Armies versus gangs - a comparison

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12 Mar 2010, 11:21 pm

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

Lecks
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12 Mar 2010, 11:28 pm

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

The bolded part: that's equally true for nations

Sand
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13 Mar 2010, 12:37 am

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... med_forces

SDFarsight
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13 Mar 2010, 8:25 am

*sigh* I don't see how you can point out some similarities and think that 'armies hurt people, criminal thugs hurt people, so armies=criminal violence'

An army fights for the state and is observed by international law (though not necessarily keeps to it). Armies use combined arms and tactics, strategies which organise hundreds of thousands of soldiers. The most important difference is that wars are typically state-vs-state, where as gang violance is civil disorder. The line between an army and some street thugs blurs with the 'paramilitary force' such as the IRA or Hezbollah.

Sand wrote:

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... med_forces

Sorry, your point?

Last edited by SDFarsight on 13 Mar 2010, 8:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

ruveyn
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13 Mar 2010, 8:29 am

Sand wrote:

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... med_forces

Mostly nations that do not matter overly much in the march of Mankind.

Costa Rica is a decent country that has decided it does not need an army to exist. And the Costa Ricans are right. If Costa Rica is ever threatened by an outside power, the U.S. will step in.

What can we say of the itty bitty countries that have no armies or limited military power(Costa Rica excepted). Too large to be an insane asylum, too small to matter.

ruveyn

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13 Mar 2010, 2:32 pm

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

And a gang needs their guns to survive as a gang. Your point?

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13 Mar 2010, 6:03 pm

Orwell wrote:

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

And a gang needs their guns to survive as a gang. Your point?

I'm not going to dignify that with any kind of answer. Do some research on both the armed forces and gangs and draw your own conclusions.

I swear some of you people post replies just to satisfy post count goals.

jc6chan
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13 Mar 2010, 8:50 pm

Sand wrote:

Raptor wrote:

An army is the sword point of that nations will and foreign policy whereas a gang is out for itself.
A nation, of course, needs an army in order to survive as a nation.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... med_forces

Apparently, Israeli PM Netanyahu has said that any independent Palestinian State must be without armed forces. He didn't say "without terror", he said it must be "demilitarized".

zer0netgain
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14 Mar 2010, 8:55 am

SDFarsight wrote:

*sigh* I don't see how you can point out some similarities and think that 'armies hurt people, criminal thugs hurt people, so armies=criminal violence'

It is a simple reality.

Even cops know the only difference in what they do to people and what criminals do to people is that they operate with the sanction of the state behind them. Otherwise, the conduct isn't very different.

In many places of the world, "gangs" and "mobs" are the law enforcement and are more effective than the "legitimate government" in getting results. The locals prefer the mob bosses because they protect them and provide better results than the courts and police do.

It's not the gun, but it is the one who wields the gun that makes the difference.

An army led with solid morals and benevolence can be a good thing. An army led with corruption is an unbearable burden.

Sand
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14 Mar 2010, 9:18 am

ruveyn wrote:

zer0netgain wrote:

Let's put it in simpler terms.

An "army" is just a mob of thugs operating with the authority of the state.

A mobster hurts you, you have someone to appeal to.

A soldier/officer hurts you, there is nobody to appeal to.

In advanced countries the armed forces are well organized and disciplined. They are not mobs. Second, if a member of the Armed forces acts illegally, the aggrieved party has access to the courts.

If a "made man" from the local Mafia does you, there is no one to appeal to except maybe, his Cappo or the Godfather.

It is too bad you do not understand the difference between armed thugs like the Mafia or de Crip or de Blood, and Armed forces subject to law.

ruveyn

Then may we consider the American hired mercenaries in Iraq or Afghanistan that are not subject to prosecution an army or a gang?

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14 Mar 2010, 9:38 am

Sand wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

zer0netgain wrote:

Then may we consider the American hired mercenaries in Iraq or Afghanistan that are not subject to prosecution an army or a gang?

It looks like now we're down to picking fly s**t out of pepper.

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14 Mar 2010, 10:03 am

Raptor wrote:

Sand wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

zer0netgain wrote:

Then may we consider the American hired mercenaries in Iraq or Afghanistan that are not subject to prosecution an army or a gang?

It looks like now we're down to picking fly sh** out of pepper.

I doubt there's any pepper there.

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