christian or anarchist?

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Umm.... you're just asserting that a certain way of thinking is molestation, but you aren't giving a case, and I am not sure that there are good valid, relatively neutral, secular reasons to uphold your definition as valid in this case. A lot of things that kids learn are "unnatural" and many social groups isolate themselves to a good extent. I mean, everything you've said though is like, not significantly worse than the Amish I think, if not significantly better.

I am not singling out religion as the only instance for this kind of child abuse, you also see it in fervent nationalism and racial hatred, but religious groups are well represented in this form of child abuse. As for the Amish, they are one of the worst perpetrators in manipulation and indoctrination. Take a child and for the first 16 years of its life fill its head with fire and brimstone, then on its 16th birthday tell it that there are NO rules and off you go fornicate, get drunk, take drugs, go to the city, mix with the heathens, do what ever you will. Tell this child that they can only return to the family and community if they decide to accept amish ways. The Amish proudly call this free will, I call it masterful manipulation. The 16 year old after years of repression is finally set loose, still at a very immature age, and with no real insight into the society beyond its borders, naturally the kid is going to go off the rails. Then of course the warnings of the evil society beyond come flooding back add to this the prospect of loosing ones family, friends and community is it any wonder that so many of these kids return to the Amish, and reject modern society. This sort of manipulation, to my mind, is child abuse.

Ok,, but the issue is that I regard these matters as too complicated to really have a clear line on what is really abuse or not. Any rule that I think someone could come up with could likely be abused for political purposes. Even further though, it seems to me that setting up rules of this sort will by their nature tend to favor monocultural attitudes simply because the dominant culture would tend to be the authority on proper parenting, and they're not likely to consult psychologists on whether what parents do is objectively bad for their children. And also, harm in this case is difficult to really prove.

Wow. That blew my mind. The way she had that girl in tears SICKENED me. Honestly, does she get a kick out of crying little girls? I personally do not believe in God nor do I believe in brainwashing. I understand being taught God is real but radicalism at such a young age? Hell no. They should wait until they get older and their minds are developed to do this rather than do it while they believe everything they hear. Oh but of course, then they won't be brainwashed because raised normally they will have something called Common Sense. Shouting shouldn't be the key to belief, teaching should be.

I don't consider those groups to be anarchist. They seem to merely have an interest in the ideals of anarchism as they relate to the compassion also preached by Jesus, whereas the Catholic Worker is anti-capitalist and anti-authoritarian at its core. I know that Tolstoy had a deep belief in both anarchist political ideals and religion, but that's more of a personal perspective (I'm not familiar with the others you mentioned). And I certainly don't consider anarcho-capitalists to be anarchists in any meaningful sense.

Where can I get some of that Nestle brand bottled holy water, like in the video?

Jesus radicals is explicitly anarchist, while the other groups may tend to be less overt. (I think "Christarchy" used to be more overt given that similar terms apply to Christian anarchism)

From Jesus Radicals we read:
" All governments operate on a model of ruling over people. But the Gospels claim that Christians should model Jesus’ suffering servanthood. These are fundamentally incompatible outlooks. Anarchism, at its best, is a commitment to systematically critiquing all structures that place one person or group in a position to dominate others or creation. So anarchism, as a political philosophy holds some promise for Christians because the two share a commitment to critiquing the power structures and working towards a more level playing field."

Hmm... I wouldn't know about the Catholic worker, I just can't see how the Catholic church is actually reconcilable with anti-authoritarianism. The church itself is one of the most authoritarian modern organizations in existence.

However, yeah, I can understand the stance on anarcho-capitalists.

Perhaps I'm being a bit nit-picky, but from what I read on the Jesus Radicals website, they seem to think that anarchism is a good idea, and that its critique of how power works in society has a lot to teach to Christians who want to work for a better, more just society, but I don't see the organization as delineating itself along those fundamental values. In other words, it's Christian first, and then respectful of anarchism as an ideal, but there is no mention of the organization itself working as an anarchist, non-hierarchical, anti-authoritarian group.

Dorothy Day, the founder of the Catholic Worker, was an anarchist first, before she joined the church. There are some odd contradictions in her beliefs, but the Catholic Worker has always been unflaggingly committed to anarchist principles of mutual aid, with no hierarchy or bosses, and service without questions or coercion. It isn't even incorporated as a non-profit because it doesn't recognize the validity of State control over its charitable and political work.

More:
http://www.speroforum.com/site/article.asp?id=12548
http://www.indypendent.org/2008/05/16/c ... ker-at-75/

I'm not a religious person myself, and having been raised Catholic I completely agree with your views on the Catholic church, but the Catholic Worker, while not perfect, is a bit of a shining gem in my view.

Shouting is usually a poor way to reinforce your argument. No one with a well-thought argument would feel the need to yell or shout it. ^.- Anyways, back on topic...

Who is shouting?

Ok, I see the difference you are talking about. Yeah... I can't really blame it though theologically, simply because the nature of religions is to dominate one's way of thinking. Nor do I really think that Christian anarchism will tend to be anarchist first anyway, so, I really think that this just goes with the territory, as you seem to want anarchists who are Christians, and that website is instead trying to be a Christian conception of anarchism.


I can also see this comment making some sense.