Debtor's Prisons in America

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Yes he does. Any judicial act can be overturned in a higher court.

ruveyn

So if I get a degree they can just revoke it if they feel like it? wow why should I even bother then? but thats alright I do not have to lie about not having assets because I don't......unless a few used vinyls and a rather cheap vinyl player from target and a lap top that I've had for 5 years after it was given to me(and I am not sure how long it was used before that) count as assets.

I think my aunt has more than one degree but she for sure has at least one and yeah she is not doing a whole lot with her life.......and now is back in school. but yeah I agree that its not all that true that a college degree prepares one to live a productive live.

I have doubts that getting a degree is going to suddenly make me able to live a productive life by societies standards, however I feel I personally benifit from education maybe I will find a way to get a decent paying job and pay all that back and maybe I wont......that is not why I am in college.

I don't KNOW they can revoke your degree. I'm having trouble paying student loans, too. But I'm no longer interested in really working in a public school anymore, anyway, so they can't really do anything to me. I do know they can take away my teaching credentials such that if I tried to apply for a teaching license, I'd be barred from doing so. I mean, college degrees mean squat in the bigger picture. It just says that an educational institution certifies that you have completed an advanced degree of gestalt training. You are thus capable of being a productive member of society. Whether you actually do so, or whether you are genuinely prepared for your field of interest, is quite another thing. Of course, someone completing a high school diploma can make the same claim.

What matters is whether you can be professionally licensed and certified in that field. Take the legal profession, for instance. Technically, all you really have to do to practice law is pass bar. However, passing the exam requires specialized knowledge in the area of law. Which you CAN get working as a paralegal (you don't NEED to go to school for that). All a paralegal has to do above and beyond secretarial work is study code and shadow the lawyer in the courtroom to understand court procedure. But most states do not allow "reading law" as acceptable for taking the bar. In most cases, a doctorate is required before a candidate can even apply.

So, the new lawyer steps out into the big bad world, can't get hired at any big, established firms, starts his own private practice in a small town, and proceeds to live like a king. He finds out he can't keep up his clientele and that the economics of the area can't support his lifestyle. The bank takes away the house, his landlord evicts him from his commercial rental, and he ends up a destitute alcoholic, which many lawyers are, anyway. He goes into default on his student loans, which total well over some $100,000. He has no way of paying them back, so the banks take him to court (ironic, isn't it?) and get a judgment against him. He's in the federal loan program, they find out which state he's licensed in, order that his license be revoked and take away his standing with the bar. Game over. Epic Fail.

Same thing might happen with a doctor. He could have paid back all his loans within the first 5 years living on ramen noodles, water, and the occasional light beer. What does he do? Buys the McMansion, the Bentley, marries his high school sweetheart, buys her a new car every week, takes his doctor and lawyer friends out to eat at the local 5-star and spends the weekends on the golf course. He gets one med-mal lawsuit, can't afford his mortgage, and starts taking free sample percocets to "get a little sleep." Next thing you know, he wakes up when the percocet wears off 5 days later, the wife is gone, the Bentley is gone, and the bank has sent a foreclosure notice. Can't pay the rent on his office suite, can't pay his staff... Oh yeah, and how about those student loans? The student loan people get a judgment against him, and the state takes away his medical license. Epic Fail.

Oh, did I mention I'm a former bankruptcy paralegal? Just a temp job while I was between schools, but you learn a lot that way! This is what my wife DOES, though, and makes for some good storytelling at dinner time.

I'm not trying to scare you or anything, and keep in mind I'm not a lawyer. You have to research the facts yourself, find out what is true and what are merely bank scare tactics. I hate those people. But I've also learned when to hang up the phone on a bill collector that I'm actually trying to get money to. They play dirty and deserve no respect. Trying to get personal info from me in order to screw me over is not going to get money out of me any faster.

The religious right politicians will try to reintroduce debtors prisons

So you say. Produce specific factual instances of right-wingers trying to re-establish debtor's prisons in the U.S.

ruveyn

In the Bible if a person does pay his debt he is sold into slavery. Religious fundamentalists to not question the Bible so there is nothing stopping them from instituting debtors prisons.

So what. In the Bible it said the Sun and the Moon stood still over Gibeon. That is also nonsense.

ruveyn

Well if the can take away my degree should I get one.....it really does not hurt me because I am in it for learning, they could take away the degree but they cannot take away what I learn. But yeah my mom used to work for a Doctor as a medical assistant and he ended up losing his medical practice because of some loan/financial related stuff....but now he prescribes medicinal marijuana mostly. that is not quite what you're talking about probably but it was still sad because he is a good doctor and a good person.

I am really just trying to find a way to survive without conforming to society so that I can maybe get involved with positive change or educating people about what is going on or something that would help things in the world improve. I have gotten quite close to the point were I don't care much about what happens to me....like I do but I feel like I missed out on a lot in life so the next best thing I can do is try to something about some of the negative things that helped get me to this point. I hope taking more sociology classes with the sociology professer I had last semester will help because she is all about getting educated and changing things for the better so maybe some of that strength can rub off on me.

Religious right politicians will require that schools teach an Earth centered universe. School children will be taught how to draw spirographs to represent the orbits of the planets.

This could happen in Christian schools, but not in public schools given the current laws. And if this ever did come about, intelligent parents would withdraw their children from the public schools and see to it that their children got proper schooling.

ruveyn

Its already happening in public schools . The new computer programs can plot the orbits in the Sun centered mode or the Earth centered mode. It is up to the student to decide how to turn in their homework.

How about some fact? Where and in what schools?

ruveyn

That is dumb as it is fairly obvious that the earth is not in the center of the solar system or the universe for that matter, I have yet to hear of a school teaching such rubbish but if they are that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

It sounds to me you have a good philosophy of education for yourself. I don't conform to society myself. But the reasons I don't conform to society is that trying to is unnatural for me and does more harm than good, and I mean for everyone and not just myself. I do better working on my own, and my steady part-time gig trusts me to handle my duties without anyone telling me what to do. What I've learned is that I have the right to ask volunteers for help in completely changing my role so that what I do is much bigger than myself. It's weird, because now people are listening and paying attention to ME and looking to ME to tell them what to do. I don't know how to handle it, I'm scared, but all I can do is just go with it. I'm learning how to look at things I want, "just ask," and pray that in getting what I want I don't disappoint those who help me. So "not conforming" can be beneficial. What is it, though, you see about society that's so troubling you can't conform to it?

And, look...I'm just talking worst-case scenario here. The reality really is a lot more optimistic than that. My loans totaled just over $50k, most of which was my M.Mus. composition. My payments right now are around $250. I could easily make those payments if I were still teaching, but I can also make those payments if I consistently collect on fees people owe ME. I just suck as a businessman, but honestly that part of my professional life was not something I went to school for nor was even prepared to do. Life doesn't always carry you where you expect to go. I just kept an open mind and ended up finding that I had the biggest knack for church music--and I never even entertained the thought of making a serious go at being a full-time church musician. Now I've become preoccupied with expanding what I do Sunday to Sunday and every day in between because it's what I'm having the most success at. A sign? I dunno.

The point is that your student loan repayments aren't in practice really going to be all that much and you shouldn't worry about what happens if you default on them. Your #1 priority is paying back those loans, maintaining some kind of income with at least some of that being freelance work. And don't take on any other debt. And keep your options open. Always. What saved my life was doing volunteer work. You meet cool people that way and you get inside information on local economics and politics. I earned $500 in less than 3 months as the musical director at our local community theater. Sure, my resumé is PHAT. But here's a hint: The COOL jobs don't take resumés. I didn't even apply for my last teaching job--I was preparing to take over a piano studio when they offered me the band director position. Two years I'm working independently as what I originally applied for, and I couldn't be happier. How did I get my part-time church job? I subbed on Wednesday night Bible study/prayer meeting. I have a second piano studio after-hours. How did I get that? Word-of-mouth. Someone heard I was teaching piano at the private school, so the non-credit coordinator at this community college extension called me up and asked me if I wanted the job. I didn't even TRY to get this job.

I'll spare you my thoughts on why it seems jobs just get handed to me. Other than that, all I can say is you have to be flexible and open to new experiences. And organized. And an all-around decent person.

...

I don't know, as I said, that they CAN take away your degree. There's no reason why, realistically, you shouldn't be able to pay your loans back. There are actual programs to help with that, like Income Based Repayment. If you can show your income to be less than a certain amount, you may not be required to pay ANYTHING. And after 25 years, the balance can be forgiven. There's actually another program that lets all loans after 2007 (if I understand it right) be forgiven if you teach or work for a non-profit for, like, 15 years or something. It's only doom and gloom if you get in a bad situation and DO NOTHING. If they CAN take away your degree, they aren't going to revoke it for no reason.

So...

Go to work.

Pay your debts!! !

Well I am not an organized person at all, In fact my routine might very well be disorganization....but the trouble is I just don't see myself getting a job that would enable me to pay back all those loans. Right now I am taking a lot of sociology and psychology classes but I am not sure that there is a high paying job I can get out of that.....but I am in it for the experiance and the knowledge so I don't really care if I end up unable to pay them back or not. I would like to but I am also prepared to not be able to.....But there are many things that bother me about this society a few things off the top of my mind:
1.Cannabis is illegal even though it is safer than alcohol and ciggerettes and has proven medicinal uses.
2.1% of the population should not have over half the nations wealth and get out of taxes because they find good lawyers
3. The government is putting corporate intrests before the intrest of the citizens in general and can simply be bought, they are a joke.
4. Discrimination against homosexuals and trannsexuals and those without a specific physical gender is an issue...though I as of now identify as a straight female I still feel more masculine than feminine and a lot of times feel more comfortable dressed as a male and yes I have faced bullying and discrimination because of it on some occasions so I know how it feels and I think it's wrong.
5. The war on drugs in general
6. Economic Hit Men(might have to read the book to get that one)
and I could think of so many more things that bother me about society.