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Dox47
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04 Jul 2009, 2:37 pm

claire333 wrote:
I sometimes wonder if it is a bit fashionable to dislike her.


Oh most definitely, at least out here on the left coast. Then again, my perception might be a little skewed because GOP membership is a felony in the Seattle area... :lol:


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MDD123
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04 Jul 2009, 3:54 pm

If she asked for a favor (other than a vote) I'd snap to it, I feel all kinds of flattered when high and mighty types take the time for me. I don't get to fit a very good liberal stereotype with that kind of thinking, but at least I don't have to lie through my teeth. You all have to realize that I get the hots for female authority figures, I can't help but shake at the knees a little.



claire-333
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04 Jul 2009, 4:11 pm

Dox47 wrote:
claire333 wrote:
I sometimes wonder if it is a bit fashionable to dislike her.


Oh most definitely, at least out here on the left coast. Then again, my perception might be a little skewed because GOP membership is a felony in the Seattle area... :lol:
He he...the left coast...



ruveyn
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04 Jul 2009, 7:26 pm

CleverKitten wrote:

I do not believe Creationism should be taught in public schools. That's what religious private schools and churches are for! :roll:
Separation of church and state...



There shouldn't be public schools (i.e. tax funded schools) in the first place. Education is a private matter to be provided by families to their children or funded as charitable institutions voluntarily. Nor should there be legally forced schooling.

ruveyn



MDD123
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04 Jul 2009, 7:36 pm

ruveyn wrote:
CleverKitten wrote:

I do not believe Creationism should be taught in public schools. That's what religious private schools and churches are for! :roll:
Separation of church and state...



There shouldn't be public schools (i.e. tax funded schools) in the first place. Education is a private matter to be provided by families to their children or funded as charitable institutions voluntarily. Nor should there be legally forced schooling.

ruveyn


Given the careless nature of most education I find it hard to disagree with that viewpoint. But I can't imagine what the ensuing chaos would be like, I mean, look at the track record, I don't think there are many families who would be willing to provide for their children's education and the social networking a school provides would be lost. What I don't like is that a single smoker (like myself) has to shoulder the burden of educating children I didn't make. I'd rather see my tobacco tax pay for the treatment others recieve for the unhealthy decisions they make earlier in life (makes more sense). I really dislike the idea that big families (a major system stressor) get a bigger break.



Fuzzy
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04 Jul 2009, 8:18 pm

A paris hilton style publicity stunt would help her career. And fund her next run for president.


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monty
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04 Jul 2009, 8:27 pm

Well, I don't have all night, but here are 3 main points for me.

1) The Wink. The debate was a job interview. Winking or flirting at a job interview is inappropriate behavior verging on sleazy.

2) Secessionism. Her husband was a member of a party formed to break Alaska out of the United States. She attended at least one annual convention and video taped friendly greetings for other conventions of this group. While this is a popular theme among some Republicans, I consider secession to be anti-American and possibly treasonous. Last week, emails from within the McCain campaign were made public, where she was trying to get people to lie about her involvement with this group.

3) Pentecostalism. She is a member of a church which is involved in weird s**t. Not just creationism and talking in tongues. One pastor that visited several times was a ring leader in the witch hunts in Kenya. Literally, he would say that God told him that someone was a witch, and that person was run out of town. Her church is also involved in the Joel's Army/Spiritual warfare movement, which prophesizes a bloody civil war between true believers and every one else, and they are preparing for it. If you have seen the movie "Jesus Camp" you have a good idea of her religious vision for America. I don't care for theocracy, and I think Palin thinks rather favorably of the idea.

http://www.alternet.org/rights/97939



MattShizzle
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04 Jul 2009, 8:38 pm

ruveyn wrote:
CleverKitten wrote:

I do not believe Creationism should be taught in public schools. That's what religious private schools and churches are for! :roll:
Separation of church and state...



There shouldn't be public schools (i.e. tax funded schools) in the first place. Education is a private matter to be provided by families to their children or funded as charitable institutions voluntarily. Nor should there be legally forced schooling.

ruveyn


One of the worst ideas I ever heard in my life. How would people who weren't rich get an education? They either wouldn't or they'd get a second-rate one with religious indoctrination. The US is bad enough with the rich getting richer, the poor getting poorer and the middle class disappearing. What we really need is a lot more equality and a lot less "economic freedom" in this country. Also, stop being so idiotic as to allow private citizens to own hanguns and assault weapons.



Dox47
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04 Jul 2009, 9:23 pm

^
Does anyone else see the irony in someone calling privatized education a terrible idea, and then saying what the US needs is less economic freedom and more gun control, presumably because these two things have worked so well elsewhere? I'd say that the latter opinions disqualify the holder of them from serious consideration on the former, but then again this is someone who wants to jail people that exercise their private property rights... :roll:


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MattShizzle
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04 Jul 2009, 9:58 pm

Libertards really don't get it. Western Europe seems to do great with low crime rate/education while having great public education and gun control. How about Japan? Ever read about their educational success and virtually non-existant crime rate while having well funded public schools and any sort of firearm ownership by civilians illegal? Of course libertards don't deal with facts. I'd say someone who doesn't realize that is the one whose opinions should be laughed at. Personally I think most rich people should be put against the wall and their money redistributed to the poor and those who actually work rather thn exploiting others. And owning anything other than a single shot rifle or shotgun should result in a 20 year prison sentence in a prison that makes Gitmo look like Club Med.

Of course Rethuglicans are even worse than Libertards in that they want to criminalize private behavior but let the rich exploit everyone else and force their stupid mythology (Christianity) on everyone else. They make me sick.



monty
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04 Jul 2009, 10:08 pm

MattShizzle wrote:
Libertards really don't get it. Western Europe seems to do great with low crime rate/education while having great public education and gun control.


Are you sure that you get it? The word "liberal' is pejorative for liberal - and US liberals do tend to point out that Europe, Japan and Canada do quite well with education, health care and crime.



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04 Jul 2009, 10:24 pm

There's nothing wrong with changing a system that doesn't work for you. I don't care what kind of label I get, if you want me to stop harrassing the system, then change it, because one of my basic rights is calling the system out for not working and I do a good job.



Dox47
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05 Jul 2009, 12:25 am

MattShizzle wrote:
Libertards really don't get it. Western Europe seems to do great with low crime rate/education while having great public education and gun control. How about Japan? Ever read about their educational success and virtually non-existant crime rate while having well funded public schools and any sort of firearm ownership by civilians illegal? Of course libertards don't deal with facts. I'd say someone who doesn't realize that is the one whose opinions should be laughed at. Personally I think most rich people should be put against the wall and their money redistributed to the poor and those who actually work rather thn exploiting others. And owning anything other than a single shot rifle or shotgun should result in a 20 year prison sentence in a prison that makes Gitmo look like Club Med.

Of course Rethuglicans are even worse than Libertards in that they want to criminalize private behavior but let the rich exploit everyone else and force their stupid mythology (Christianity) on everyone else. They make me sick.


Wow, this well thought out and mature response really showed me, nothing says "reasonable" and "intelligent" quite like making up derogatory nicknames for people you disagree with while advocating mass executions of the successful... :roll:. I might also point out that you seem to like guns just fine when they're being used to "put people up against the wall" as you so artfully put it, and seem quite eager to use force in order to get your way, since you obviously aren't going to get it through your verbiage :roll: :roll: :roll:. It says a lot about you that you aren't even willing to get your hands dirty doing your own thuggery, you'd prefer some other poor bastards to do the hard work while you sit at home and congratulate yourself for being so progressive. I would say that people like you are precisely why I own enough hardware to equip a regiment, but that would sound paranoid, and in fact I like people like you Matt, I don't have to waste my time discrediting your views since you do such a much better job at it than I ever could, all by yourself.


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Dox47
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05 Jul 2009, 12:40 am

monty wrote:
MattShizzle wrote:
Libertards really don't get it. Western Europe seems to do great with low crime rate/education while having great public education and gun control.


Are you sure that you get it? The word "liberal' is pejorative for liberal - and US liberals do tend to point out that Europe, Japan and Canada do quite well with education, health care and crime.


Notice he said libertards, he thinks he's being clever by creating a contraction of the words libertarian (which he obviously suspects I am) and ret*d. He then later does something similar with Republican, presumably to cover all his bases as to my political affiliation. Mattshizzle is 35. I don't think I need to say anything else... :lol:

I would like to point out though that Japan in particular has a completely homogeneous culture and a strict societal code that restrict violent behavior more than any prohibitions ever have. They never had guns in the first place except briefly during one of the Shogun eras. They didn't like that they enabled any lowly peasant to defeat an armed an armored Samurai, so they banned them from the 1600s or so till the late 19th century, so they never had them in any number in the first place. They were only able to do that because of their physical isolation, much to their chagrin when armed foreigners showed up on their doorstep. As far as Western Europe goes, don't make me laugh. Half of those countries are in the hole financially or have 30% or more of their populations working for the government, and they've got plenty of crime, just not so much gun crime. No one has ever had their crime rates fall due to gun control, because guns are not the cause of violent crime.

Also, notice that the gun rights advocate is disagreeing with someone using words, while the gun control advocate is agitating for mass murder of his ideological opponents. Where have we heard that before?


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MDD123
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05 Jul 2009, 12:57 am

Guns are just a touchy subject, no one can predict the next time someone will have a bad day and use a gun for an outlet. All I have to say is that if the police were able to know ahead themselves, I'd be in in favor of stricter gun control.



Dox47
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05 Jul 2009, 1:16 am

MDD123 wrote:
Guns are just a touchy subject, no one can predict the next time someone will have a bad day and use a gun for an outlet. All I have to say is that if the police were able to know ahead themselves, I'd be in in favor of stricter gun control.


Touchy subject or not, I don't think someone can reasonably expect to advocate for the mass murder of their political opponents (using guns no less!), then expect to have any credibility whatsoever concerning this, or for that matter any other subject. I'll just stand back and enjoy the sure to ensue display of auto-podiatary marksmanship... :lol:


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