Supreme court ruling on corporations and politics

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auntblabby
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14 Feb 2010, 9:30 am

if it were up to a vote of the people there would still be slavery. since ill-informed [for the most part] voters elect politicians into office, and since politicians select supreme court justices, it is ultimately the american voters' fault when we get rulings such as this. freedom [for the common man] and ignorance cannot coexist.

the corporations will now dump heretofore unequalled sums into campaigns supporting their fascist candidates, outspending the unions by multiples, thus drowning out any real political debate, and completing this nation's transition to a true corporate oligarchy- UNLESS CONGRESS ACTS NOW! but 41 will block any such move. thanks for bloody nothing, massachusetts! god help us all.

no other western nation allows such a lopsided apportionment of political power to the monied classes as this nation, and it will be our downfall, for the love of money is the root of all evil- that money is power, power corrupts and that absolute power corrupts absolutely. anybody who cannot "get" this is just part of the problem.



Jacoby
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14 Feb 2010, 4:59 pm

auntblabby wrote:
if it were up to a vote of the people there would still be slavery. since ill-informed [for the most part] voters elect politicians into office, and since politicians select supreme court justices, it is ultimately the american voters' fault when we get rulings such as this. freedom [for the common man] and ignorance cannot coexist.

the corporations will now dump heretofore unequalled sums into campaigns supporting their fascist candidates, outspending the unions by multiples, thus drowning out any real political debate, and completing this nation's transition to a true corporate oligarchy- UNLESS CONGRESS ACTS NOW! but 41 will block any such move. thanks for bloody nothing, massachusetts! god help us all.

no other western nation allows such a lopsided apportionment of political power to the monied classes as this nation, and it will be our downfall, for the love of money is the root of all evil- that money is power, power corrupts and that absolute power corrupts absolutely. anybody who cannot "get" this is just part of the problem.


You mean like they did in 2008? :roll:

McCain/Feingold = irrelevant for the most part. In fact it made it even harder to tell where the money came from. The only difference now is that you might see ads from the NRA or NOW or whatever a month before elections.



xenon13
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15 Feb 2010, 4:55 pm

Courts also ruled that media outlets are puppets of their owners and that the journalists are obligated to serve as mouthpieces for these owners, that to do otherwise is to violate free speech rights. This includes the right to force journalists to lie for them. The case of the Fox reporters in Florida established that. There was a more recent case in California where a court ruled that the owner of a media outlet had the right to fire journalists for wanting to organise a union, because the owner's free speech rights gave him absolute power over who can serve as his mouthpiece. Thus, if a mouthpiece decides to join a union, it's the right of the owner to say that this mouthpiece does not adequately transmit his free speech and thus should be terminated despite other labour laws on the books.



Tensu
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15 Feb 2010, 5:20 pm

I don't see how letting corperations donate to campagin funds affects democrocy in any way. It's their money. They can spend it any way they want.



Sand
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15 Feb 2010, 5:48 pm

Tensu wrote:
I don't see how letting corperations donate to campagin funds affects democrocy in any way. It's their money. They can spend it any way they want.


Look harder.



Tensu
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15 Feb 2010, 6:03 pm

It is not my job to argue your points for you.



Awesomelyglorious
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15 Feb 2010, 6:24 pm

Tensu wrote:
It is not my job to argue your points for you.

Sand has some point in that corporations, if they are allowed to spend money to promote any candidate at will, then they can use these funds to promote greater marketing research and fill up all available media with this information in order to push more easily manipulated people for voting for their favored candidate.

It is also true that this does not directly impact the fact that people are still voting for their favored candidate. I think some have actually argued that more private funding increases voter interest.



Tensu
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15 Feb 2010, 6:44 pm

Sand seems to make the assumption that all corperations are inherently evil.

If I where rich, and wanted to use that money to back, say, a third party candidate because I believed in their ideals, the oppisite ruling on this matter would prevent that. That is not fair.



Awesomelyglorious
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15 Feb 2010, 7:36 pm

Tensu wrote:
Sand seems to make the assumption that all corperations are inherently evil.

If I where rich, and wanted to use that money to back, say, a third party candidate because I believed in their ideals, the oppisite ruling on this matter would prevent that. That is not fair.

Corporations are inherently evil. Ok, that's somewhat of a joke, but corporations survive by maintaining their profitability. Corporate conscience isn't at the heart of their operation, only profitability.

You aren't a corporation. Corporations are profit-seeking entities, that's why they exist, that's why they continue to exist, also if they die then the lack of profits is the reason for that as well.



Tensu
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15 Feb 2010, 7:41 pm

If corperations are corrupt, it is because consumers have made them so.

If it becomes profitable to not be corrupt, corperations will cease to be corrupt.



Sand
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15 Feb 2010, 7:43 pm

Tensu wrote:
If corperations are corrupt, it is because consumers have made them so.

If it becomes profitable to not be corrupt, corperations will cease to be corrupt.


Are you looking to blame someone for what is or are you willing to accept what exists?



Awesomelyglorious
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15 Feb 2010, 7:46 pm

Tensu wrote:
If corperations are corrupt, it is because consumers have made them so.

If it becomes profitable to not be corrupt, corperations will cease to be corrupt.

There is nothing corrupt about trying to make a buck. The issue is that we have to recognize that this is what sustains these entities, and that because of this there will always be incentives for them to try to make a buck through whatever means they can. If this means getting political parties into power for all of the wrong reasons, then companies will do so, and when asked, they'll just try to pretend to do it for the right reasons.



Tensu
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15 Feb 2010, 8:17 pm

Sand: The latter.

Awesomelyglorious: I don't care wether or not their motivations are genuine, I am not their judge. My point is that we can manipulate corperations to do the right thing, because as you said, their goal is to make a buck. And by the way I never accused that goal of being corrupt, it is just reality.



Sand
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15 Feb 2010, 8:42 pm

Tensu wrote:
Sand: The latter.

Awesomelyglorious: I don't care wether or not their motivations are genuine, I am not their judge. My point is that we can manipulate corperations to do the right thing, because as you said, their goal is to make a buck. And by the way I never accused that goal of being corrupt, it is just reality.


Who is the "we" that will manipulate corporations? Corporations are huge powerful organizations whose only real motivation is to make profit. As AG noted, that is not evil, it is mere fact.

A tiger is not evil. It is merely hungry and eats anything that is digestible which is why tigers are not in charge of day care centers because little kids are delicious. So with corporations. With their huge supply of money they will corrupt legislatures, judges, or whatever needs to be done to increase their profits. They have done it in the past and are doing it today and they cannot be trusted with political power because they are totally immoral.



AspiInLV
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15 Feb 2010, 8:50 pm

all the publicly owned campany's money is property of the shareholders, So why not put every contribution up to the shareholders?

simple the CEO's and mutual funds always have the votes rigged to come out as they desire



Tensu
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15 Feb 2010, 8:59 pm

Sand wrote:
Tensu wrote:
Sand: The latter.

Awesomelyglorious: I don't care wether or not their motivations are genuine, I am not their judge. My point is that we can manipulate corperations to do the right thing, because as you said, their goal is to make a buck. And by the way I never accused that goal of being corrupt, it is just reality.


Who is the "we" that will manipulate corporations? Corporations are huge powerful organizations whose only real motivation is to make profit. As AG noted, that is not evil, it is mere fact.

A tiger is not evil. It is merely hungry and eats anything that is digestible which is why tigers are not in charge of day care centers because little kids are delicious. So with corporations. With their huge supply of money they will corrupt legislatures, judges, or whatever needs to be done to increase their profits. They have done it in the past and are doing it today and they cannot be trusted with political power because they are totally immoral.


And again, I never accused corperations of being evil.

"we" is the consumers. if the consumers refuse to give a corperation their money, it will day. If they give a corperation their money, it lives.