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Whats wrong with the world?

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Oodain
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22 Apr 2011, 9:49 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:
I think coal vs nuclear is a false dichotomy. Plus raw numbers is probably not a good comparison, perhaps (number of deaths / amount of energy generated) and also (destruction of environment / amount of energy generated) would make more sense for a comparison, and no, I am not sure which would turn out better using those comparisons.


all true but the lasting effects of nuclear contamination is largely local, the effects of the huge amounts of co2 not only on the atmosphere but also the oceans are global.

interesting read, dont know the source so judge for yourselfes.


linkage


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22 Apr 2011, 11:02 pm

Unfortunately the problem with nuclear energy lies more with the absolute carelessness of the discipline with operating the facilities and the fact that a disaster at one plant can have huge destructive effects. The Japanese tragedy is not local. The sea in the Japanese area is hugely contaminated and the local fisheries upon which Japan heavily depends for food are destroyed. The effects of this one breakdown are turning around the entire economy of the nation and the USA has had many instances of very near disaster in the same way. It's only a matter of time before one occurs. Spreading of minor radioactivity is dismissed as not dangerous. That's a gross error. It is estimated that subsequent cancer and related effects have touched in the area of a million people. That's not a minor occurrence.



psychohist
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23 Apr 2011, 1:00 am

NomadicAssassin wrote:
I believe this is the right place to ask this, i recently had a discussion with my AU teacher at school, about my problem with how our world is, how people rely on emotions more than they need too, and that people do irrational things, or that they do things before thinking, ect...... My point is how do i keep my self from exploding as the people around me do, not necessarily the wrong things, but the irrational or to use a blunt term stupid thing for what ever said task they are doing. Its like they do things on purpose to see what happens, Also they talk about useless and meaningless topics, what is it with people that makes them do these things.

Ah, you're talking about neurotypicals. It's just the way their brains are wired, basically; it's much easier for them to come to conclusions based on emotion and peer pressure, and harder for them to accept the results of logic and rationality than it is for us. They talk about useless and meaningless topics because it's a way for them to share "common ground" and try to get each other on the "same team" so they will have allies when they need them, never mind how illogical it is to divide up based on sports loyalties or whatnot.

Like it or not, those are the propensities that most humans have, and it's something we just have to accept.



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23 Apr 2011, 2:43 am

psychohist wrote:
NomadicAssassin wrote:
I believe this is the right place to ask this, i recently had a discussion with my AU teacher at school, about my problem with how our world is, how people rely on emotions more than they need too, and that people do irrational things, or that they do things before thinking, ect...... My point is how do i keep my self from exploding as the people around me do, not necessarily the wrong things, but the irrational or to use a blunt term stupid thing for what ever said task they are doing. Its like they do things on purpose to see what happens, Also they talk about useless and meaningless topics, what is it with people that makes them do these things.

Ah, you're talking about neurotypicals. It's just the way their brains are wired, basically; it's much easier for them to come to conclusions based on emotion and peer pressure, and harder for them to accept the results of logic and rationality than it is for us. They talk about useless and meaningless topics because it's a way for them to share "common ground" and try to get each other on the "same team" so they will have allies when they need them, never mind how illogical it is to divide up based on sports loyalties or whatnot.

Like it or not, those are the propensities that most humans have, and it's something we just have to accept.


I've been around this site for a while and had quite a few discussions with people who claim to be AS. A very large proportion are terribly illogical and sink into emotional responses with great ease.



Vexcalibur
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23 Apr 2011, 7:09 am

Oodain wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
I think coal vs nuclear is a false dichotomy. Plus raw numbers is probably not a good comparison, perhaps (number of deaths / amount of energy generated) and also (destruction of environment / amount of energy generated) would make more sense for a comparison, and no, I am not sure which would turn out better using those comparisons.


all true but the lasting effects of nuclear contamination is largely local, the effects of the huge amounts of co2 not only on the atmosphere but also the oceans are global.

I don't think this claim is true, I think that to believe this you will need to either downplay the global effects of a nuclear meltdown or exaggerate the global effects of coal mining.

Still a false dichotomy anyway.


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Oodain
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23 Apr 2011, 7:18 am

Sand wrote:
Unfortunately the problem with nuclear energy lies more with the absolute carelessness of the discipline with operating the facilities and the fact that a disaster at one plant can have huge destructive effects. The Japanese tragedy is not local. The sea in the Japanese area is hugely contaminated and the local fisheries upon which Japan heavily depends for food are destroyed. The effects of this one breakdown are turning around the entire economy of the nation and the USA has had many instances of very near disaster in the same way. It's only a matter of time before one occurs. Spreading of minor radioactivity is dismissed as not dangerous. That's a gross error. It is estimated that subsequent cancer and related effects have touched in the area of a million people. That's not a minor occurrence.


i agree it has more to do with the people involved than the technology.
i never said that the spread of radioation wasnt a bad thing, only that the difference in deaths considering a lot of factors is greater for coal by what looks like a lot
true the fukushima incident will have far reaching effects, but in no way is it a global disaster like the effects of climate change, the worst case scenario being a disruption of the ocean currents.
even the issue of cancer is relatively local compared to climate change, denmark received no markable increase in thyroid cancer despite being in a region hit hard by the long range fallout.


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Last edited by Oodain on 23 Apr 2011, 7:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

Oodain
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23 Apr 2011, 7:27 am

Vexcalibur wrote:
Oodain wrote:
Vexcalibur wrote:
I think coal vs nuclear is a false dichotomy. Plus raw numbers is probably not a good comparison, perhaps (number of deaths / amount of energy generated) and also (destruction of environment / amount of energy generated) would make more sense for a comparison, and no, I am not sure which would turn out better using those comparisons.


all true but the lasting effects of nuclear contamination is largely local, the effects of the huge amounts of co2 not only on the atmosphere but also the oceans are global.

I don't think this claim is true, I think that to believe this you will need to either downplay the global effects of a nuclear meltdown or exaggerate the global effects of coal mining.

Still a false dichotomy anyway.


first part, maybe.
have you read these?
coal vs. nuclear death toll
there are also som sublinks within the texts that are very interesting.
as stated before i would like to see an alternative, i just havent found it yet.

second part, again maybe, but isnt the debate important nonetheless.


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23 Apr 2011, 8:25 am

psychohist wrote:
Ah, you're talking about neurotypicals. It's just the way their brains are wired, basically; it's much easier for them to come to conclusions based on emotion and peer pressure, and harder for them to accept the results of logic and rationality than it is for us. They talk about useless and meaningless topics because it's a way for them to share "common ground" and try to get each other on the "same team" so they will have allies when they need them, never mind how illogical it is to divide up based on sports loyalties or whatnot.

Like it or not, those are the propensities that most humans have, and it's something we just have to accept.

It's actually just basic neurology that human beings are dependent upon their emotions for their beliefs, and for their motivations. The basic human mind is wired such that without emotional processing, we cannot process anything in a manner even approaching timely. Now, people with AS might have some disruptions in that system, but we haven't really found a way around it, otherwise the condition would require very extensive neurological alteration. This means that even if we're better, we're still the same.

Technically, I think most people who talk about how "useless and meaningless" certain topics are tend to incorrectly overstate the value of the things they like to talk about. Unless I am talking about how to improve my own life and other related issues, anything I talk about from sports to politics to philosophy will be useless.



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23 Apr 2011, 8:31 am

ryan93 wrote:
Whats wrong with the world...people imposing their views on others, half the worlds thinking power goes to memorising football statistics, irrationality, welfare dependancy, I could go on....


In what way is memorizing football statistics harmful? You may not find that interesting, but so what? Others might.

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23 Apr 2011, 8:45 am

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
psychohist wrote:
NomadicAssassin wrote:
I believe this is the right place to ask this, i recently had a discussion with my AU teacher at school, about my problem with how our world is, how people rely on emotions more than they need too, and that people do irrational things, or that they do things before thinking, ect...... My point is how do i keep my self from exploding as the people around me do, not necessarily the wrong things, but the irrational or to use a blunt term stupid thing for what ever said task they are doing. Its like they do things on purpose to see what happens, Also they talk about useless and meaningless topics, what is it with people that makes them do these things.

Ah, you're talking about neurotypicals. It's just the way their brains are wired, basically; it's much easier for them to come to conclusions based on emotion and peer pressure, and harder for them to accept the results of logic and rationality than it is for us. They talk about useless and meaningless topics because it's a way for them to share "common ground" and try to get each other on the "same team" so they will have allies when they need them, never mind how illogical it is to divide up based on sports loyalties or whatnot.

Like it or not, those are the propensities that most humans have, and it's something we just have to accept.

It's actually just basic neurology that human beings are dependent upon their emotions for their beliefs, and for their motivations. The basic human mind is wired such that without emotional processing, we cannot process anything in a manner even approaching timely. Now, people with AS might have some disruptions in that system, but we haven't really found a way around it, otherwise the condition would require very extensive neurological alteration. This means that even if we're better, we're still the same.

Technically, I think most people who talk about how "useless and meaningless" certain topics are tend to incorrectly overstate the value of the things they like to talk about. Unless I am talking about how to improve my own life and other related issues, anything I talk about from sports to politics to philosophy will be useless.

Part of what is wrong with the world is evidenced right here in this thread where only two posters have even heard the OP!


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psychohist
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23 Apr 2011, 12:50 pm

Sand wrote:
I've been around this site for a while and had quite a few discussions with people who claim to be AS. A very large proportion are terribly illogical and sink into emotional responses with great ease.

The arguments one makes are often unrelated to how one reaches one's conclusions, even for aspies.