Dutch expected to make preparation of halal meat illegal

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Tequila
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07 Nov 2011, 5:22 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

We have our share of Muslims (and bad attitudes towards them)

Are most of them reasonably laid-back and Westernised though? Integration is often not happening in the UK, but segregation and ghettoisation is and the sometimes the second and third generations are becoming more backward than their ancestors.

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07 Nov 2011, 6:25 pm

Tequila wrote:

JakobVirgil wrote:

We have our share of Muslims (and bad attitudes towards them)

"British" read English culture does not seem to have the homogenizing force that we have on this side of the pond.
we have only 3 or 4 real accents in our entire country London has at least that many.
maybe the english can not envision a world where they are not at least the first among equals.

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Tequila
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07 Nov 2011, 6:29 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

"British" read English culture does not seem to have the homogenizing force that we have on this side of the pond.

Perhaps it's to do with the historical fact that the United Kingdom (as well as Denmark and other countries) have not historically been a place of mass immigration? Therefore, when it does happen, the 'natives' don't like it much.

And British refers to the whole of the UK. They don't have Muslim enclaves in other parts of the UK but if they had they'd most likely be even more resentful of them than the English, especially in Scotland and Ulster.

naturalplastic
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07 Nov 2011, 7:08 pm

Tequila wrote:

JakobVirgil wrote:

"British" read English culture does not seem to have the homogenizing force that we have on this side of the pond.

I gotta admit- that is a rather scary thought- Muslim enclaves in Ulster!
Talk about a perfect storm!

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07 Nov 2011, 8:19 pm

Let the Muslims eat cake.

Tequila
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08 Nov 2011, 9:27 am

naturalplastic wrote:

I gotta admit- that is a rather scary thought- Muslim enclaves in Ulster!

I doubt Ulster's unionists will take kindly to mass immigration, especially of Muslims.

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08 Nov 2011, 11:33 am

How much of this is a bid by commercial abbatoirs to get their hands on new business?

A few years ago I used to buy my meat supply directly from the farm--I'd buy half a cow and a lamb and each autumn I would wind up with a freezer full of beef and each spring I'd top it up with lamb. These animals were raised on small farms, they never received an injection that wasn't medically necessary. I knew the farmers, and I knew the facilities where the slaughtering and butchering took place.

Then the provincial government stepped in and decreed that henceforth the sale of meat that was not slaughtered at a licensed slaughterhouse was prohibited. My farmers were left with choice of investing extraordinary amounts of money to license facilities that might slaughter 6 cattle or 30 lambs per year, or stop raising animals for sale. They chose the latter, and I've lost my choice in the market.

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08 Nov 2011, 5:28 pm

Jacoby wrote:

I'm afraid of what these movements in Europe might turn into especially when it's combined with economic devastation and the undemocratic nature of the EU/IMF/etc.

Aren't you an American? Why are you afraid of the idea of Europeans defending their ancestral homelands? I just hope that if "these movements" pick up a head of steam that the US can keep their noses out.

Jacoby wrote:

I think there are legitimate concerns about the Muslim population in Europe however I don't think attacking the practice of their religion is helpful at all.

Yes, and the main legitimate concern for Europeans about the Muslims in Europe is that most of them (Arabs, Berbers, Pakistanis, Afghans etc) are not Europeans.

Tequila wrote:

JakobVirgil wrote:

We have our share of Muslims (and bad attitudes towards them)

Are most of them reasonably laid-back and Westernised though? Integration is often not happening in the UK, but segregation and ghettoisation is

Good. I don't want millions of Asians and Africans "integrating" with us. I don't want we native Britons to be replaced by millions of half-castes.

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08 Nov 2011, 5:57 pm

JakobVirgil wrote:

Tequila wrote:

JakobVirgil wrote:

We have our share of Muslims (and bad attitudes towards them)

Not really, the problem is we can not do nationalism in Europe the way you can in the USA. By that I don't mean right wing fascism but I do mean a patriotic love of country and it's use to forged a shared identity.

It's because our national histories involve several thousand years of constant war with each other, stoking nationalism in Europe just means that poor old Poland gets invaded again and we get a new line of muslim powered ovens. Integrating foreigners really isn't supposed to be the same as burning them to a crisp and using them as compost.

Tequila
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08 Nov 2011, 6:16 pm

DC wrote:

I do mean a patriotic love of country and it's use to forged a shared identity.

Not allowed that. The lefties are forever telling us that nationalism in any form, especially English or British nationalism = racism and gas ovens.

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08 Nov 2011, 6:51 pm

Tequila wrote:

DC wrote:

I do mean a patriotic love of country and it's use to forged a shared identity.

Not allowed that. The lefties are forever telling us that nationalism in any form, especially English or British nationalism = racism and gas ovens.

History does kinda support those reservations...

Tequila
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08 Nov 2011, 7:11 pm

DC wrote:

History does kinda support those reservations...

Parts of history do, yes, but other parts suggest great technological innovation and progress is helped by a mixture of pride in one's country and pride in one's being and work.

The difference is civic v ethnic nationalism.

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08 Nov 2011, 7:25 pm

Tequila wrote:

Quote:

Halal and kosher hit by Dutch ban

Next month the Dutch parliament is expected to approve a ban on halal and kosher methods of slaughtering animals for food.

Those who proposed the ban say it is simply an issue of animal welfare, but it received strong support from the right-wing Party for Freedom.

Many see it as a violation of their religious freedom, and among the Jewish community it is a worrying echo of a similar ban brought in by Hitler.

Interesting.

I remember this from a couple of months ago, the Party for the Animals (link) wanted a ban on ritual slaughtering of animals , a whole circus opened up on this with religious representatives from Jewish and Muslim organisations. Party for Freedom just wants the Muslim practices to be stopped, not the Jewish ones.

As far as I know there wasn't any ban on importing and selling those products so the slaughtering will then happen across the border instead here in The Netherlands, people want them meats proper savvy? :pirat:

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08 Nov 2011, 8:09 pm

I think this is something that would be solved by Britain joining the EU, so that they can pass the Dutch on their tolerance for Kosher killing.

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Tequila
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08 Nov 2011, 8:16 pm

Vexcalibur wrote:

I think this is something that would be solved by Britain joining the EU

Eh? The UK (including Gibraltar) has been an EEC/EC/EU member for nearly 39 years.

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08 Nov 2011, 8:21 pm

or... is it? *suspense music*

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