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If Harper had his way, would Canada be in the middle of a much greater downturn?
a) Yes, removing financial oversight would have hindered the banks when the crash came. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
b) Yes, Harper's Administration would have auctioned off the public sector, ensuring gov't had less means to stimulate the economy. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
c) Yes, combination of a & b 43%  43%  [ 3 ]
d) Yes - other (explain in thread) 14%  14%  [ 1 ]
e) No - ultimately, after hearing senior civil servant advice, he wouldn't have removed oversight. 14%  14%  [ 1 ]
f) No - his privatizations and expansion of the oil sands would have saved Canada from economic downturn. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
g) No - combination of e & f. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
h) No - other (explain in thread) 14%  14%  [ 1 ]
i) I have no idea! 14%  14%  [ 1 ]
j) Other (explain in thread) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 7

Fuzzy
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24 Jun 2010, 3:08 pm

visagrunt wrote:
Fuzzy,

I think you are taking a rather simplistic view of things.


Possibly so. All I was driving for was that people like phil have a warped sense of western politics. As warped, I am sure, as we in the west see them. My whys and hows are subject to interpretation, but historical records of voting patterns are not.

Quote:
Certainly there are questions surrounding the federal spending power, but the realpolitik of the Canadian federation is not going to go away anytime soon. And given the alternatives, the prospect of losing the federal spending power should be terrifying to governments in Edmonton, Toronto, Québec and Victoria.


Not likely going away, no, and for good as well as ill. The west isnt as adverse to equalization and social programs as people like to pretend. After all, universal health care started in the west and spread east. Albertans actually have the option(actually I think all Canadians do) of opting out - as individuals - in contributions(and benefits) from the health care system. But you dont hear about that happening. Most every Canadian sees the sense in everybody looking out for everyone else. It even influences our foreign policy.

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The same constitution that calls into question the federal direct taxation authority also provides mobility rights that cannot be abrogated. Every Canadian is free to pull up stakes and move to any province. The day that the so-called "have nots" lose equalization payments is the day that people start planning their retirements in Calgary, in Newmarket and in Kelowna, leaving those provincial governments holding the bag for health care.


Correct, and this happens anyway with the rise and fall of employment in different parts of Canada. The oil booms drew in countless maritimers for instance. In many cases they came, worked for a while and went home and bought homes.

It wasnt cause for the sort of grumbling the Americans do about Mexicans. In fact, there are some programs placing Mexicans in jobs in Canada(maple leaf meats I believe). They ended up in a sticky situation with the recession. They had been contracted to their employer and were not permitted to seek other jobs. With the market crash, jobs were cut and of course, its last hired first fired and Canadians before imported labour. Not eligible for unemployment either, if I recall and going home would void their work visa. I think the solution that was arrived at was to remove the restrictions against seeking work.

Quote:
Equalization payments are your province's guarantee that you will not be faced with a demographic shift beyond your economy's capacity to support it.

But, of course, feel free to preach your decentralization mantra.


Sure thing. Hows this?

The irony of it is that what Quebec seems to want is a form of decentralization/firewall. Ranging from less federal interference to outright separation. In that case it would be mighty strange bed fellows, but Alberta(particularly) wants the same sort of things (at least according to your little jibe).


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visagrunt
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25 Jun 2010, 2:47 pm

I apologize if I misascribed a decentralization spin to your post.

The interesting thing about Québec is that it actually puts it money where its mouth is.

Québec runs its own public pension fund, and the Caisse des Placements is one of the most powerful institutional investors in the country.

The preservation of french language and francophone culture is a political priority, and the Government of Québec is the one province that is making significant expenditures in education, arts and culture.

As Québecois increasingly become maîtres chez eux the forces of nationalism abate.

The problem, as I see it, for Alberta is that unlike Québec, their discontent with the federation is not so clearly defined, and so cannot be so clearly addressed within provincial jurisdiction. Alberta could do everything that Quebec has done: collect its own taxes, run it's own pension fund, select its own immigrants, etc. But at the end of the day, none of these things are likely to make discontented Albertans less unhappy.


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25 Jun 2010, 11:42 pm

Hum sorry about my inaccuracy regarding politics, i haven't been keeping up recently. =.= so my information might be a bit outdated, meh...


"Is or is not the goal of the Bloc to separate Quebec from Canada? Yes/no please. "

According to their motto, No. There might be some of its members who advocate for it within the party, or have affiliations with the sovereignist movement, but this was the argument ( "mostly to see that the interests of Quebec aren't deterred", within the federation) they posed when confronted about the relevance of the Bloc if nationalists like the Parti Québécois or the now rather defunct ADQ were ever elected.