag Burning training upon their arrival in Iran and could show them a thing or two about effigy construction.

LOL - conservative Americans are more like conservative Iranians than they like to admit:

1) Favor theocracy and religious rule (as long as it is their interpretation being imposed on others)
2) Harbor nostalgia and long to return to the good old days -
3) Misogynist/homophobic: women should dress appropriately and gays should disappear. Jail Janet Jackson for showing cleavage.
4) Love to talk tough - may or not be a repressive a@@hole as a result
5) Hate those damn liberal protesters who are screwing up the country - like the Mousavi crowd today in Iran!
6) Believe that the truth is simple or black/white ... nuance is for pansies.

Henriksson
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23 Jun 2009, 4:24 pm

EDIT: Never mind.

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phil777
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23 Jun 2009, 4:50 pm

small offtopic comment, Henrik, i rather liked your previous avatar, this one looks so gloomy and dark.

Henriksson
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23 Jun 2009, 4:52 pm

phil777 wrote:

small offtopic comment, Henrik, i rather liked your previous avatar, this one looks so gloomy and dark.

I shall haunt your nightmares forever.

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phil777
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23 Jun 2009, 4:54 pm

Noooooo! <.<

xenon13
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24 Jun 2009, 12:35 am

Looks like Khamenei and Ahmadinejad have won this round...

Incidentally, anyone saw the article linking Mousavi to the Marine barracks bombing in Lebanon in 1983? To think that the prime minister of Iraq also was involved.

MDD123
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24 Jun 2009, 2:20 am

Do we mean anti-American or world concious here? I'm more than willing to step up to the plate for my country, I have in the past. But I know the score, we have a track record of imposing ourselves on other countries, this doesn't give them the right to violently attack us, but it doesn't give us the right to violently attack them for expressing hatred. If I ever met the men responsible for ending my commerad's lives back in Iraq, I would probably be as violent as some of you sound, but just because a man with a chip on his shoulder dreams of our destruction doesn't mean we need to invade their country and change their way of life to suit our needs. I understand myself as a human being and I can understand others as humans too, you don't have to feel like a softie for thinking rationally.

LePetitPrince
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24 Jun 2009, 2:27 am

xenon13 wrote:

Looks like Khamenei and Ahmadinejad have won this round...

:clapping: bravo bravo. Happy now?

and oh , just an additional thought: Your conclusion is so f*****g wrong.

Ahmadinejad have won this round.

The reformists have won this round aslo by making the first bold step ever

The halt of the protest doesn't mean that the reformists have lost for ever.

The only loser in all this is The Wali el Faqih Khamenei =) , his godly image has been terribly SHAKEN in Iran, do you really understand how bold to defy the godly image of Khamenei in Iran? It was like as if you were defying Louis 14 in France. Everyone was used to fear him and no one even dared to criticize him.

The fact that protesters had defied his threats and the fact that they were even chanting "death for Khamenei" only proves that the godly image of Khamenei is no more unanimous in Iran =).

That was only step 1 toward his big fall...

phil777
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24 Jun 2009, 11:10 am

Yeah, i think Khamenei will think twice at the next elections before speaking up, or at the very least, he'll try to be a little be more neutral / moderate (that is, if he has any concern for his well-being and that of his fellow citizens...).

Oggleleus
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24 Jun 2009, 12:30 pm

monty wrote:

Quote:

Clearly if Iran disappeared tomorrow it would be good for America. Right?

Clearly, you think that other nations should exist only if it pleases you.

Oggleleus wrote:

So whenever Iranian A kills Iranian B it is a step in the right direction. No matter how this turns out, good will come of it. Dead Iranians are better Iranians than live Iranians.

Oh, I see ... we first established a desired end, and now we can justify murder as the means to get there.

Quote:

Touched a liberal nerve which thus requires a response and being quoted as saying or writing something that I never did. I think there is a little confusion here on what a liberal is and what a conservative is based on what country you live in. It is not the same across the board across the globe.

monty
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24 Jun 2009, 1:11 pm

Apologies if I messed up a nested quote and attribute things to you that you did not say. I withdraw my accidental accusation.

Yes, the idea of 'liberal' and 'conservative' do vary from place to place ... but the conservative mindset and the liberal mindset are somewhat universal. There is some evidence that these two behavioral styles are hard wired into the brain:

Quote:

The work, to be reported today in the journal Nature Neuroscience, grew out of decades of previous research suggesting that political orientation is linked to certain personality traits or styles of thinking. A review of that research published in 2003 found that conservatives tend to be more rigid and closed-minded, less tolerant of ambiguity and less open to new experiences. Some of the traits associated with conservatives in that review were decidedly unflattering, including fear, aggression and tolerance of inequality. That evoked outrage from conservative pundits.

The latest study showed “there are two cognitive styles — a liberal style and a conservative style,” said UCLA neurologist Dr. Marco Iacoboni, who was not connected with the latest research.

Based on the results, Sulloway said, liberals could be expected to more readily accept new social, scientific or religious ideas.

Amodio said it would be a mistake to conclude that one political orientation was better than another. The tendency of conservatives to block distracting information could be a good thing depending on the situation, he said. Positions on specific issues are influenced by many factors, he noted.

http://psychcentral.com/news/2007/09/10 ... /1691.html

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