Cogito ergo sum

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Sand
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18 Mar 2010, 2:09 am

Philologos wrote:

Sand wrote:

Thinking is a process of solving a problem by a form of trial and error through theoretical modeling. The process can also take place with actual modeling. It is a form of thinking without a thinker called evolution.

Seems a very specialized definition of thinking. Your own or whose?

As for the somewhat polemical second half - well, tastes, colors and dogmas do not debate well.

Not specialized at all. The process of thinking is a process of proposing and testing. This can be done virtually in the brain or in actuality as in creating a random array of structures to be subjected to natural forces. Solutions may or may not arise out of original efforts but continuous efforts and eliminations usually results in solutions.

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18 Mar 2010, 2:30 am

What is the Latin for "I think, therefore I get depressed and drunk"?

fidelis
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18 Mar 2010, 7:16 pm

I observe, therefore I am.

I exist because I can observe the thoughts within my mind. Whether or not they are my thoughts or they even exist is another matter. My thoughts could be coming from an external source easily. I just thought of this ten minutes ago and it's driving crazy right now.

Lets say I was asleep and dreaming. I say hi to my friend Bob. Bob says hi back while thinking that I looked rather tired. Bob observed a thought and therefor exists, but he won't exist for very long, nor does his thoughts actually belong to him.

So we are all possibly just a dream of some higher thinker, who creates all of our thoughts. I don't believe it, but it's possible. Now the question is who the real thinker is. At least I know I exist, and can take comfort in that. Let's just hope thinker doesn't wake up.

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iamnotaparakeet
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18 Mar 2010, 7:47 pm

NobelCynic wrote:

“I feel, therefore I am”

In Latin that would be, "Sentio ergo sum."

iamnotaparakeet
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18 Mar 2010, 7:48 pm

fidelis wrote:

I observe, therefore I am.

Specto ergo sum.

iamnotaparakeet
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18 Mar 2010, 7:52 pm

Wombat wrote:

What is the Latin for "I think, therefore I get depressed and drunk"?

A translation of that is, "Cogito nimis, ergo saepe sum tritis et ebrius."

Sand
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18 Mar 2010, 8:09 pm

I yam whuti yam (I'm Popeye the sailor man)

iamnotaparakeet
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18 Mar 2010, 8:45 pm

Sand wrote:

I yam whuti yam (I'm Popeye the sailor man)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOhp1L9enr4[/youtube]

Wombat
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19 Mar 2010, 4:30 am

iamnotaparakeet wrote:

Wombat wrote:

What is the Latin for "I think, therefore I get depressed and drunk"?

A translation of that is, "Cogito nimis, ergo saepe sum tritis et ebrius."

Thanks. Thats me.

But what about the original? Cognito ergo sum?

Think + thus + is

What a piss poor language that is that doesn't say "I" or "we" or whatever.

Did a roman man go up to a woman and say "love" + "you"?

Geez, that is worse than saying "Me Tarzan, you Jane."

No wonder the barbarians won.

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19 Mar 2010, 12:24 pm

Wombat wrote:

iamnotaparakeet wrote:

Wombat wrote:

What is the Latin for "I think, therefore I get depressed and drunk"?

A translation of that is, "Cogito nimis, ergo saepe sum tritis et ebrius."

"Cogito" is the first person singularis. :lol:

"Sum" likewise.

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PLA
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20 Mar 2010, 5:07 am

I don't know if I made it clear in earlier posts, but I don't actually think that Cartesius was entirely wrong with this thought.
That there is an observing entity is trivially true, and that is in all likelyhood what he had in mind with the word "I".
I don't think it requires much stretching of the common definition of "I".
It's still circular, but I could say it's just an unfortunate phrasing and let it slide.

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20 Mar 2010, 11:11 am

PLA wrote:

I think he is.

There is no "thought observing entity", but rather our consciousness is distributed rather than existing in a single nerve or cluster.

Modern philosopher Dan Dennett is known for attacking the basic tendencies found within thinking about the mind in a Cartesian manner.

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20 Mar 2010, 12:15 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:

PLA wrote:

I didn't say that the entity is homogenous or even coherent.

Good point, though.

Awesomelyglorious
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20 Mar 2010, 1:04 pm

PLA wrote:

I didn't say that the entity is homogenous or even coherent.

Good point, though.

Perhaps you didn't, but the mindset as if the agent was something like this is very very common. It is the basic intuition.

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21 Mar 2010, 8:40 am

Awesomelyglorious wrote:

I think he is.

By "I", I assume you mean Awesomelyglorious, but who (or what) is Awesomelyglorious?

Awesomelyglorious wrote:

There is no "thought observing entity", but rather our consciousness is distributed rather than existing in a single nerve or cluster.

Even if that were true, I fail to see the relevance.

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PLA
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21 Mar 2010, 12:19 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:

PLA wrote:

I didn't say that the entity is homogenous or even coherent.

Good point, though.

Perhaps you didn't, but the mindset as if the agent was something like this is very very common. It is the basic intuition.

I have enough experience with the salad-like nature of my own mind.

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